Hiram Abiff is Jesus Christ is Lucifer

I would like to preface this with some of my thoughts.

No matter the teacher, only you can teach yourself based on your experience and perspective. There are NO "teachers" ... you teach yourself based on your perspective. You are the only one who will EVER know YOUR truth.
Those with ears to hear, will hear, and those with eyes to see, will see...

There are MANY teachers but to be their student you must first become your own teacher. If that makes sense to you, perhaps you will figure this out. Verily, I say unto you, he will not forgive the soul the sin by any means, nor the flesh the guilt; for none of those who have worn the flesh will be saved. For do you think that many have found the kingdom of heaven? Blessed is he who has seen himself as a fourth one in heaven!"

"I have given you faith many times; moreover, I have revealed myself to you, James, and you (all) have not known me. Now again, I see you rejoicing many times; and when you are elated at the promise of life, are you yet sad, and do you grieve, when you are instructed in the kingdom? But you, through faith and knowledge, have received life. Therefore, disdain the rejection when you hear it, but when you hear the promise, rejoice the more. Verily, I say unto you, he who will receive life and believe in the kingdom will never leave it, *****not even if the Father wishes to banish him." *****

I realize a lot of scriptures and books/writings from antiquity are either forgeries or fanciful tales. A lot has been done to mask certain truths throughout history.

Which is why I think that "Those with eyes to see, and those with ears to hear." is such an important teaching and observation.

With that being said; I don't really care how legitimate any source I use is TO YOU, or how legitimate it is to mainstream opinion / academics.
The veracity is in what is said and observed / perceived and not in whether or not scholars and academics find it "credible" or heretical.

I'm sure that even Masons will agree that things aren't necessarily taught or explained; they are shown to you and it's up to you to "hear, and see" accordingly. Upon realizing or hearing and seeing, it's up to you to figure out it's meaning(s) and thus you advance; a rather crude explanation but for the most part accurate.

I first starting studying the nag hammadi around 1998, and when I joined ATS here I noticed that not a lot of people were talking about what it contained, primarily because people considered it heretical and "nonsense" and wasn't accepted cannon, or it was written too late to be accurate etc.
But I had previously studied various world religions and there were certain things that I was "Seeing, and Hearing" that started to shift my perception about the state of the world and certain institutions and societies.

There are a lot of very interesting texts in the nag hammadi that paint a completely different picture of Jesus Christ and his ideals and mission.

Gospel of St. Thomas.

(10) Jesus said, "I have cast fire upon the world, and see, I am guarding it until it blazes."

(16) Jesus said, "Men think, perhaps, that it is peace which I have come to cast upon the world. They do not know that it is dissension which I have come to cast upon the earth: fire, sword, and war. For there will be five in a house: three will be against two, and two against three, the father against the son, and the son against the father. And they will stand solitary."

(14) Jesus said to them, "If you fast, you will give rise to sin for yourselves; and if you pray, you will be condemned; and if you give alms, you will do harm to your spirits. When you go into any land and walk about in the districts, if they receive you, eat what they will set before you, and heal the sick among them. For what goes into your mouth will not defile you, but that which issues from your mouth - it is that which will defile you."

For most Christians ... these are very strange things for "their" Jesus Christ to be saying.

Also very strange is the following.

Enlightened afterthought hid herself within Adam. The first ruler wanted to take her from Adam’s side, but enlightened afterthought cannot be apprehended. While darkness pursued her, it did not apprehend her. The first ruler removed part of Adam’s power and created another figure in the form of a female, like the image of afterthought that had appeared to him. He put the part he had taken from the power of the human being into the female creature. It did not happen, however, the way Moses said: Adam’s rib.

As for me, I appeared in the form of an eagle on the tree of knowledge, which is the afterthought of the pure enlightened forethought, that I might teach the human beings and awaken them from the depth of sleep. For the two of them were fallen and realized that they were naked. Afterthought appeared to them as light and awakened their minds.

Whoa... wait a minute... WHO appeared on the tree of knowledge? Lucifer? or "The Savior?" ... or "Both?" ...

When Yaldabaoth realized that the humans had withdrawn from him, he cursed his earth. He found the woman as she was preparing herself for her husband. He was master over her. And he did not know the mystery that had come into being through the sacred plan. The two of them were afraid to denounce Yaldabaoth. He displayed to his angels the ignorance within him. He threw the humans out of paradise and cloaked them in thick darkness.

