Just Dial 911? The Myth of Police Protection

a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

Well stated. Yes, no defense is foolproof. I think that is a very relevant perspective. I often hear talk about preventing all of these "mass killings". And that smells of a zero tolerance mindset. That mindset is not based in reality IMO. There is no 100% safe, anywhere.

Life is a series of risk assessments. Situational awareness and preparation for each situation is key to making the correct decision for yourself at that time in that place. There is no blanket one size fits all solution.

a reply to: Krakatoa

Damn straight it is, risk assessment is the key to the puzzle.

I liken that assessment to my bad back, after talking to many specialists, I reached the conclusion not one size fits all.

What works for me may not work for you, I'm so confused now I'm likely to spend the next few years of my life studying medicine, purely to help me, then if I can help myself I may just be in a position to help others.

a reply to: Krakatoa

Say your confronted face to face with a robber, rapist? Would you rather have a phone in your hand to CALL the police, or a firearm, club, knife, frying pan to defend yourself? That would be faster than you can call the police and wait X amount of minutes for them to get to you....

Think about it. Phone to call the police...or immediately defend yourself, family or another. There aren't enough police to respond instantaneously to you and a bad guy in your face RIGHT NOW.

a reply to: Krakatoa

The cops in Texas have telegraphed for the last 20 years that your safety is your responsibility, not theirs.

I think the mistake pro-2nd Amendment people make is assuming that Leftists trying to grab guns expect the cops to look after people. The truth is the Leftists don't care about the safety of General Population of law abiding people. Their intent is to see that all of GP is at risk from the criminals with the idea that once that is done, GP will suddenly demand attention be paid to the criminal class and will vote in more aid and welfare benefits to the criminal class.

a reply to: Krakatoa


Excellent post and analysis, wish I could give more stars and flags

Police have no duty to protect any specific citizen (as you stated), and the Constitution never specifies the necessity of such since it is assumed people will conduct their own policing and protection. IMO, this is quite appropriate and well in line with the ideals of the founders and virtues of individualism

Great post

This highlights two important issues, to me.

First is that people who want to remove any class of firearm need to read your OP twice. We need every advantage over criminals we can get, since we can not and should not expect government assistant in fending them off.

Second is the people/entities who attempt to discourage or otherwise obscure the common Citizen's right to make an arrest for any felony you know for certain has been committed or misdemeanor offense committed in his/her presence or other breach of the peace. Some states require the offense be a felony.

You not only have the right to protect yourself, but you also have the right (both common law and by many state statutes) to arrest such an individual at your discretion. Note: This is an excellent defense in localities that do not have a stand your ground law, as you may use proportional and reasonable force to effect your arrest.

a reply to: Krakatoa

You are correct sir!

S&F for you.

And this pretty much boils down to common sense. The police can't be everywhere.

They are here to enforce laws, investigate and try to find that guy that killed you, maybe catch thieves. Though you do have the extremely lucky cases where the police made it in the nick of time to save someone.

If you think that the cops will always come to your rescue you are dreaming.

If you need a quick police response, tell the 911 operator that you had to shoot a cop because he was attacking someone. You'll have a couple of squad cars and an ambulance there before you hang up the phone.

a reply to: Krakatoa

Very true. Even in places with very good police, who do all they can to try and protect, and to stop crime, they can't be there fast enough, most of the time. Far better to be able to protect yourself and your family.

originally posted by: intrptr

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: intrptr

I have a dog.
Golden retriever but he barks at just about everything.

So how do you know its an actual threat or not?

The preferred guard dog sits quietly until the intruder is all the way in the house, then goes 'nuts'..

Or, if the dog is outside, does what ours did, and takes a chunk out of a would-be intruder! We never heard a thing; didn't know till we found a broken window the next morning! The dog got a treat.

Well just remember when you call 911 you're summoning armed men, at least half of which take steroids and at least half of which have committed criminal acts, and at least half of which are looking for a thrill and a reason to go pew-pew, and they are covered from legal recourse by qualified immunity, and of course they have no duty to protect any individual.

It might be a better idea to call the fire department because that is staffed by brave people who run into burning buildings, not cowards who cover up crimes that each other commit.

Just an opinion...based on real events.

a reply to: Phage

A dog is a great place to start!

My little rat terrier barks at anything within, like yours, 50 yards. I've yet to discover a false alarm. There's always something going on...usually benign, but a few occassions it might not have been so benign if he hadn't sounded the alarm.

