Nope, I'm Not a Bot Pushing Leftist BS - Trying to Create a "V-Book"

a reply to: soficrow

Sorry about the off topic in the other thread, we are conversing on two at the same time, I got mixed up.

Cells retain 'memories' of past states, seems I heard of something similar in the atomic or sub-atomic world.

Genetically yes DNA retains whatever copies it makes of itself including mutations. Thats how cancer spreads, for instance. And Super Nova expel all the elements of the Universe every time one goes bang. How that works exactly , nobody has been close enough to determine. We just see the spectra throughout the Universe of the same elements like hydrogen and carbon, for instance.

And isn't the whole idea of quantum computing based on the idea that quanta can store memory of a quantum state ...? Or is this another example of humans thinking that what they can do in the lab cannot possibly be achieved in the 'natural' world?

I have my different conclusions about the double slit experiment, about what we call quantum science and math. Its a reach, so far as unobtainable as real AI.

But they're working it.

As copy cats we have amazingly replicated the flight characteristics of birds and insects to a large degree. The helicopter for instance is friggin amazing what it can do, hover, fly backwards VTOL, etc.

But it can't replicate itself, heal damage or operate without human 'brains'.

They're working on that too. The predator and reaper drones for instance are effectively autonomous, except for the authorization to loose weapons.

(they are working on that too)

Now off to check on your other links.

a reply to: soficrow

From that article on Prions...

A similar protein exists in humans, suggesting that the same mechanism is at work in the human brain, but more research is needed. “It’s possible that it has the same role in memory, but until this has been examined, we won’t know,” said Dr. Kandel.

“There are probably other regulatory components involved,” he added. “Long-term memory is a complicated process, so I doubt this is the only important factor.

I agree, they aren't sure.

Lemme trip on memory lane. I remember a (donnahavealink) study done on terminally ill humans where they inserted electric probes into their brains and the subjects was able to recall previously forgotten memories. Like they were there all along, just previously unaccessible until, jogged by minute electrical currents.

Then there are the idiot savants or autistics like the guy in Rain man. If you asked him what the weather on any day was like he could remember it . So his access to the record of mundane things we don't remember or care about is voluminous.

Then theres photographic memory, and artists who can 'see' images in their mind as they render them on canvas. I had a friend who said if he looked at an object he could then see it in his mind, turning it to view it from any angle (in his mind) so he could draw it perfectly.

Then lastly, children born with encephalitis might have only 5 percent of their brain but lead normal lives.

Other scientists agree the human brain is way bigger than 'needed' or that we only use a small portion of it. I agree, the other portion imo is to store all the memory of a long life.

Its vacant memory space to be filled up, and imo again, the storage is preserved unto death, then rescued or attached to our soul, whatever.

We should be careful what we fill our minds with, it will be with us forever.

a reply to: intrptr

From that article on Prions...


"A similar protein exists in humans, suggesting that the same mechanism is at work in the human brain, but more research is needed. “It’s possible that it has the same role in memory, but until this has been examined, we won’t know,” said Dr. Kandel.

“There are probably other regulatory components involved,” he added. “Long-term memory is a complicated process, so I doubt this is the only important factor."

I agree, they aren't sure.

There is no doubt that prions store memories, although researchers are not sure about the other factors, processes and roles of other prions in memory formation and storage. The research is proceeding apace. From the same article (submitted 2014, published June 2015.) ...

Memories are stored for the long-term with the help of prion-like proteins called CPEB. CPEB prions aggregate and maintain synapses that recorded the memory [“spines” in the right image]. When CPEB prions are not present or are inactivated, the synapses collapse and the memory fades

PS. Thanks for that 'trip down memory lane.'

a reply to: soficrow

Can you explain how a CCD camera imager ship receives light, processes it and stores it on a hard disk?

Neither can I.

