Garden Of Elohiym

Reading from Bere’shiyth [Beginnings], in the book of ADAM V’CHUAH RI’SHON [1 Adam and Eve] --

It was the morning after the fortieth day of their being expelled from the Gan Eden and were dwelling in a cave that YAHUAH had given them. Adam and Chuah [Eve] had fasted those first forty days in this outside world and ElOHIYM had then given them the first food and water from the outside world. Adam and Eve had then become sickened and near death from the food of this world because of a substance change of their bodies from that of which they had in the Gan Eden.

As I read that, it confirmed my thoughts of many years ago when as a younger man I believed that the Garden of Eden was not of this world but was a celestial garden planted by ELOHIYM and set upon this earth. But then I had always retracted that thought with the understanding that Adam was formed from this earth and then placed in the Gan Eden. I had always gone back to Adam being terrestrial and so the Gan Eden was terrestrial but now have an altogether different belief. I now am believing that the Garden of Adam was not of this earth and that it is a celestial substance.

I now read where there was indeed a substance change in the bodies of Adam and Eve as they came out of the Garden. My question is now revisited as to whether Adam was formed from this terrestrial earth and then substance changed to be placed in the Garden. Eve was taken from the substance of Adam but what does this actually mean?

According to this account Eve also had a substance change as she left the Garden so I assume that since she was formed of Adam in the garden that she too was not of terrestrial substance. I have read of no tradition that tells me Adam and Eve were not terrestrial except this account, but then how do we account for Revelation which tells that this tree of life that was in the Gan Eden of Adam, is now found in the New Jerusalem [Kingdom of Heaven]?

Bere'shiyth Chapter 64 says that ELOHIYM sent His angel to assist Adam and Eve and that the angel told Adam and Eve - “strengthen your bodies for you are now animal flesh and cannot subsist without food and drink.” - Could this mean that Adam and Eve were eating from the tree of life while in the Garden and that death came from being forbidden that tree of life?

Chapter 65:7,8 “Then Adam and Chuah came back into the cave sorrowful and crying because of the alteration of their bodies. And they both knew from that hour that they were altered beings, that all hope of returning to the garden was now lost and they could not enter it. For that now their bodies had strange functions and all flesh that requires food and drink for its existence, cannot be in the garden.”

Does this weaken the Genesis account?

The forgotten books of Adam and Eve, seem to agree, chapter 3

2 Then God the Lord said unto Adam, "When thou wast under subjection to Me, thou hadst a bright nature within thee, and for that reason couldst thou see things afar off. But after thy transgression thy bright nature was withdrawn from thee; and it was not left to thee to see things afar off, but only near at hand; after the ability of the flesh; for it is brutish."

www.sacred-texts.com...

a reply to: Seede

I have always interpolated God not creating anything to
die. We had eternal life and a relationship with God that
would have sent man with his guidance. On adventures to
fill the empty cosmos. The biggest flaw with the Drake
equation?

The Drake Equation is an attempt to encapsulate all the variables that would be relevant to establishing the number of intelligent civilizations that existed in the Milky Way galaxy and which were broadcasting radio signals at this particular point in time. The Drake Equation is composed of seven terms.

It is absolutely time relative. Meaning the beginning of life
existing thru out the universe, to the best of our knowledge.
May have originated right here on earth. Where it just so
happens there exists a book. That tells us of a supreme being.
Where-in we read the first three words.

IN THE BEGINNING

SnF

a reply to: Seede

It's funny I was JUST having this conversation with a friend earlier today.

IMHO, the entire story of Adam & Eve was an allegory for the introduction of free will amongst God's ( Yahweh's ) human creation because otherwise humanity had no catalyst in order to evolve spiritually. The garden of Eden was a paradise symbolizing how beautiful and simple life without free will was. There was no suffering because there was no duality. But with that, there was no progress for 3rd density souls to ascend and grow towards richer self realization.

Therefore, it doesn't really matter where this occurred in the grand scheme of things. But I won't deny that it's not interesting to speculate!

a reply to: randyvs

It is absolutely time relative. Meaning the beginning of life
existing thru out the universe, to the best of our knowledge.
May have originated right here on earth. Where it just so
happens there exists a book. That tells us of a supreme being.
Where-in we read the first three words.
IN THE BEGINNING

Quite coincidental that you should write that.
The Torah was translated for king Talmi and the sages who translated Torah for Ptolemy saw a number of verses that could cause harm to his understanding. In that the sages then changed "In the beginning God created" which could lead to "In the beginning" to be the name of the Creator. they changed the verse to God created in the beginning for the king's understanding. Actually it took nothing away from the book.

But this is a little more involved and I wonder if it takes something away from Genesis or does it enlighten Genesis?

a reply to: AgarthaSeed

IMHO, the entire story of Adam & Eve was an allegory for the introduction of free will amongst God's ( Yahweh's ) human creation because otherwise humanity had no catalyst in order to evolve spiritually. The garden of Eden was a paradise symbolizing how beautiful and simple life without free will was. There was no suffering because there was no duality. But with that, there was no progress for 3rd density souls to ascend and grow towards richer self realization.

