Baddogma's Meta Cafe- Polite Discussions About Scientific Mysticism and General Weirdness

originally posted by: Peeple
My sweet smarty pants I got a hypothetical time travelling question:

What if we will have invented time travelling in the future while we still use oil, but it went out, we needed more and went back to get some.
Would that alter the past and the present, because we'd run out of oil sooner? Possibly before we invent time travelling and never will invent it, therefore never can go back to get the oil.
Then we'd again have enough to last that long, but the people of the future were already in our past and certainly could/would not simply disappear...

Or would it always have been the way that the future people will have intervened in the past, making their own story in the future the only one possible?

& is there another planet with oil we know of? Not, right?

I feel the same about Time travel as I do finding new planets to live on to save humanity.
If you can't do it here, you are going to fail there too. If you fix it here then you can make it there too.
I've never been particularly interested in time travel for that reason.
IF time travel is real you cannot focus on it from one time track.. And I don't mean alternate timelines either..

If it's real the past effects the future affects the present affects the past affects the future affects the present affects it all all "at once" as it were. every strand of the time spider web is taut. You could call it tug a war maybe..

So it'a almost like you change things back into what they are.. "events" have a certain momentum.
Doesn't have to stay the same but it's a lot of spider web to just up and move it.. I was imagining differing threads of the web lighting up in response to others being pinged pulling this way in the spider past which does this thing over here, and all the strands react to all changes "NOW"

So like how people say history repeats itself?

any time you fix it whether you are wearing a suit of Armor or some jungle camo or some wolf skin.. Can fix the rest of it too.. That's at least the point of the story in the bible with the farmer and the hunter. One gets jealous of the other and from that point on now we have world wars..

I saw some harry potter movie section on tv one day. I have no idea which movie I never got into it but Harry is running from those wraith things that like suck out your light and paralyze you or whatever? I forget how they show this but Harry gets saved by a dark figure on the other side of the river... And when they are hiding from people those people turn away at the right moment and they get away..

something happens in the future so they decide to go back in time to fix it. And they are like oh no the other uses are trapped behind that wall, we're running out of time, so they throw a rock and it gets the attention away from their past selves.. And Harry ends up seeing himself almost give in to the death eaters (is that what they're called?) and does his little thing on the other side of the river..

So in essence the changes they time travel to go make happen already happened the first time which the first time is every time because there is only one time... LOL..

That's the view I get with my own life and trying to "go against fate" it sort of changes the story but the story still rhymes..
They matrix is basically the Odyssey..

If we live in a simulation all bets are off.. Maybe the game mods pic a time traveling hero once he has a level 27 Soul, and he gets a special character upgrade that no one else gets? a different rule set.


anyway I think synchronicities are like us talking to ourselves.. all time is going on now and all of ourselves are trying to get it right all at once. As it we are already time traveled to every point in time right at this very moment. Call it Time spider wave entanglement.



Oh and any planet we would be looking for that has life on it, is meeting all the same conditions that make oil.. It kind of seems like this entire thing is a set up.

Even now as you speak You guys are running down the same list of things that happened to me.
Serdgiam is over there talking about galaxies colliding.. Peeple your energy is bleeding into "my world"

June 8th 2015:

lol.. That's my mind. If it is not you mind I can not insight for you.
I think we need to talk. I'm sure you felt something. Must have.

haha.

that's kind of me writing that. Again confusing..
back to June 10th 2015 Since You posted the Goth and the Hippie.. And Serdgiam is talking about worlds colliding..

This thing is confusing in so many directions.. Time went weird reality went weird magic went weird not even knowing if I was me or another person went weird..

originally posted by: Layaly
a reply to: KnightLight

how can you explain this

And back into April 9th 2015:

originally posted by: KnightLight
a reply to: KnightLight

Read.

a reply to: Reverbs

So the NASA thing wasn't super boring after all..





Here is the actual press conference.



3 of the planets are in habitable zone, and they are all about earth size and rocky planets. Depending on atmosphere all of the 7 planets could have liquid water.

One of which the measurements strongly suggest a water rich composition. And that one is in the habitable zone.

