Not many are denying ignorance

It does not seem like many people here care about the truth of an ancient civilization(this is not a rant, rather an observation) there is so much proof of an advanced civilization in the past, but this myopia is still prevalent, through even these forums, where the motto is deny ignorance mind you, that there is no evidence or proof.

What do you mean there is no evidence or proof? Underwater Pyramids? Giza Pyramids? Nazca lines? Electroplating in Egypt. And all that evidence I have collated for the vedic civilization from ancient spectrometers to solar-powered ion engines to quantum and particle physics.

How do you suppose the ancient Egyptians were electroplating and building Pyramids? How do you suppose the Incans were able to draw hundreds of miles of lines, that can only be seen from a high aerial perspective. How, do you suppose the ancient Indians calculated the exact age of the Earth? How do you suppose Indian scientists are building new materials from ancient Sanskrit texts?

To me it seems so obvious, but it dumbfounds me, that so many would ignore this. So, I ask, why are you ignoring this and be honest, do you care an iota about the "truth"?

[edit on 27-2-2005 by Indigo_Child]

Perhaps the school system is to blame they have forgotten how to keep the young interested in ancient civilization and has made it a boring topic of something long gone and death.

I for one find the ancient civilizations fascinating perhaps I should start visiting the ancient & lost civilizations thread.

History needs to be rewritten at times, so that cradles of civilization such as Mesopotamia and Persia can be forgotten, to be villified as part of an "axis of evil" for the self-serving purposes of corrupt warmongers.

Originally posted by marg6043
Perhaps the school system is to blame they have forgotten how to keep the young interested in ancient civilization and has made it a boring topic of something long gone and death.

I for one find the ancient civilizations fascinating perhaps I should start visiting the ancient & lost civilizations thread.

Yes, I think the schooling system is to blame for a lot of inadequacies in critical thinking abilities of todays generation. However, I do understand, that not everyone would be fascinated with ancient cultures. However, when there is such abundances of proofs and so much of it throughout a multitude of ancient cultures, of an advanced society on Earth, should that not affect us in the slightest?

At the very least, shouldn't we be challenging the history we are taught about the origins of man and civilization? On the contrary, some here, who have been exposed to this information, still maintain they did not exist? What kind of blindness is that?

I think you make some valid and critical points, Indigo_Child.

I also think what one does need to keep in mind is that History is taught based on written historical record. As such, exploring and discussing possible civilizations that preceded those ancient cultures, that wrote down and chronicled their social, political, and military exploits, can be hair-raising to some, befuddling to others, and quite intersting for the few.

Its hard to try and imagine the social and political or any other facet of those pre-ancient civilizations when there is little to no real written recorded verifiable information to be found or had on them.

Personally though, I do not think it is all entirely a case of "denying ignorance" when you have written recorded History versus unwritten semi-hypothetical, semi-unrecorded history.

Interesting stuff, to me, nonetheless.




seekerof

[edit on 27-2-2005 by Seekerof]

Also you have to understand that with so much debate between historical archeology and religious rights to discredit anything that is unearth in the name of bible creation myth, it makes difficult for people to understand and actually get pleasure on new discoveries because is always a religious propaganda that is ready to discredit anything that does not fit their agendas.

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
It does not seem like many people here care about the truth of an ancient civilization(this is not a rant, rather an observation) there is so much proof of an advanced civilization in the past, but this myopia is still prevalent

This is merely a failure on your part to recognize your own ignorance on the matter. I seem to recall a saying about beams and motes that would apply here.

I understand what you're saying Indigo Child.

I think there is an underlying barrier many people have in general with the idea that our ancestors could have been equal or greater in intellect then we are. I think that barrier clouds their judgment. Maybe that barrier is a reflection of an innate inferiority complex so common to the human condition. Or maybe it's just religious, I dunno.

They hold true to the idea that the evidence isn't in fact evidence. They refute it in ways that contradict how they themselves formulate evidence in other posts.

Or they just say stuff like this and leave it at that:

This is merely a failure on your part to recognize your own ignorance on the matter.

[edit on 112828p://27u27 by Lucid Lunacy]

Originally posted by MaskedAvatar
History needs to be rewritten at times, so that cradles of civilization such as Mesopotamia and Persia can be forgotten, to be villified as part of an "axis of evil" for the self-serving purposes of corrupt warmongers.

Bravo Masked Avatar, you continue to amaze me in your ability to work in anti-Bush rants regardless of the topic. No doubt if the sun goes Nova the last post on this board would you blaming the Bush administration.