The first ruler saw the young woman standing next to Adam and noticed that the enlightened afterthought of life had appeared in her. Yet Yaldabaoth was full of ignorance. So when the forethought of all realized this, she dispatched emissaries, and they stole life out of Eve.

The first ruler defiled Eve and produced in her two sons, a first and a second: Elohim and Yahweh.

Elohim has the face of a bear,
Yahweh has the face of a cat.

One is just, the other is unjust.

He placed Yahweh over fire and wind,
he placed Elohim over water and earth.

He called them by the names Cain and Abel, with a view to deceive.

To this day sexual intercourse has persisted because of the first ruler. He planted sexual desire in the woman who belongs to Adam. Through intercourse the first ruler produced duplicate bodies, and he blew some of his false spirit into them.

He placed these two rulers over the elements so that they might rule over the cave.

When Adam came to know the counterpart of his own foreknowledge, he produced a son like the human child. He called him Seth, after the manner of the heavenly race in the eternal realms. Similarly, the mother sent down her spirit, which is like her and is a copy of what is in the realm of fullness, for she was going to prepare a dwelling place for the eternal realms that would come down.

The human beings were made to drink water of forgetfulness by the first ruler, so that they might not know where they had come from. For a time the seed remained and helped so that when the spirit descends from the holy realms, it may raise up the seed and heal what it lacks, that the entire realm of fullness may be holy and lack nothing.

Apparently I ran out of room on this post, so I'll continue it below

RE: WHO appeared on the tree of knowledge? Lucifer?

You deists are sure a funny bunch. It's like you selective choose what is meaningful to believe based on some superstitious prejudice you never put into words. Let me ask you a question. Do you honestly think God did not know exactly what was going to happen to the apple in the garden with a naked woman prancing about?

a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

The only problem with Lucifer is.....
He never was. Pike was in on this little tidbit of knowledge, which is what made him say this:

The Apocalypse is, to those who receive the nineteenth Degree, the Apothesis of that Sublime Faith which aspires to God alone, and despises all the pomps and works of Lucifer. LUCIFER, the Light-bearer! Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of Darkness! Lucifer, the Son of the Morning! Is it he who bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable blinds feeble, for traditions are full of sensual or selfish Souls ? Doubt it not! Divine Revelations and Inspirations: and Inspiration is not of one Age nor of one Creed. Plato and Philo, also, were inspired. The Apocalypse, indeed, is a book as obscure as the Sohar. It is written hieroglyphically with numbers and images; and the Apostle often appeals to the intelligence of the Initiated. “Let him who hath knowledge, understand! let him who understands, calculate !” he often says, after an allegory or the mention of a number. Saint John, the favorite Apostle, and the Depositary of all the Secrets of the Saviour, therefore did not write to be understood by the multitude.

albertpike.wordpress.com...

So first of all most people are probably asking who Yalt(d)abaoth is .... Well ... according to the "story" Yaldabaoth was created in ignorance, and is ignorant.

He is the GOD from the Old Testament.

He was ignorantly created after "GOD" and the counterpart which "GOD" had created for himself, together made Jesus Christ.
She then went "aside" and created another being without the permission of the "GOD" that created her.

The Apocryphon of John

This gloomy ruler has three names: the first name is Yaldabaoth, the second is Sakla, the third is Samael. He is wicked in his mindlessness that is in him. He said, I am god and there is no other god but me, since he did not know where his own strength had come from.

Now, Sophia, who is the wisdom of afterthought and who constitutes an eternal realm, conceived of a thought from herself, with the conception of the invisible spirit and foreknowledge. She wanted to bring forth something like herself, without the consent of the spirit, who had not given approval, without her partner and without his consideration. The male did not give approval. She did not find her partner, and she considered this without the spirit’s consent and without the knowledge of her partner. Nonetheless, she gave birth. And because of the invincible power within her, her thought was not an idle thought. Something came out of her that was imperfect and different in appearance from her, for she had produced it without her partner. It did not resemble its mother and was misshapen.

When Sophia saw what her desire had produced, it changed into the figure of a snake with the face of a lion. Its eyes were like flashing bolts of lightning. She cast it away from her, outside that realm so that none of the immortals would see it. She had produced it ignorantly.