I would venture though we got that down pretty good.

a reply to: intrptr

It's about good research and solid background. I can tell when a writer doesn't really understand a premise - makes me put it down or turn it off, curse them for wasting my time. So I do my homework.

originally posted by: soficrow
a reply to: intrptr

It's about good research and solid background. I can tell when a writer doesn't really understand a premise - makes me put it down or turn it off, curse them for wasting my time. So I do my homework.

Nuts and bolts are good for presentation, I prefer the esoteric, the ethereal; wisdom isn't about Knowledge as much as it is discerning, prescience.

One of my best goto about the subject. The dialogue between the human and an "A.I." as only hollywood can present it. The reality of the machine is certain to us, except when we make it appear human.

"Can you paint a masterpiece?"

"Can you?"

A robot can be programmed to do most anything by the programmers. The three laws in the film are bunk. The first thing we taught machines to do was kill. The Maxim machine gun has no soul or morality, neither does a Predator Drone. It will do what its told to.

Like many humans that behave robotically, who also kill on command, complete strangers with no remorse or feeling.

Automation is certain, certain to also help reduce the world population by default. Its easer to hide the Genocide that way. Hacking hundreds of thousands of people to death with machetes (like Rwanda) is too obvious. A slow death by cancer is preferable. Oh, and programmed obsolescence (automation).

Further: The film 2001, by Stanely Kubrick was so telling for its day. The whole problem with the Jupiter mission was HAL's sentience, i.e., conflict conscience they gave him, making it difficult carrying out his program. He had to keep 'secrets' and it violated his other program, morality.

He questioned it.

Modern computers, and even future computers will never be allowed to question their commands. The same way soldiers are programmed and conditioned to accept any order given them. AI? Bah, we already got the perfect robot.

Oooh rah

a reply to: intrptr

... I prefer the esoteric, the ethereal; wisdom isn't about Knowledge as much as it is discerning, prescience.

Me2. I agree, concur. ...Did you check out the Ars Notoria?

Nice posts!

Yah, briefly...

In the famous grimoire —a textbook of magic, with instructions on how to create magical objects like talismans and amulets and perform magical spells—called Lesser Key of Solomon, there is an ancient text called the Ars Notoria, or the Notory Art of Solomon. This ancient text can be traced back to the thirteenth century while some parts were written as early as the twelfth century.

So, not from Solomon, who rightly said, of writing books there is no end, and knowledge is much weariness to the soul (paraphrased).

Again I make the distinction between knowledge and wisdom, one is from men byteachings and writings, the other thru the conduit of the soul, that ethereal source within everyone. The true source of wisdom is not learned from teachings or talismans. The whole idea of magic is a ruse to get us to believe in things...

(imo)

a reply to: intrptr

Hmmm.

...this one was different since it specifically focused on prayers, meditations and another oral exercise unlike other (grimoires), which focused exclusively on spells, potions, and rituals.

The oldest writings in the so-called Lesser Key of Solomon offer those who read and understand it, a silver tongue, perfect memory and unimaginable wisdom. However, since there has been numerous ‘unauthorized’ revision through the ages, its extremely difficult to evaluate its success and functionality.

...Among other who studied the powers of the Ars Notoria was John of Morigny, a fourteenth-century monk, who tried to achieve wisdom and academic mastery, became afflicted with otherworldly and demonic visions. After his unsuccessful try, he went on and created his own grimoire called Libor Visonum, while stating that the Ars Notoria was real and worked. However, it came at an extremely high price to the reader.

a reply to: soficrow

When asked Socrates said his wisdom was akin to writing a question on a wall and then a light from 'somewhere' would highlight the truth of it or present its own answer to him. He claimed this message or light (in his heart) came from outside himself, not something he read or learned , not from his own mind.

How I understood it anyway.

Its different for everyone, how to discern the message thru all the static is key.

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: soficrow

When asked Socrates said his wisdom was akin to writing a question on a wall and then a light from 'somewhere' would highlight the truth of it or present its own answer to him. He claimed this message or light (in his heart) came from outside himself, not something he read or learned , not from his own mind.

