Russian Helicopter Shoots Itself Down in Syria

a reply to: DodgyDawg

Either hit by hostile fire or a malfunction. I'd say very little chance it shot itself down. That would have had to be an almost impossibly tight turn for one of its own rockets to come back around, which is the only way it could have shot itself down.

I always thought these were more durable ...

a reply to: cavtrooper7

They are, but all helicopters are fragile. Russian transport helicopters in Afghanistan prior to the Hinds would occasionally have the tail boom torn off by a single Stinger hit. There were Hinds that survived a single hit.

A good example is the Blackbird. It was made out of titanium, one of the hardest metals used. Entire sheets of titanium were ruined because they drew cut lines on them with a grease pencil.

No matter how tough a helicopter is, they're still pretty fragile.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: DodgyDawg

Either hit by hostile fire or a malfunction. I'd say very little chance it shot itself down. That would have had to be an almost impossibly tight turn for one of its own rockets to come back around, which is the only way it could have shot itself down.

mayby the other helicopter accidentally nailed his buddy. Cause i didnt see no trails from the ground.

a reply to: yuppa

A ZSU-23 can reach 10,000 feet. You wouldn't see a trail from a bullet unless it was a tracer.

a reply to: Zaphod58

We would move heaven and earth to find and kill those in the Cav,ANY ADA was dealt with as fast as we could knock it down.

a reply to: yuppa

Hmm, you might be correct about the sound - I wouldn't have thought the helicopters would be silent or that there would be no noise other than the guys celebrating even though sound quality is very poor.

a reply to: Zaphod58

I was thinking along the lines of it being one of the simple unguided Russian rockets.It gets fired but doesn't ignite fully. the force is enough for it to leave the tube but it is spinning because of the angle of attack. The rest of the fuel ignites and it hits the tail rotor.

OR the rocket is released in its tube to fire yet the fuel doesn't immediately ignite. It falls out of the launcher backwards. it ignites late, again firing into the tail rotor.

It seems possible to me with how they're using Syrian munitions which have probably been badly looked after.

I can't think it'd be conventional SAM of any size as that would try to hit the centre of the helicopter or the hottest part. I wouldn't have thought AA either as its a very large explosion to be the result of any round from a modern AA gun.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: yuppa

A ZSU-23 can reach 10,000 feet. You wouldn't see a trail from a bullet unless it was a tracer.[/quote

The ZSU-23 has a doppler radar system and the firing signature is wrong for a ZSU-23.

a reply to: buddah6

I know, I was simply pointing out that guns were capable of reaching high enough to hit it, and wouldn't have a visual signature that you could see.

Looking at the blast it seems to travel in the same direction as the debris from the wing. If it was ground fire I would expect to see the small explosion and shrapnel travel in a direction relative to the projectile.

originally posted by: yuppa

originally posted by: buddah6
a reply to: Tardacus
I have watched the video several times and the first flashes are the MI-24 shooting. This is followed by the large explosion at the tail. I think it is a missile of some sort but opinions are just that...opinions.

Well it wasnt a RPG from that range of the akbar guys.

Maybe a Stinger or an SA-7?

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: buddah6

I know, I was simply pointing out that guns were capable of reaching high enough to hit it, and wouldn't have a visual signature that you could see.

Agreed.

originally posted by: smurfy

originally posted by: sg1642

originally posted by: tayton
Commenting on the second video with sound, I wish I could somehow shove their Allah Akbar up their arse

i can't stand what are sometimes interesting videos to watch because of that. It is utterly pathetic and vexing to listen to. barrel bomb falling on my head? Lolz better shout how great god is.

I put in the original video with sound for perspective, and they were tracking the helicopter, so there is a possibility that it was shot down to take into account. I don't care what they are shouting. I don't like all the glorifying either.

I've just watched the video and I'm going with fake. I've heard the sound of rocket pods from much further away than that. They would have picked the whoosh sound up and the crumping sound of the rockets landing (albeit with a delay of maybe half a second or a second). Think this is just a case of propaganda at work again.

a reply to: buddah6

No trail. it was most likely a gun. maybe a anti tank rifle.

a reply to: sg1642

I hope that it is fake. I have seen a Cobra get shot down in May of 1972 over An Loc, Vietnam. It was much like this video. Luckily, both crew survived after autorotation into a rice paddy after getting nail by a SA-7. The TR came off and floated down into the jungle. The pilot made a great autorotation but the Cobra fell over on it's side and burnt. I don't know how the crew was recovered because the air mission commander (ACM) ordered us out of the area. I believe a AF HH-53 got them out.

a reply to: yuppa

Large caliber weapons like the DPSH just passes through and through unless it hits something solid like a gearbox or crew. 23, 37 ,57 or 80mm ADA is a very different story. They have explosive rounds and a flimsy helicopter disintegrates when hit.

There was a picture of a CH-21, in our ops room, that was brought down by a large wood spear. That crew must have had some good war stories at the "O" club.

originally posted by: buddah6
a reply to: sg1642

I hope that it is fake. I have seen a Cobra get shot down in May of 1972 over An Loc, Vietnam. It was much like this video. Luckily, both crew survived after autorotation into a rice paddy after getting nail by a SA-7. The TR came off and floated down into the jungle. The pilot made a great autorotation but the Cobra fell over on it's side and burnt. I don't know how the crew was recovered because the air mission commander (ACM) ordered us out of the area. I believe a AF HH-53 got them out.

i doubt the actual footage is fake I think they have tried to put their own spin on it to create a false impression. I kind of hope the crew didn't make it out the crash rather than end up in the hands of those sick #s.

a reply to: buddah6

Syrian rebels have been using PTRD-41 anti tank rifles with a mix of others to take out armored units.20 mm explosive Ap rounds will knock out a hind i think if hit in the right spot. Although they could be using barret M-82's with anti tank rifle rounds too.