She surrounded it with a bright cloud and put a throne in the middle of the cloud so that no one would see it except the holy spirit, who is called the mother of the living. She named her offspring Yaldabaoth.

Interestingly this deity is ignorant, and is known as a liar, even to his OWN creations. (the archons / demons/angels)
They laughed at him.

He *is* the Father of Lies.

Who has lied from the beginning? (because he was ignorant)
Do his creations even care for him? NO! They ridicule(d) him, which is why he locked them away.

JUDE 6 And the angels who did not keep their own position, but left their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains in deepest darkness for the judgment of the great Day. (NRSV)

II PETER 2:4 For indeed God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast them down in chains of darkness into the low regions and delivered them to be kept for the judgment of torment. (Magiera NT Pe#ta translation)

Yaldabaoth has a brother "created in love" NOT "created in ignorance" ... and it was HIM (Jesus Christ, Savior) who came here to 'challenge' his brother and awaken him, to remove the ignorance.

Logically what is the best way to show someone their ignorance? ... Challenge it. What does Lucifer do?
There's a large portion of a book I wrote that details how "Lucifer" was honest, and someone who challenged lies.

I think there is a lot of confusion (due to the Father of Lies) ...

and somehow people who found out/read/learned certain things began thinking that Lucifer was something to be worshiped.

Without taking certain things into perspective.

Jesus Christ is Yaldabaoths "brother" for all intents and purposes according to our logic.

Yaldabaoth was born in ignorance and cast aside. Jesus Christ entered Yaldabaoths "Matrix" / reality to challenge him and to awaken him and to show him the way OUT of ignorance.

He also came to liberate those under Yaldabaoths control, imprisonment.

So how does this have to do with Hiram Abiff? ... I don't quite know because I'm not a Freemason and I'm not sure many of them would know either but the similarities and the association with David and Solomon definitely pique my interest.

first up, fokk hiramm abiff. the freemazons glorify this guy, anyone they glorify cannot be good.

second, no, jesus fought the internati0nalists of his time, that is why they killed him.

abiff is worshipped by the chozen AND freemazons. the temple of solomon is a joke. freemazonry is just a way to get the egyptian-hebrew religion watered down for the masses. freemazonry is a scam to the idiots who follow it, and do destructive things in the name of it.

they killed jesus because the rabbbis at that time only let in their own people. they charged people to attend services. jesus also battled the taxmen, and the bankers are still to this day 2000 years later ruining peoples' lives AND murdering.

no jesus was just a guy trying to promote peace and individual freedom.

lucifer and abiff is the god of freemazonry and egyptian-hebrew religions, once you study the anicent cultures.

a reply to: dantanna

You're a follower of some "true" church, I assume?
You know they kept their sermons in Latin up until very late in the middle ages to keep the true story as far away from the peasents as possible and until this day, you wouldn't understand a single word if two people actually studying and devoting their lifes to theology talk.

And they were internationalist? Don't you maybe mean occupying forces? And in that line of thought wouldn't jesus in modern days be a Jihadi?

a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

False doctrine! Man made God.
Hope you find the truth someday.

a reply to: dantanna

And you said all that with such conviction. Almost as if you really know all that. Sadly, you aren't even close. Freemasons don't "worship" Hiram Abiff. He is a character in the Third Degree who has some bad luck. If you think I'm not being square with you, please show me something in masonry that says otherwise.

Jesus Christ had to join "our" programming and the mind we were given (the Archons mind) the prison.

All the angels and demons worked together until they fashioned the psychical body. But for a long time their creation did not stir or move at all.

When the mother wanted to take back the power she had relinquished to the first ruler, she prayed to the most merciful mother-father of all. With a sacred command the mother-father sent five luminaries down to the place of the angels of the first ruler. They advised him so that they might recover the mother’s power.

They said to Yaldabaoth, Breathe some of your spirit into the face of Adam, and then the body will arise.

He breathed his spirit into Adam. The spirit is the power of his mother, but he did not realize this, because he lives in ignorance. The mother’s power went out of Yaldabaoth and into the psychical body that had been made to be like the one who is from the beginning.

The body moved and became powerful. And it was enlightened.