Some of the planets would even be bigger than the moon in the sky..

AWWW.. Gawd that would be so pretty.


Some more points:
~the star is smaller than the sun so the planets are closer in and have quick orbital periods.
~the planets are likely tidally locked as the moon is to the earth. so one side is always dark one always light. (unlike the moon because these ARE orbitting a star not a planet)
~MAss and sizes of planets measured because they don't have set orbital periods. they are close together so all of them tug on all the rest and through that you can see where they are and how big they are.. Even can estimate density of the planets.
~Transmission spectroscopy (light through atmosphere) can tell what atmosphere composition is. Using hubble to see if they have a hydrogen helium based atmosphere. planets b and c have been checked and they DO NOT have hydrogen helium atmospheres which is promising for a more earth like planet.
~planet 1e she just called it is so close to earth size its basically perfect. I don't know the mass at the moment maybe she will say.. I'll guess with my eyes it has 85-90% earth gravity.. It also has about the same amount of light earth has.
~planet 1f is supposed to be a water rich world also about the size of earth but without about the light you get on mars..
~1g planet is the largest planet in the system and has a 13% larger radius than earth.
~39 light years away.
~it's an ultra cool dwarf star and now the same team will be using the techniques they used here to search 1,000 other super cool dwarve stars.. (small red stars)
~Hubble keplar spitzer and the james webb telescopes will be used on this system.. With the James Webb they can indeed find out the composition of the atmospheres and better understand how warm it is on those planets..
~the orbital periods are from 1.5 days? to say around 20 days.. That means that how a long a "year" is.. See Time gets weird when you leave the earth..
you start having to say things like "earth years"
~planet e for instance is 5% of the distance to it's sun as Earth is to ours. but about the same amount of radiation (sun light) And that's why the sky would be filled with planets.. because they are all so close.
~goes into orbital harmonics? I surmise it's ratios of distances like what I was getting at with ppluto one time.. the numbers acame back all like ratios were integers.. 6 9 3.. the distances to the sizes? I forget the ratioss but all cam eout to whole numbers.. Because it's also the case here but the planets should be further out.. THey "guess" the planets formed further out and would have more ice, so therefor they got pushed in somehow? and it's much more likely for them to have water that way..


it goes into Q and A at that point and so far the questions are great, but that's all you get from me haha..

a reply to: Peeple

Hairy poo made me smile, so I couldn't censor it

Now, you say you are over TLE (timeless ecosystems, acronyms rule, ARrrrrr), and that you believe its "actually like this." But, I don't see how what you described is in conflict with timeless ecosystems? Maybe I'm not quite understanding.

I think that distinguishing by time vs timeless is a bit problematic too. Obviously, that's what I used, but its a bit like comparing water ecosystems vs waterless ecosystems. It certainly has a foundation, but I think it focuses too much on one aspect as the defining factor when that might not really be accurate. I'm not sure how to make a better distinction there, mind you, but it doesn't quite jive with me even though I use it.

I actually agree about the concept of information. I hold the opinion that the TOE will be an equation that deals with the transformation of that information, wherein all possible states are essentially contained in a waveform. So, your three "statuses" would be the peak, the trough, and the middle baseline (very, very roughly speaking.. trying to connect our ideologies ). Not sure if I've mentioned it, but that's what being a morphologian is all about. And yes, as far as I know, that's a fabricated title Its all about how information interacts, and for me, how we might perceive that. In other words, given my belief, similar to yours, that information is the fabric of things, determining how it changes (or doesn't change) on a universal scale will yield a theory of everything.

If you have seen the movie A Beautiful Mind, about Nash, this is the type of thing he was touching on though it was specific to economics. In a sense, its like optimization optimized, but there is so much more to it than that. Kind of going OT here.. Pull up! Pull up!

One of the major sticking points is transient events. I've mentioned it a few times, and in the past I think someone said we had already gone over it and everyone moved on.. but there might be some different definitions going on there.