A barking dog usually means that the home owner is going to be at least somewhat aware. Burglars and such don't like aware folks...makes their jobs harder.

I ignored his barking just last week, and lost several hundred dollars worth of tools. Needless to say, lesson learned...

originally posted by: LadyGreenEyes

originally posted by: intrptr

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: intrptr

I have a dog.
Golden retriever but he barks at just about everything.

So how do you know its an actual threat or not?

The preferred guard dog sits quietly until the intruder is all the way in the house, then goes 'nuts'..

Or, if the dog is outside, does what ours did, and takes a chunk out of a would-be intruder! We never heard a thing; didn't know till we found a broken window the next morning! The dog got a treat.

My friends German Shepard held a would be burglar in 'detention' until we got home. We heard her barking in the back yard, that come here and see bark. She was 'guarding' a cowering figure in the corner of the yard, his pants were shredded and bloody in the seat.

He later recounted that he climbed the fence to break in but when Helga surprised him he ran for the fence and as he tried to climb it she grabbed his butt, preventing him from jumping back over the fence and leaving. Each time he tried to turn and climb the fence she 'prevented' him with a bite hold. He finally gave up and cowered in the corner where we found him, guarded by Helga wagging her tail.

That was precious.

originally posted by: intrptr

originally posted by: LadyGreenEyes

originally posted by: intrptr

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: intrptr

I have a dog.
Golden retriever but he barks at just about everything.

So how do you know its an actual threat or not?

The preferred guard dog sits quietly until the intruder is all the way in the house, then goes 'nuts'..

Or, if the dog is outside, does what ours did, and takes a chunk out of a would-be intruder! We never heard a thing; didn't know till we found a broken window the next morning! The dog got a treat.

My friends German Shepard held a would be burglar in 'detention' until we got home. We heard her barking in the back yard, that come here and see bark. She was 'guarding' a cowering figure in the corner of the yard, his pants were shredded and bloody in the seat.

He later recounted that he climbed the fence to break in but when Helga surprised him he ran for the fence and as he tried to climb it she grabbed his butt, preventing him from jumping back over the fence and leaving. Each time he tried to turn and climb the fence she 'prevented' him with a bite hold. He finally gave up and cowered in the corner where we found him, guarded by Helga wagging her tail.

That was precious.

Now that's awesome!! Good dog! With ours, I am pretty sure the whole thing was a scam, from an alarm company. The day after the story ran in the paper )they ran various police reports), a guy came around selling alarm systems. That, I could understand, but he screwed up. He said he understood we'd had an attempted burglary, but the cops reported it as vandalism, since nothing was done but the broken window. I told him we already had an alarm system. He said he didn't see a sign, and I said we didn't need a sign. He asked about the system, so I opened the door a hair farther, and showed him. The look on his face was priceless, and he looked as though he now understood what had happened. Assuming, from the dog's somewhat sheepish look that morning, that she took a chunk out of whoever was in the yard. I really miss that dog!!

originally posted by: seagull
A dog is a great place to start!

Agree....when you are home.

Sadly, not necessarily a good thing when you're not home.
Some years ago, a co-worker had their home invaded.
They kicked and injured their German shepherd.
Guess they're lucky the creeps didn't shoot the dog.

ETA
Locking doors and windows is also a good start...including the garage. Keep your car locked....and don't put valuables in plain sight.

a reply to: DontTreadOnMe

Still a good place to start, just don't stop there, you're right, dogs should be an alarm, not a defense.

The window, and doors, are weak links to any house, as should be obvious to even me... When we put the new windows in last summer we added security bolts to the bottoms of the windows...won't keep someone from breaking the glass, obviously, but windows breaking make noise. Also, don't block the windows with shrubs, make 'em break in where the whole world can see 'em, or keep the bushes or other plants below the level of the window.

The doors too, we went a bit further in trying to make 'em more secure. They're solid core doors, with extra long screws into the frame, and dead bolt locks. No windows in them, either.

No home, that you'll still want to call a home, can be made 100 percent secure, but there are measures that anyone with a modicum of skills, and a little money (the window bolts cost, if I remember rightly, 25 bucks at home depot), the doors were, of course, a bit more. But you might save a lot of money if you go to a salvage yard for big solid doors.

Get up and get-get-get down,
911 is a joke in your town.