At once the rest of the powers became jealous. Although Adam had come into being through all of them, and they had given their power to this human, Adam was more intelligent than the creators and the first ruler. When they realized that Adam was enlightened, and could think more clearly than they, and was stripped of evil, they took and threw Adam into the lowest part of the whole material realm.

The blessed, benevolent, merciful mother-father had compassion for the mother’s power that had been removed from the first ruler. The rulers might be able to overpower the psychical, perceptible body once again. So with its benevolent spirit and great mercy the mother-father sent a helper to Adam, an enlightened afterthought who is from the mother-father and who was called life. She helped the whole creature, laboring with it, restoring it to its fullness, teaching it about the descent of the seed, teaching it about the way of ascent, which is the way of descent.

Enlightened afterthought was hidden within Adam so that the rulers might not recognize her, but that afterthought might be able to restore what the mother lacked.

to defeat "Smith" / Yaldabaoth ... his "opposite twin" ..

The human being Adam was revealed through the bright shadow within. And Adam’s ability to think was greater than that of all the creators. When they looked up, they saw that Adam’s ability to think was greater, and they devised a plan with the whole throng of rulers and angels. They took fire, earth, and water, and combined them with the four fiery winds. They wrought them together and made a great commotion.

The rulers brought Adam into the shadow of death so that they might produce a figure again, from earth, water, fire, and the spirit that comes from matter, that is, from the ignorance of darkness, and desire, and their own false spirit. This is the cave for remodeling the body that these criminals put on the human, the fetter of forgetfulness. Adam became a mortal being, the first to descend and the first to become estranged.

The enlightened afterthought within Adam, however, would rejuvenate Adam’s mind.

The rulers took Adam and put Adam in paradise. They said, Eat, meaning, do so in a leisurely manner. But in fact their pleasure is bitter and their beauty is perverse. Their pleasure is a trap, their trees are a sacrilege, their fruit is deadly poison, their promise is death.

They put their tree of life in the middle of paradise.

I shall teach you the secret of their life, the plan they devised together, the nature of their spirit: The root of their tree is bitter, its branches are death, its shadow is hatred, a trap is in its leaves, its blossom is bad ointment, its fruit is death, desire is its seed, it blossoms in darkness. The dwelling place of those who taste of it is the underworld, and darkness is their resting place.

But the rulers lingered in front of what they call the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, which is the enlightened afterthought, so that Adam might not behold its fullness and recognize his shameful nakedness.

But I was the one who induced them to eat.

I said to the savior, Master, was it not the snake that instructed Adam to eat?

The savior laughed and said, The snake instructed them to eat of the wickedness of sexual desire and destruction so that Adam might be of use to the snake. This is the one who knew Adam was disobedient because of the enlightened afterthought within Adam, which made Adam stronger of mind than the first ruler. The first ruler wanted to recover the power that he himself had passed on to Adam. So he brought deep sleep upon Adam.

I said to the savior, What is this deep sleep?

The savior said, It is not as Moses wrote and you heard. He said in his first book, He put Adam to sleep. Rather, this deep sleep was a loss of sense. Thus the first ruler said through the prophet, I shall make their minds sluggish, that they may neither understand nor discern.

a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

It's common to give a source, especially if more than 90% is quoted.

a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

"So how does this have to do with Hiram Abiff? ... I don't quite know"

If you don't know how your thread relates to Hiram Abiff, why would you present your thread with a title directly equating Hiram Abiff with Jesus and Lucifer?

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

It's common to give a source, especially if more than 90% is quoted.

gnosis.org...
gnosis.org...
gnosis.org...
www.city-data.com...
www.herealittletherealittle.net...


This is also an interesting source....
If you're gonna b*tch at me about the concept.
Who is Hiram Abiff?

Here's a bunch of reading material/sources. But like I said, primarily for this, I am referencing the Nag Hammadi.
gnosis.org...

Although, research into other world religions and belief systems, cults, societies has also lead to some of these conclusions. Work by Terence McKenna, Richard Bandler, Milton H. Erickson, Paganism, Gnosticism etc.

I'm not saying I'm "right" ... I'm just THINKING.

originally posted by: Sahabi
a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

"So how does this have to do with Hiram Abiff? ... I don't quite know"

If you don't know how your thread relates to Hiram Abiff, why would you present your thread with a title directly equating Hiram Abiff with Jesus and Lucifer?

