we are all going to die

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: Wookiep

But what could a dead man do about that?
And if God created us all, knows us all and knows everything we think and do before we were even in planning how could we do wrong?

Well, that's something we could talk about all night. I will sometime, but for now check into the new Testament. If you want a more Jewish perspective check Matthew, Greek? (Gentile or everyone else basically) I recommend Luke or John. Let's just say Jesus wasn't just some "dead guy", scriptures and signs and miracles all aligning with the coming of the Messiah were all proven by these things. It's literally what the 4 gospels are about.

originally posted by: Wookiep

And we talked about the deification of Jesus and I guess originally I wanted to say these clearly advice against that.

Except Jesus is referenced all throughout the old testament, including genesis, and the major prophets. Even the Jews acknowledge this, only difference between them now and Christians is they don't think he's come yet, which was actually foretold to happen as well.

All of this can be scripturally proven, and I will if you're ever curious. Just not tonight, because it's almost time for the Trazadone.

The Messiah will bring universal peace. That clearly hasn't happened.
As Jew he of course knew the prophesies and... given the events that happened after Jesus it seems he was a fraud.

a reply to: Peeple

That's not really accurate, actually. In fact, the devil has dominion over this world, and obviously he's not going to want anyone to obtain peace. The Messiah gives spiritual peace to anyone whom asks, and eternal life. But that has nothing to do with this world. If it did, there would be no point to God's master plan written in Revelation. Everything happens exactly as it's supposed to on the timeline of prophecy, but God doesn't make our choices for us, and there's a reason why.

Did Jesus come to bring peace?

a reply to: Wookiep

The wolf shall dwell with the lamb
....
The Lion shall eat straw like the ox
....
They shall not hurt or destroy
in all my holy mountain
For the Earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord
as the water covers the sea

Isaiah 11

Clearly says "Earth" clearly hasn't happened

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: Wookiep

The wolf shall dwell with the lamb
....
The Lion shall eat straw like the ox
....
They shall not hurt or destroy
in all my holy mountain
For the Earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord
as the water covers the sea

Isaiah 11

Clearly says "Earth" clearly hasn't happened

New heaven new Earth hasn't happened yet either. The wolf and the lamb hasn't happened, some think it's during the 1000 year reign of Christ, but that's all speculation because it hasn't happened yet. As for the knowledge of Christ, it seems from my perspective at least, that pretty much the whole world is at least aware of him.

a reply to: Wookiep

Old testament, the only Lord in the old testament is God. "Full of the knowledge of the Lord" doesn't mean to vaguely having heard that he might exist, every living being will be at peace because we all will be connected with God, like drops returning to the ocean.
And that's after the Messiah, period. Didn't happen, no Messiah yet.
To me personally that doesn't even matter as much as the fact that even that messiah that would fullfill it wouldn't be God.

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: Wookiep

Old testament, the only Lord in the old testament is God. "Full of the knowledge of the Lord" doesn't mean to vaguely having heard that he might exist, every living being will be at peace because we all will be connected with God, like drops returning to the ocean.
And that's after the Messiah, period. Didn't happen, no Messiah yet.
To me personally that doesn't even matter as much as the fact that even that messiah that would fullfill it wouldn't be God.

The scripture doesn't say "As soon as the Messiah comes,all this will happen." It clearly won't happen without the Messiah, the book of Revelation does not happen all at once either, it's tied all the way back to the old testament writings of Daniel and Isaiah, written after the death and resurrection of Jesus. Jesus was instructed to tell his disciples to share the good news of the gospel to the world, and that no-one knows the day or hour of his return, not even Christ himself, only the father. Those were the words of Christ. Clearly, as written in the Revelation, the world will undergo an amount of suffering never seen by mankind before the second coming of Christ. We won't be seeing wolfs lying with lambs etc until all the prophecy is fulfilled.

a reply to: Wookiep

Well maybe we will because the new testament is like the Quoran just... mad ramblings. Revenge phantasies etc
Also it kind of does say "in that day..."

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: Wookiep

Well maybe we will because the new testament is like the Quoran just... mad ramblings. Revenge phantasies etc
Also it kind of does say "in that day..."

2 Peter 3:8 also says this -

and by that same word, the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire, kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men. Beloved, do not let this one thing escape your notice: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day.

And you should really spend some more time in the new testament, it's not mad ramblings and revenge phantasies. The entire premise is to save humanity from judgement. It really is nothing like the Quran.