They are really a wrench in the works, though one that is generally minimized, mitigated, or overlooked. This type of change in the information can be incredibly destructive. The interesting part, which led me to believe its not just the state but the "position" of the states, is that essentially nothing "new" is introduced yet we get a very different form of the same information. Without some canvas for this to occur, which would also give veracity not only to the importance of aspects like spin, velocity, and direction but the "spacetime" in which they occur, these anomalies likely wouldn't exist.

a reply to: Reverbs

Any synopsis for us losers at work (and lurking)?

I know who Sara Seager is and what TRAPPIST (like the monks! Back to beer on the moon!) and there was something about an expanded search zone. What exactly did they say? I will prolly se soon enough... if I can get away from having to actually do work that is!

Jupiter Ascending is Rising in weirdness! In the Age of Aquarius (or the Mayan end times, or since we passed the date are we in the new new times?). God bless the interweb!

a reply to: TEOTWAWKIAIFF

I'm writing out some points in my above post.. I'm just now listening.

a reply to: Reverbs

Thanks! I am reading phys.org article right now! And I think I did my last duty for the day and can play for an hour or two (relax into the rest of the week!)



ETA: Seriously, busy here at work and forgot all about this! "In the constellation Aquarius"! Orbiting a red dwarf star... "slightly larger than Jupiter"! Who's ascending to the stars!

a reply to: TEOTWAWKIAIFF

You just gave me a very odd flashback to a pagan worship service I went to.. Well they called it easter service.. THe Sun rise service.. One of my exes was churchy so of course I'm there with her family.. Methodist?? Not sure..

And they are reading some passage about jesus, "and he has risen again!" as the sun is coming over the horizon..

I was trying not to crack up the entire time and everyone was quiet and serious and thinking about jesus, and I'm just like jesus is a ball of burning gas?? haha.. You had to be there everything they said.. And I was never sure if the pasture or whatever they are callled if he got what he was saying or if he didn't, but the people listening were jsut hearing jesus stories..



"The sky calls to us,
if we do not destroy ourselves..
We will one day venture,
to the stars.

A still more glorious dawn awaits,
not a sun rise, but a galaxy rise.
A morning filled with 400 billion suns
the rising of the milky way."

~Carl Sagan's best song.. Has a mad beat too..

a reply to: Reverbs

Eulogy to the Human Race

On the cusp of technological breakthrough
The knowledge to live forever
Cure cancer…
Nuclear Fusion…
Travel to the stars…

Only the husk of a world as nuclear fission pits slowly burn holes towards the center of the earth spewing radiation into the wine dark skies. No movement on the surface as bones bleach in the sun. Oceans filled with bloated carcasses slowing sinking to the sea floor.

I wrote that the other day for the Poems to an Extinct Species thread but thought it was too dark (theirs were about dodo birds and insects... ).

No mad beats though...

Gee, what a Debbie Downer! LOL. I liked the visuals! Who better to share general weirdness with?!

a reply to: TEOTWAWKIAIFF

No that's the kind of darkness that sheds light on the crazy situation we are in right now.
Beautiful darkness.

well I never imagined it quite like that but when I was little I was outside of a home depot I think it was and my mom was buying bags of sand they were outside.. I think for a sandbox my dad built. So I was looking at those bags, and then I saw more people coming to get bags (in my head) and I changed them to food bags.. Then I saw he trucks delivering the bags and the oil that goes in the trucks and the farms and the oil fields and then I aw the whole earth and saw population rise...

and I'm sitting there at like 5 years old thinking.. We're #ed.
I didn't tell my mom about my little vision.

Yours is even better.
Kind of peaceful in a way.

we are right on the edge. I think we actually might make it this time.

a reply to: Reverbs

Did you see this story (sciencedaily.com) - Is the human brain hardwired to appreciate poetry? about the brain being wired to appreciate poetry. The cool part is you do not have to process it consciously it just kind of happens!

What wild thoughts! Galaxies colliding, planets rising, around red small person suns, 40 something light years away, while the sun god burns in the Age of Aquarius, "Garcon! Bring me some water!" Pasture! Get one for the pastor as well! We need something to wash this cracker down with! Ah heck! Make it a Trappist Ale, a sour one! It goes well with the setting sun! I am a Methodist and follow the rules of drinking beer while the sun sets!

a reply to: TEOTWAWKIAIFF

Did I ever share this one with you guys?


