I dont have to agree to understand

If cheating, lying and deceiving is the only way for a humane set of principles within a framework to exist do you think its alright?
Should i listen to the principle of the best of worlds? Should i listen to the principle of Spock, “Logic clearly dictates that the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.” Does it fit in the dogmatic teachings of SHIELD?

Doesnt the proverb of ;" Silence is golden " Fit the equation better, and just turn a blind eye and deaf ears and act as if, " Weeeelll, i dont know "

Thing is, i understand the other side, doesnt mean i have to agree.

a reply to: tikbalang

Yeah listen to the principle most definitely.

You know the one thing someone holding up the gauntlet for thievery lying and cheating is that...

You'd have to sit in a community full of other criminals talking about can't wait to get out and eat good food see some beautiful women just so they can come back talking about can't wait to get on the outs again.

And the only thing they are addicted to is that other men in the same situation understands that and it's simpler then dealing with crying kids.

a reply to: tikbalang
"To thine own heart be true".

Can't get any simpler than that.

nvm

a reply to: NightFlight

Could you image the quote? please

I try to understand why things are the way they are. I find the answer far from where we are told the answer is many times. I try to use logic to unleash the truth. But people are severely misled much of the time, they can't believe the truth nor can they believe the simplicity of the truth.

I guess misused science is causing a lot of this problem. Evidence created to show what someone wants to show plagues the beliefs of our society.

I refuse to believe things that are said to be real by most in society when in fact they are far from real. I allow others to believe in these things but am compelled to show them the truth if I can. If you look for things to reinforce your beliefs, you will find the reinforcement.. Don't strap on binders to steer your eyes in the direction society or you yourself is going in. Keep your peripheral vision un-obscurred so you can notice what is really happening everywhere. Research what others are saying, then try to figure out why each side is so divided, often there is truth on both sides.

Actually this is a good thread, I hope to see others comments.

originally posted by: tikbalang
a reply to: NightFlight

Could you image the quote? please

What do you mean by "image" the quote?

a reply to: tikbalang

Let's not forget that when Spock said that, he had made his own decision to sacrifice himself. He was not forcibly sacrificed.

Those who throw out this quote as a noble sentiment to espouse collectivist ideals often forget that the collectivist system imposees that choice on the individual. There is no noble self-sacrifice such as Spock's.

Let's make the needs of the many situation of Wrath of Khan into a true collectivist system. Spock, as the chief science officer was one of the more vlauable members of the crew. As such, his sacrifice would be too valuable for the many to bear. Therefore, the system, as personified in Kirk, the Captain, would send in the lowliest ensign, the sacrifice, for the needs of the many. It doesn't matter if the ensign would want to make teh sacrifice or not. He would be ordered, forced at gun point if necessary into the chamber because the many neededhis sacrifice for their own good.

That sort of robs the heroism and the nobility of hte sentiment right out of the quote which only has impact because of Spock's noble self-sacrifice made of his own free will -- which ironically exists only in a free system of choice.

a reply to: NightFlight

an image to portray the quote =)

a reply to: ketsuko

I could change it to;" The ends justify the means ". I just like the sci-fi universe better.

originally posted by: tikbalang
a reply to: ketsuko

I could change it to;" The ends justify the means ". I just like the sci-fi universe better.

Do they? Hitler, Stalin, and Mao all thought so.

Oh - like a picture image? No can do. I'm a bad boy here on ATS and I am not allowed to post images of any kind. Sorry...

a reply to: ketsuko

They did? Or is it your opinion? They might had read Machiavelli, but "quote;"

Men judge generally more by the eye than by the hand, because it belongs to everybody to see you, to few to come in touch with you. Every one sees what you appear to be, few really know what you are, and those few dare not oppose themselves to the opinion of the many, who have the majesty of the state to defend them; and in the actions of all men, and especially of princes, which it is not prudent to challenge, one judges by the result.

For that reason, let a prince have the credit of conquering and holding his state, the means will always be considered honest, and he will be praised by everybody because the vulgar are always taken by what a thing seems to be and by what comes of it; and in the world there are only the vulgar, for the few find a place there only when the many have no ground to rest on.

Its original form is "Exitus acta probat, ‎The result justifies the deeds" Ovid, Heroides

a reply to: NightFlight

LINK IT BRAAA!

a reply to: tikbalang

So you admire Hitler, Stalin and Mao? I understand. They were trying to build collectivist Utopias and the perfect society. The end does indeed justify the means.

a reply to: ketsuko

Opinions becomes assumptions, just missing a burning torch and you screaming "witch!" I'd recommend you catching up on Machiavelli it's a great read and you are still stating opinions as fact. Doesn't mean it's real, well, to anyone besides yourself.

a reply to: NightFlight

Isaiah 14:13