If the Adam and Eve story is an allegory then I wonder why it is not accepted by Torah as allegory? The requirements are two fold primarily. It must be fictional and it must have a story line plot of characters.

The garden of Eden has its beginnings in the book of Genesis and its finish in Revelation. Now that encompasses 66 books of various authors and hundreds of characters and centuries of time between the first and last portion of the story. But one very important part of your reasoning is that this story is not simply one author or one era. How could it then be an allegory and who is the author of this allegory?

How then can a person read a copy of an unknown autograph which is well over twenty three hundred years and qualify that as an allegory? I'm fishing of course.

a reply to: Seede

I'm a little lost with your response. First, when you say "Torah" doesn't accept it as an allegory, what do you mean? Because many Rabbi's and Jewish encyclopedias do consider Adam and Eve to be allegorical.

Also, how does the garden of eden span throughout all 66 books of The Bible? Simply because it's mentioned in a few books outside of Genesis? That doesn't prove it's literally true, even to the biblical authors.

On a side note, its a common misconception that Jesus speaks of Adam & Eve in the gospels. He doesn't. In Luke, Jesus says "the blood of Abel". But that's about as close as he gets.

"How could this be an allegory?"

Because it uses a literary device to purvey a deeper spiritual truth ( free will manifestations ). Let's not forget that this was an oral tradition passed down for many generations before it was written down. Language doesn't always fit like a glove. It's quite possible that someone trying to explain "the introduction of free will and duality" didn't have the words for that and instead explained it as "they ate from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil."

"Who is the author of this allegory?"

Who knows! Nobody walking this planet can say they know the answer to that with confidence. If you view it as an actual allegory then the author really doesn't matter.

My question to you is this: Is it that hard to believe that people can pass down oral traditions for many generations and have them misinterpreted by folks? Perhaps intentionally?

a reply to: Seede

But this is a little more involved and I wonder if it takes something away from Genesis or does it enlighten Genesis?

The first thing I always keep in mind is however subtle it may
seem. To consider that an all powerful supreme Intelligence,
life giving Creator might have some linguistic complications
getting his point across? Nah it makes more sense that the
message is always clear either way. Especially when we familiarize
ourselves with the nature of God. ( If we know our own Father)
Misinterpretations don't really mean a damn thing when you
know what someone is saying. There is no such thing as story
or any communication that can't be knit picked to make it look
ridiculous and complete nonsense. So if in the beginning is what I
read between those binders? Wild horses couldn't drag me away.
Just my thoughts tho.

a reply to: Seede

The book of Adam and Eve is a gnostic book of false and misleading lies. One of the reasons why it is not in the bible.

A good book to read for entertainment purposes only.

a reply to: AgarthaSeed

I'm a little lost with your response. First, when you say "Torah" doesn't accept it as an allegory, what do you mean? Because many Rabbi's and Jewish encyclopedias do consider Adam and Eve to be allegorical.

What I meant by that is that the Jewish Timeline Encyclopedia by Mattis Kantor relates the history by dates and events in chronological order. This account starts with creation of both this world and Adam as the first day and as the year 3760 bce. Therefore the Jewish Timeline Encyclopedia does not regard Adam as a allegory.

Adam and Eve is the accepted date of creation in almost all Hebrew and Judaic literature. Noah was born in the year of 1058 after the creation of Adam and in the civil year of 2705 bce. That is according to Judaic time line. All of the Tanakh dates originate from Adam and Eve. We then move into the NT and in Luke 3:23-38 we see the very same time line in chronological order. All of Judaic history is dated from the creation of Adam.

But then perhaps that is not what you mean. Perhaps you are talking about the Garden of Eden. If you are then it cannot fit the allegory requirements. To be an allegory the story must be fictional as well as the characters in the story must be fictional. According to the Tanakh Adam is not fictional or if he is fictional then the entire Tanakh is fictional because Adam is the central character of the entire Tanakh and NT.

In other words you cannot have a true character in a fictional garden and label it as allegory. It simply does not fit as an allegory. Then we have another problem and that is the book of Revelation. If the Gan Eden is fiction in Genesis then is Gan Eden fiction in Revelation 22:2? Or is Genesis fiction and Revelation true?

Gen 3:22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
Gen 3:23 Therefore the LORD God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken.
Gen 3:24 So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.

Rev 22:1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
Rev 22:2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.

a reply to: DeathSlayer

The book of Adam and Eve is a gnostic book of false and misleading lies. One of the reasons why it is not in the bible. A good book to read for entertainment purposes only.

Not quite right. This 1st book of Bere'shiyth is a known work and written under Ezra [Ezra Revi'ly (4 Ezra) 14:38-47] - The work is not Gnostic and is regarded scripture by Hebrew authority. There are some books that are written as Adam, and Eve but this work is regarded as the Beginning or Bere'shiyth. The oldest rendition came from the Ethiopian bible which is the oldest bible known in this world and translated from Ethiopic to German by Ernest Trumpp and then to English by Soloman Cesar Malan. It comes down to the layman through R.H. Charles in his Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament in 1913.