Back on topic:

Historical studies will always be neglected IMHO as they lack the spark of excitement that most people crave. Once you get past the more sensationalistic aspect of say Alien's creating the pyramids or as Marg, put it the religious context part of it, most people lose interest. People interested in the historical context of issues are few and far between. Several post I have made on historical perspectives have gone ignored because it simply does not interest people.

For example: A while back I posted a synopsis and link to a paper Condi Rice wrote as a fellow at the Hoover Institute on the Stanford University campus. It basically outlined the whole neo-con agenda years before she or Bush came to power. Yet it was basically ignored. Not even those in this thread had a comment. Why? Historical issues are dull compared to current controversies.

[edit on 2/27/05 by FredT]

Indigo_Child wrote
"Not many are denying ignorance"

Two Words:


Kali Yuga

Originally posted by Nygdan

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
It does not seem like many people here care about the truth of an ancient civilization(this is not a rant, rather an observation) there is so much proof of an advanced civilization in the past, but this myopia is still prevalent

This is merely a failure on your part to recognize your own ignorance on the matter. I seem to recall a saying about beams and motes that would apply here.

exactly. the clueless remain blissfuly unaware of their own ignorance.



Far too many here also suffer from Pierre Salinger Syndrome.





[edit on 27-2-2005 by HowardRoark]

Originally posted by FredT

Originally posted by MaskedAvatar
History needs to be rewritten at times, so that cradles of civilization such as Mesopotamia and Persia can be forgotten, to be villified as part of an "axis of evil" for the self-serving purposes of corrupt warmongers.

Bravo Masked Avatar, you continue to amaze me in your ability to work in anti-Bush rants regardless of the topic. No doubt if the sun goes Nova the last post on this board would you blaming the Bush administration.

LMAO.

Back on topic:

Originally posted by FredT]
For example: A while back I posted a synopsis and link to a paper Condi Rice wrote as a fellow at the Hoover Institute on the Stanford University campus. It basically outlined the whole neo-con agenda years before she or Bush came to power. Yet it was basically ignored. Not even those in this thread had a comment.

For what it's worth FredT ill read and comment in that thread if you throw the link my way.

Why? Historical issues are dull compared to current controversies.

That's a very good point and probably a big part of the answer you were looking for Indigo Child. I see and im sure you see, the relevance this topic has to modern culture. Perhaps others just see this as an overly sensualized history lesson. Perhaps you should create a new thread which really elucidates how this subject is applicable and of importance to modern civilization. Although I would not be surpised if you already tried

Originally posted by HowardRoark

exactly. the clueless remain blissfuly unaware of their own ignorance.

Far too many here also suffer from Pierre Salinger Syndrome.

Considering the context this was aimed at Indigo Child and you most likely meant it for others who agree there is evidence to support the claim that there was ancient advanced civilizations.

I read the links and in a nutshell this is what you're saying about us:

You are incompetent.

You have a tendency to believe that everything you read on the Internet is true.

If you actually read the posts with all the research Indigo Child has gathered on this subject you would know she doesn't believe everything she reads on the internet. Second, calling a person incompetent without backing it up is rather insulting and ultimately puts your own intellectual integrity on the line.

I also don't believe everything I read on the internet. I don't even believe in the word believe You can play the skeptic for the sake of being a skeptic, whatever. Do you think you can at least add a little more substance to your posts though?


[edit on 112828p://27u24 by Lucid Lunacy]

Yes, I agree, it does seem like this is more about religion. Perhaps, knowing that civilisation was advanced in the past or entertaining the theory of cycles of civilization is conceding too much to the eastern belief systems.

And Lucid Lunacy, yes, the kind of inflammatory and irresponsible comments made by Nygdan and Howard, is the kind of ignorance I am talking about. As you said, they will make comments like that and leave it at that. What is that? A self defence mechanism? Come on folks, grow up.

If you can debunk the evidence, then do so, make an argument, make your points, write long posts explaining your position. Do something constructive. And if you can't do that? Ask yourself, why are you here?

We can begin with a simple question:

How did the Incans draw the the Nazca lines, when they did not have the technology of flight?

[edit on 27-2-2005 by Indigo_Child]

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
We can begin with a simple question:

How did the Incans draw the the Nazca lines, when they did not have the technology of flight?

I think the more interesting question is why.

I could take a piece of paper and draw out a hummingbird. I could mark key points (angles and whatnot) with a dot. I would measure all the lines in length in inches. Then, to draw it on the ground, I would scale out the length so that five inches equaled five yards, or five hundred yards. I could mark the angles on the ground with stones, instead of dots. Then I could actually draw the thing.

But why would I do that? I dunno. Maybe it's a picture of a god. Maybe it's in honor of the hummingbird spirit. Maybe I'm bored.

But it does seem strange - mainly because, from the ground, I'd never see it.

