What Good Are Ufologists

Only the very naive would deny, out of the millions of galaxies, earth is the only island of life. Yet, no credible report of intelligence species. I would think if earth is regularly visited, or we have intelligent alien neighbors, we would have evidence of intelligent aliens in the form of alien media transmissions.

Note: Here on ATS, there are many schools of thought. Everything from they live among us, to they will not interact with us for the fact we eat flesh.

It's died off now, but it seemed ATS had multiple threads on the call for government disclosure in quick succession. (Which is odd. Isn't disclosure part of Hillary's campaign. Wonder if Hillary trolls were part of those threads.)

If alien visitation is part of the human experience throughout time, why would it seem unnatural to the point governments are compelled to keep it secret now?

Enough rambling. It is claimed aliens regularly visit earth. Have interacted with humankind from the birth of our species. Crash on earth. (I would assume throughout history. I do not understand why there is never an alien rescue. Or a galactic AAA?) But Ufologists have never present any evidence that convinces a majority of the world? Never overcomes reasonable doubt.

Why do we need government disclosure if we have credible Ufologists? Are ufologists a sham? Has astrobiology and exobiology supplanted Ufologists?

The best fiction writers on the planet. I love the stories!

Ask the military, they have strict procedure about UFOs even today.

Personally, I would love to put all the UFOlogists in a room with a big steel cage, and who ever comes out is the one we listen too

Sometimes, I think all the difference versions are part of the plan of "the Man" and Homey don't play d'at

Personally I like UFOlogists, [amateur] Egyptologists, [amateur] archeologists and their ilk...

It's generally people who are curious like all of us are and maybe have an English degree or are a physician with a keen mind who seek to expand their horizons...

Sure some are off their rockers but that's what makes life worth living....hearing and learning from people all over the spectrum...with intriguing and often radical ideas...

I say the world could use more UFOlogists...I can't wait till we discover alien life...whether it's single called or has giant eyeballs and a huge brain....Either way, the more the merrier as far as I'm concerned...

-Christosterone

So many different thoughts. Its good Ufologists are more accessible than the isolated scientists. Ufologists understand there is a true community that craves digging into things not easily explained. It was sarcastic, but In4ormant points out they do invoke the imagination.

But Ufologists also give their community a bad rep by being loose with facts. Never policing out the ridiculous narratives. Using sensationalism to push product.

It seems the different truth movements start out good natured, but turns into a cult in the face of lacking credible evidence , about book sales, not willing to police itself to maintain credibility, and entertaining any item that creates sensationalism.

a reply to: neutronflux
Hynek was credited for trying to take a scientific approach after he left bluebook, and he probably did a better job of that than most ufologists. Unfortunately he was a rare breed and is gone now, though his published work remains.

a reply to: neutronflux

I don't quite know how to answer such a question...

The thing about ufologists is they are so varied, though I have a lot of respect for the ones who have worked meticulously on releasing government and military files via freedom of information acts. That work alone shows that governments and military have worked hard on the topic too. We have a member here who that posts vast resources of released documents... IsaacKoi I believe his name is.

I suppose a Ufologist is worth as much as you give credit, it depends what you are looking for. Some generally want aliens and proof of such, me? I want tangible evidence of "UFO's", I want to identify the unidentified flying object.

Now many will say their is no evidence of UFO's and by stating such things implying they are alien. It's BS, we have tons of evidence of UFO's and I suspect a good portion of the more evident UFO's are military weapon platforms and vessels.

For me, I'd say ufologists (some) are awesome, some never earn a penny out of their research. Others do get payed and their expertise probably does deserve pay. Stanton Friedman comes to mind, the man has dedicated years to the topic and anything he is selling is most likely top notch and thoroughly researched.

So yeah, Ufologists are worth it and I'd say if you minus all the ones who are adamant they know what is up there you tend to be left with rational people just trying to find out what is up there.

It isn't a bad thing to be cynical about UFO's, truth be told only a few people know what buzzes our skies and again I suspect only the militaries of the world have such information.

originally posted by: neutronflux
It's died off now, but it seemed ATS had multiple threads on the call for government disclosure in quick succession. (Which is odd. Isn't disclosure part of Hillary's campaign. Wonder if Hillary trolls were part of those threads.)


Why do we need government disclosure if we have credible Ufologists? Are ufologists a sham? Has astrobiology and exobiology supplanted Ufologists?

This actually reminded me of www.disclosureproject.org...

The Disclosure Project is a research project working to fully disclose the facts about UFOs, extraterrestrial intelligence, and classified advanced energy and propulsion systems. We have over 500 government, military, and intelligence community witnesses testifying to their direct, personal, first hand experience with UFOs, ETs, ET technology, and the cover-up that keeps this information secret.