I should have continued 2 Peter 3:9

The Lord is not slow to fulfill His promise as some understand slowness, but is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish but everyone to come to repentance.…

a reply to: Wookiep

Peter is new testament too so from my point of view... nope
Look I don't really care everybody may believe as they wish, I'm mostly using this conversation as test for... stuff. And you're helpful, thank you. But also: I won't change my mind.

To me it sounds like a plan to destroy mankind. And that wouldn't be really surprising, right? I mean you were the one who said you understood how sad and disappointed God was, wasn't it?
And here we are, going back to the first two commandments and everybody praying to and worshipping Jesus instead of him.

Anyway, ok.. I'm off to bed. At the very least I appreciate the talk. Most on ATS won't even have it from my experience. I also apologize for slightly referencing Revelation, I really try not to do that, but I kept it vague and general. I don't like to "predict" anything from it or assume some things mean certain things and get it all wrong. I really stay away from equating certain parts of the vision to things happening at this present time.

I got 10,000 rounds of .556, and 40 years of military practice...I will not be the first...just saying...lol

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: Wookiep

Peter is new testament too so from my point of view... nope
Look I don't really care everybody may believe as they wish, I'm mostly using this conversation as test for... stuff. And you're helpful, thank you. But also: I won't change my mind.

To me it sounds like a plan to destroy mankind. And that wouldn't be really surprising, right? I mean you were the one who said you understood how sad and disappointed God was, wasn't it?
And here we are, going back to the first two commandments and everybody praying to and worshipping Jesus instead of him.

I see what you're saying, but the Messiah is real and appointed by God the father as a bridge for human beings to know him personally. As stated, at the appointed time, it all happened in complete line of the scriptures and at a later time I will show you all the proof you need. Christ himself performed countless miracles/healing/raising of the dead all prophesied about in the old testament. Everything from how he was conceived, who conceived him, where he was born, John the baptist, where his parents fled to and why, to the wise men, to the miracles and his death and resurrection were all prophesied before he was born. Before Christ, a prophet or priest were only in direct communication with God. Christ is the bridge to him. If anything regarding this topic, I believe it causes God great pain that people reject the gift he gave humanity. Ezekiel taught me a lot too. But ok ok... I'm leaving now lol goodnight.

originally posted by: Wookiep

I see what you're saying, but the Messiah is real and appointed by God the father as a bridge for human beings to know him personally. As stated, at the appointed time, it all happened in complete line of the scriptures and at a later time I will show you all the proof you need. Christ himself performed countless miracles/healing/raising of the dead all prophesied about in the old testament. Everything from how he was conceived, who conceived him, where he was born, John the baptist, where his parents fled to and why, to the wise men, to the miracles and his death and resurrection were all prophesied before he was born. Before Christ, a prophet or priest were only in direct communication with God. Christ is the bridge to him. If anything regarding this topic, I believe it causes God great pain that people reject the gift he gave humanity. Ezekiel taught me a lot too. But ok ok... I'm leaving now lol goodnight.

In the end we humans only having a very short time on earth and ALL believe that EVERYTHING will happen within our lifetime. The Rapture, the return of Christ, comet destruction, super volcano, aliens, climate destruction, nuclear wasteland, Bio destruction, AI destruction etc etc and in 100 years we are all dead and everything is still here, what say you?

"You" as in everyone that says all this crap is right around the corner. Our lives are a millisecond to everything around us that counts in 1000s or millions of years.

"We are all going to die"

Well, yes and no.

All bodies will die.

None of the souls will die.

and that no-one knows the day or hour of his return, not even Christ himself,

I don't usually ask this, but .. do you have a source for this claim?

I just read Matthew 24 from King James Version bible, and -nowhere- did it say 'not even Christ himself'.

Do you know what 'Christ' means, by the way? It means 'The Oiled One', according to my research. So why switch from calling Him 'Jesus' to calling Him 'The Oiled One'? So 'Christ himself' doesn't know, but Jesus does?

How could a level three entity with 2000+ years of more XP not have unlocked the 'foreseeing the future' ability? Angels might not know, sure, they're basically 'lowly pawns' from this perspective, and 'no man' knows, which is a given, since people rarely know anything substancial about such solar system spiritual matters anyway - but that Jesus himself - sorry, The Oiled One himself wouldn't be able to know?

Is this even hinted in scripture, or did you just come up with this 'scientific fact' all by yourself?