Originally posted by quango

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
We can begin with a simple question:

How did the Incans draw the the Nazca lines, when they did not have the technology of flight?

I think the more interesting question is why.

I could take a piece of paper and draw out a hummingbird. I could mark key points (angles and whatnot) with a dot. I would measure all the lines in length in inches. Then, to draw it on the ground, I would scale out the length so that five inches equaled five yards, or five hundred yards. I could mark the angles on the ground with stones, instead of dots. Then I could actually draw the thing.

But why would I do that? I dunno. Maybe it's a picture of a god. Maybe it's in honor of the hummingbird spirit. Maybe I'm bored.

But it does seem strange - mainly because, from the ground, I'd never see it.

Yes, why is actually more important, but if this culture is quite primitive, don't you think there would be some irregularities and inconsistencies in the shape, considering you are using stone tools to etch these lines and only get one shot. And to do this over miles upon miles over mountainous terrain, without any maps, and the most of all, you can't actually see what you're doing. Some of those lines resemble giant run ways. I just don't think that is possible. The probability of error using such a technique would be too great, that there is bound to be an error.

To appreciate what an amazing feat of engineering this is:







To create that spider, without seeing what you are doing, over miles, and make it a perfect even shape. There is most definitely more technology involved than stones and strings.

[edit on 28-2-2005 by Indigo_Child]

the hummingbird, the spider,
they are constellations
the incans had balloons, remember
still, I know very well that these ancient astronomically inspired works are from long before Incas, Pharaohs, mayans, etc.
and also know that the precision and accuracy of their creation is hard to believe, if it wasn't right there for all to see............

Amazingly of course the evidence for thise high tech paradises fails to materialise.

Incas, using ballons were able to mark out where they wanted their markings to go, with an accurate measuring system you can create patterns on the ground, send up a guy in a ballon to check and make alterations based on his reports until happy. Wow, ive just made the Nazca lines without flying saucers, telepathy or floating spleens.

Pyramids around the world, often built with great accuracy!
Naturally the local inhabitants of the region were far to stupid to do this, were not patient and willing to work for years to achieve the perfection they felt to be necessary. Slave labour naturally couldnt be used to haul huge blocks anywhere.

No folk the simple fact is that ancient people were stupid, they were incapeable of creating the amazing structures we see today by themselves,
instead hyper advanced civilisations must be created to justify their existance.

Deny Ignorance: Give ancient civilisations the credit due to them

Uncle Joe I am not entirely sure if I understood what you meant. It's probably me though. It's 4:38 am here and I havn't gone to sleep yet. I wasn't sure which points were sarcasm and which ones reflected your actual viewpoint?

Originally posted by Uncle Joe
No folk the simple fact is that ancient people were stupid, they were incapeable of creating the amazing structures we see today by themselves,
instead hyper advanced civilisations must be created to justify their existance.

It seems you are implying that Indigo Child is suggesting the Incas civilization wasn't intellectually capable of creating the amazing feats and thus had outside influence (extra-terrestrial?). I think she means the opposite. I think she is advocating the Incas themselves were advanced...not that those Nazca Lines were created by aliens and what not. Or at the least an even more ancient and advanced civilization (but still human) created the Nazca lines.

Deny Ignorance: Give ancient civilisations the credit due to them

Believing the Incas created those lines, believing they were advanced, is giving them a great deal of credit I would think

I probably shouldn't be speaking for someone else though hehe. Nor should I post when I am barely cognitive. I hope I didn't completely misinterpret your post Uncle Joe.

[edit on 072828p://28u16 by Lucid Lunacy]

I think there are 2 Sides to this, I think that many people think the Ancient Civilizations had less technology than they had But I do beleive they had more then we know but not close to what you are giving the credit for, Case in point The Ancient Battery found in Iraq ( I think). But honestly, most of this stuff was all math. and could be done with crude tools and a great Knowledge of Math. (Not the ION Stuff Can you please put some links with hard facts to these I am very much interested) With Basic measurements you can create the inca shapes. Using basic tools, similar ancients used for large Sculpture, based on smaller versions. ( Look into how Mount Rushmore was mathed out (not perfectly for that matter ))

On the fatc of people dening Ignornace. People will always want Physical proof. Pyramids are not examples of high Technology , just a high understanding of math and enginering and by thinking this must be some sort of super technology I think you are taking credit away from how smart they really were. Creating a kinda Bunk. Kinda of like the UFO people and how 75% of the people who are crazy (Not calling you that) dubunk the 25% of people who actually had a real experince. (That wasnt the best analogy) But Hopefully you'll get my point.

Please provide some links to solar-powered ion engines to quantum and particle physics based on Ancient Technology.. thanks