Pseudepigrapha is not necessarily false literature although it can be false literature by your own judgment. If you want to believe that it is not true then it is not true to you. You are correct that it is not qualified to enter the Tanakh but only because the MSS copy was not found in Hebrew. The first and foremost qualification of Tanakh MSS was that the autographs or copies of the autographs must be Hebrew. Nevertheless this is not Gnostic work.

Enoch one was also MSS from Ethiopia and was accepted by the early Christians as additional NT literature. Although it also was not accepted as biblical literature it was not only accepted but was taught in combination with the NT. Enoch 1,2,3 is once again being taught in conjunction to both the Tanakh and the New Testament. Enoch is also rejected by many denominations as false and misleading work.

a reply to: Seede

My personal belief is that Adam and Eve always had a physical body made of flesh (from dust of the earth), but they didn't need blood for life. After the fall, their bodies transformed and blood was needed to keep the flesh alive. Read Leviticus 17 and Deuteronomy 12. I believe this is also why it was so important for Jesus Christ to shed his blood to make atonement for their sins and why only a blood sacrifice was acceptable in the Old Testament as opposed to Cain's sacrifice which God did not find acceptable.

a reply to: Deetermined

a reply to: Seede My personal belief is that Adam and Eve always had a physical body made of flesh (from dust of the earth), but they didn't need blood for life. After the fall, their bodies transformed and blood was needed to keep the flesh alive. Read Leviticus 17 and Deuteronomy 12. I believe this is also why it was so important for Jesus Christ to shed his blood to make atonement for their sins and why only a blood sacrifice was acceptable in the Old Testament as opposed to Cain's sacrifice which God did not find acceptable.

That is a really good thought. I had never imagined such a theory but it does make a lot of sense the more I think about it. It does tie in with the scriptures of 4 Ezra and it makes sense to my interpretation of the Garden. We do know that the garden was planted separately from the creation of the world and we are told, by scripture, that it is now found in the third heaven and in the celestial city of New Jerusalem.

This could explain the belief that Adam and Eve both were contained in a special place [Garden] and did eat of the tree of life while in the garden. The Genesis account tells us that Adam and Eve were allowed to eat of all of the trees in the Garden except for the tree of Knowledge to know evil. It also ties into the Revelation scriptures where flesh and blood are not allowed into the celestial realm. Since Adam and Eve were allowed to eat of the tree of life, that ties in with your theology of which they were not of terrestrial blood and the possibility that Adams entire substance was changed as the Creator put him in the Garden. That agrees with Ezra's account.

Eve was formed in the Garden from Adam's body so Eve is a moot point insofar as substance change in entering the Garden. The point to be made now is that the Creator formed Adam from this terrestrial earth and Adam became a living soul. By this I am led to assume that Adam did have a terrestrial body with his celestial spirit as he was formed but now the question is, what was Adam between given life and placing him in the Garden. Was he a living terrestrial body in a celestial Garden? We are told that flesh and blood cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven but the Garden of Eden was not in the kingdom of heaven when Adam was placed in the Garden.

Another thought that enters into this mix is that this world was perfect and without sin as Adam was formed. The Creator said it was good and the earth was not cursed with death at this time. In fact the death penalty had not been invoked as Adam was placed in the Garden. This means that none of Creation knew what death was at this time. As you have said. if there had been no death created and the scriptures tell us that all life is in the blood, then how could there have been death or for that matter blood?

Much work yet to be done and thank you Deetermined for your input.

a reply to: Seede

As you have mentioned, I believe that Adam was living in a terrestrial body while possessing a celestial soul. While living in the Garden, it appears that God sustained them through the Tree of Life until they (and the earth) were cursed. Once they were cursed, I believe that their blood became their new source for physical life and they were going to have to work the ground themselves to feed and provide nutrients to their bodies without it being provided directly from God.

One thing I always found interesting was the description of Jesus when he appeared before his disciples after his resurrection. We know that he was able to appear and disappear at will, yet there appeared to be a familiar physical description of him too.

Luke 24:36-39

36 And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.

37 But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit.

38 And he said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts?

39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

While the Garden of Eden is described in a similar way as the New Jerusalem, we know that the New Jerusalem has no need for the sun and moon to give it light because God/Jesus is the light thereof.

Revelation 21:23

23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.

While flesh and blood are not capable of entering heaven, I do believe that we will be given a different kind of "flesh" or at least have the ability to manifest ourselves in and out of some kind of physical form much like Jesus did after his resurrection.

a reply to: Deetermined

As you have mentioned, I believe that Adam was living in a terrestrial body while possessing a celestial soul. While living in the Garden, it appears that God sustained them through the Tree of Life until they (and the earth) were cursed. Once they were cursed, I believe that their blood became their new source for physical life and they were going to have to work the ground themselves to feed and provide nutrients to their bodies without it being provided directly from God.

Good Post. I copied that that in your name for my paper on the Garden. Appreciate your thoughts.