So even with all those testimonies , UFOlogists are needed to do independent research about the subject. unfortunately, any real physical "proof" if found, are being confiscated and withheld from the general public

At best they keep the truth up, or exposed. At worst, they try to control or pidgeon hole it!

a reply to: neutronflux

In my experience most Ufologists are little more than snake oil salesmen , there are a handful (or less) who actually contribute to the field and genuinely investigate the unknown , Dr. Richard F. Haines is one of the few.

Dr. Haines is a former NASA scientist and aeronautical engineer who's interest in the subject led him to set up the pilots UFO reporting center NARCAP (National Aviation Reporting Center on Anomalous Phenomena)

Thread on Dr.Haines started by karl 12
www.narcap.org...

a reply to: darkspace

Since you mentioned the Disclosure Project, what made Greer totally loose his marbles? I mean, he didn't start out that way did he? I remember watching those interviews for the first time and i have to say i was very impressed with alot of the witnesses. At the time i thought this actually would have an impact, yet here we are years later. Nothing noteworthy came of it other than the founder moving ahead, luring in lights in the night sky with a flash light while singing kumbaya.

a reply to: Skeletonized

that i don't know, we can only speculate. or you can follow the link i posted and ask him yourself. he is even on twitter

a reply to: darkspace

Greer isn't a Ufologist , he's a circus ringmaster.

a reply to: gortex

never claimed he was

There was a point in time at which people thought that collecting a lot of data would help us be able to approach the UFO question scientifically. That we would be able to make some predictions and create some hypotheses that could be tested.

But it turned out that without access to government verification of secret aircraft tests, the data didn't really add up to anything. Too much of it was mundane, and if the "real" UFO stories were properly presented, they often didn't make any sense.

So, while it was nice to have them do the grunt work, they eventually came to a dead end. Which is where we are now until something significant appears -- if it ever will.

originally posted by: neutronflux
Only the very naive would deny, out of the millions of galaxies, earth is the only island of life.

I don't think it's being naive to say that as far as we know at this point, and there is absolutely no indication to the contrary that Earth is the only planet in the universe with any life on it. Knowing how inhospitable most of space is, and not knowing what it takes for inanimate materials to "come alive," and knowing that there are unique things in the universe, I would say that it's not unreasonable to suggest that we could easily be the only game in town.

a reply to: Blue Shift

What I don't get, in the sense of government disclosure, aliens are reported as bypassing government. Directly interacting and abducting normal people. (I am a skeptic, not arguing the validity of the reports.) Then, somehow governments around the world confiscate all the physical evidence before it can be used as proof. Seems more of a strawman argument than practical. The old fall back on they to powerful. Control everything, except my repeated cry of how the government took my evidence.

Side line, I know it's cost to cost, but the segment was with an expert on police interviews. It was very interesting how a person conducting an interview can lead a person to a false confession. Or even eyewitness to the interviews conclusion. Think what an interviewer and an eyewitness with a similar agendas could come up with! Especially when YouTube likes and book sales are on the line?

Perhaps the thread title should be "What Are Good Ufologists?"

Because as long as we don't have a real UFO somewhere that can be studied under test conditions then we can only chip away. We've been chipping away for 70 years now.

The problem is that organisations like MUFON will attract people who naturally believe that UFOs are alien spacecraft. So we have a confirmation bias from their investigators from day one. Then we have the 'professional' ufologist. They probably start off with good intentions but when the answers don't seem to be coming or the data isn't taking them in the direction they want they hit their brick wall. Some leave the field. Others plough on giving their audience what they want to hear despite stories being solved or worse still exposed as hoaxes years ago.

For example Len Kasten on Coast to Coast AM tonight will promote the long ago debunked SERPO story.

If your livelihood depends on the paying audience you give them what they want to hear and what they believe.

However some Ufologists do keep their objectivity completely. A group of them successfully proved the "Roswell Slides" fiasco was a hoax. People like Phil Mantle dug deep to find the story behind the "Alien Autopsy" conjured up by Ray Santili and also people like Alejandro Rojas tried a new angle on exposing Richard Doty's lies by launching FOIA requests against his criminal breaking and entering of Paul Bennewitz's home to set up an operation to make him believe in aliens.

It's all sadly negative successes. But unless they remain objective how can a ufologist ever get to the real truth?

a reply to: neutronflux

Maybe earth is the only inhabited planet in this dimension?
It is also very difficult to get your hands on any proof because
of the military and government.