Cherry picking a simple statement does no good, I said RIGHT after how I thought it related... there are certain similarities between the two and belief by Masons themselves that lead to that conclusion.

I said I don't quite know, BECAUSE I'M NOT A FREEMASON.

a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

1. One strike on Hiram Abiff.

2. Did you know that the "Lucifer" mentiobed in Isaiah 14:12 is a Latin mistranslation of the Hebrew "Heylel Ben Shachar" (Shining One of El, Son of Shachar)? Can you please show us any semantically accurate "Lucifer" in the Bible, Apocrypha, and/or Pseudepigrapha? Strike two?

originally posted by: Sahabi
a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

1. One strike on Hiram Abiff.

2. Did you know that the "Lucifer" mentiobed in Isaiah 14:12 is a Latin mistranslation of the Hebrew "Heylel Ben Shachar" (Shining One of El, Son of Shachar)? Can you please show us any semantically accurate "Lucifer" in the Bible, Apocrypha, and/or Pseudepigrapha? Strike two?

Strike? ... you literally just showed that my hypothesis has some solid ground.... ? .. It's not the names that are important, but the characteristics.

Shining One of El? ... well yes.. Jesus came from the "Light" .. took form under El, ...


Jesus said he came from the light ... he also stated he took his place among us etc. If the only way he could take his place among us was to manifest himself through the "program" set up by Yaldabaoth then all of this correlates ...

originally posted by: PuRe EnErGy

originally posted by: Sahabi
a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

"So how does this have to do with Hiram Abiff? ... I don't quite know"

If you don't know how your thread relates to Hiram Abiff, why would you present your thread with a title directly equating Hiram Abiff with Jesus and Lucifer?

Cherry picking a simple statement does no good, I said RIGHT after how I thought it related... there are certain similarities between the two and belief by Masons themselves that lead to that conclusion.

I said I don't quite know, BECAUSE I'M NOT A FREEMASON.

if there is anything specific you want to know, just ask. We can rustle up Ksig to provide answers. (we sent him to all the best schools)

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: PuRe EnErGy

originally posted by: Sahabi
a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

"So how does this have to do with Hiram Abiff? ... I don't quite know"

If you don't know how your thread relates to Hiram Abiff, why would you present your thread with a title directly equating Hiram Abiff with Jesus and Lucifer?

Cherry picking a simple statement does no good, I said RIGHT after how I thought it related... there are certain similarities between the two and belief by Masons themselves that lead to that conclusion.

I said I don't quite know, BECAUSE I'M NOT A FREEMASON.

if there is anything specific you want to know, just ask. We can rustle up Ksig to provide answers. (we sent him to all the best schools)

Who's we.... and how is this funny or comical? .. it's not.

Provide answers? .. I'd rather have questions that can't be answered than answers that can't be questioned.

a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

Actually,..... this only proves that the Judeo-Christian foundations were built upon the Canaanite Religion. El has 70 Sons, and according to Isaiah 14, Heylel would be one of them.

Now, if we read verses 13 & 14 of Isaiah chapter 14, we discover that the chapter is referencing Baal Hadad, which is evident by the chapter's description of Heylel usurping El, his desire to be like Elyon, and the inclusion of "Mount Zaphon", i.e.; Baal-Zephon. All of this perfectly mirrors the Baal Cycle.

a reply to: PuRe EnErGy
Bro, if you aren't on the square, then you don't understand. There is a reason why you study the degrees and you do so in order. To take certain instruction properly you begin and you end in order. Here, you have clearly picked up pieces of their truth and used it in conjunction with your beliefs, not how it was written. That is incomplete thought and faulty work. I'm going to flag the thread bc I want to come back to it but no star for you...not that it matters. Js.

originally posted by: Sahabi
a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

Actually,..... this only proves that the Judeo-Christian foundations were built upon the Canaanite Religion. El has 70 Sons, and according to Isaiah 14, Heylel would be one of them.

Now, if we read verses 13 & 14 of Isaiah chapter 14, we discover that the chapter is referencing Baal Hadad, which is evident by the chapter's description of Heylel usurping El, his desire to be like Elyon, and the inclusion of "Mount Zaphon", i.e.; Baal-Zephon. All of this perfectly mirrors the Baal Cycle.

I'm sorry but you're missing EVERYTHING before the OT....

It's like having a conversation with someone who hasn't read a book, .... about the book.