How I understood it anyway.

Yes, , but beyond that "mystery"....

Cultural indoctrination and conditioning shuts down the brain, neutralizes its powers, closes doors. In this light, (re)learning how to learn and access memory must become an acquired skill. There is a long history of "mystical" traditions (and teachers) dedicated to 'freeing' people from their cultural bonds and thus, metaphorically 'turning lead into gold.'

I suspect the Ars Notoria was such a teacher's 'handbook' before being "christianized." So no, not "magic."

Its different for everyone, how to discern the message thru all the static is key.

Yes, much is unique but at the same time, much is shared too. Speaking of sharing...

I've only bit on click bait twice in all my years on the Net - here on one of those CIA-sponsored "personality tests" (I'm unbelievably well-balanced, sane and non-threatening), and on FB for a "What is your mental strength?" quiz (a very simple code-breaking thing). The results said I'm an intuitive thinker, AND logical and rational.

Thing is, for the first time in my life, I felt understood. It was incredibly validating for me, despite my having been born able to 'validate' myself.

Your mental strength is intuition!

Your greatest strength is acquiring knowledge that does not necessarily depend upon previous experience. While most people understand the world based on what they see and feel, you are able to grasp things through your strong intuition. Because of this, you probably find it quite simple to grasp complex mathematical equations that others struggle with. You are very rational and depend heavily on logic to guide your life.

I know there's little respect for "intuition" in our world, and recognizing the intuitive-logical-rational combo is unusual, to say the least, so I googled it. Discovered a "new-found" understanding of intuitive thinking that highlights one of Albert Einstein's observations, "The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift.”

Intuition Is The Highest Form Of Intelligence

…If all you do is sit in a chair and trust your intuition, you are not exercising much intelligence. But if you take a deep dive into a subject and study numerous possibilities, you are exercising intelligence when your gut instinct tells you what is - and isn't - important.

In some respects, intuition could be thought of as a clear understanding of collective intelligence. …

…Albert Einstein said, "The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift.”

…Smart people listen to those feelings. And the smartest people among us - the ones who make great intellectual leaps forward - cannot do this without harnessing the power of intuition.

a reply to: soficrow

I think you are somewhat confusing the two, knowledge and wisdom are two entirely different things.

I can't show you wisdom you have to be shown it thru your own gateway of the soul.

II can lead you to the path that takes you to that fountain, you have to journey there on your own. Everyones journey is different, many take a lifetime, the practice of meditation is changed down thru the ages. Like everything else, the written record is corrupted. The key is to find how the ones that wrote down the texts (in antiquity) figured out the wisdom to do that.

And really the message is simpler than most will allow, nowadays. Love, honor and kindness are mis understood, mean something entirely different today. They are considered weakness, outdated, and misinterpreted. Fr instance we call sex, making love...

In one stead I agree with you certain ancient ummm, influences taught men how to make metal from ore and forge weapons (for war). Or building, look at the toxins we spew into the environment, the endless warfare and the disparity between peoples as a result of all that.

This is not the same thing as love, honor and kindness, is it?

All that other stuff like technology, development, and what we call "civilization" aren't what matters. Ultimately, what matters in the end is how we behaved towards others.

a reply to: intrptr

Okay.

RE:

I think you are somewhat confusing the two, knowledge and wisdom are two entirely different things.

Erm, no, I'm not. My confusion was in thinking we had some basis for conversation. Clearly we do not. But thanks for your time and attention.


ALSO - fyi - in certain mystical traditions, the idea of turning lead into gold is a metaphor for freeing an individual's mind (and 'soul') to release it's full capacities. Those traditions were not concerned with forging weapons and making war (or with turning literal lead into literal gold). In this context, the idea of "gold" represents the very best of human-ness, including the "compassionate virtues."

...I respect your observations but find your assumptions about me and your presentation off-putting.