Eternal beauty is like,
Empty blackness,
the space between two stars.
We can have it all,
the void is ours.

What's a couple scars,
between us stars,
like passing cars in the night?

The blackness is still there,
always empty inviting,
containing it all
forever.

As far as we go,
wherever we travel,
we are still there,
we are here,
it's all so,
still.

hop in my car,
take a ride
go wherever the tide takes us,
I'll drop you off,
whenever you like,
back...
into the void.

but while we're here,
lot's stop and stare,
at the stars.

a reply to: Reverbs

40 lightyears away? No problem my cruiser goes 160 ly/h.... gawd that would be so awesome!

I learned yesterday Carl Sagan wrote in his early days a paper pro ancient aliens, that the more we excavate the more likely we'd find advanced technological artifacts. A young and wild Sagan.




And the Jupiter Ascending thing is just proof that very many remember the meaning not the exact words. Ascending and rising are the same the first is pretty rare so the lazy brain just makes rising out of it if it has to repeat it without notes.

Like I say TEOTWAWKIAIFF is a very congenial person, Serdgiam asks you what did she say and you go she thinks he's nice.

a reply to: TEOTWAWKIAIFF

I want to hear one of your songs. Do you got anything on soundcloud or youtube?

And don't tell me you don't have any, because that would be such an obvious lie...

a reply to: Serdgiam

I tried to explain that the timeless, which would be these ibit-wave-particles isn't really an ecosystem.
But I also think there might be different layers of existence with unique time speed, the key is I guess c. The closer to c the more mass and energy, right? If you look at c^2=E/m time has to have a different speed/passing time, I am sorry I have issues putting into words what I actually mean.

Just that the timeless which is the singularity, the sum of all of these information bits from birth to death of the universe... I wanted to say can't have a consciousness but...

I have to think about that s'more

Black holes might be just clouds of faster than c spinning information bits...

originally posted by: Reverbs
a reply to: Peeple

We are the new temple. God doesn't live in buildings.

That's why I posted the Temple of Man some time ago..

You and I have a similar taste in books. Allegro is a love of mine. I collect his books, he had an extraordinary mind, but Rene Schwaller de Lubicz and the Temple of Man tore me a new one. Totally opened a window on a reality that I was previously unaware of, and allowed me to understand how it affected me in unawareness. That need to believe in order seems to be pretty strong and the binds are not easy to break, necessarily so in some cases, but it is a tangled mess and one that has a tendency to render us inflexible to change.

@ everyone, school holidays here and teenagers underfoot, or in need of tormenting (my current favourite past-time, smart arses the lot of them), and I have been burning the candle at both ends watching Prime Suspect and working on my picture...which has turned out weird not at all what I had expected...cutting out leaves into the wee small hours. Work is a bitch, the artwork has provided valuable meditation and prevented me from tearing the vicar a new one. So, busily absent, but thinking of you all and trying to at least keep up.

Take care

a reply to: Anaana

Good to know you're fine. Can we see the picture? I love weird.

a reply to: Peeple

Ah, no pressure there! I still have to learn Pro Tools (just the LE version, "lite") but it is still an undertaking from strumming guitar to recording engineer! Then mixdown engineer. Then mastering engineer. There are too many options at each point. It is a lot to learn (lots of mistakes).

Then there is the written word vs. the sung lyrics! And I would be doing it all! Musician, vocalist, pro tools engineer,... it can be overwhelming.

Yup, no soundcloud or u-tube. I have some mp3s on a looper of me just screwing around on guitar. But thanks for the vote of confidence!

My plan was to import the sampler stuff into pro tools and start the learning process. But I have not started (yet!). Oh, I will bring in my version of Come As You Are with me on banjo by when I am done!



a reply to: Anaana

Looking at the Temple of Man layout it is obvious they put the "kink" in there on purpose. Just like pyramids at Giza! And they were not the only ones to do so. Chaco Canyon is part of a layout of settlements doing the same "kink"; the Pyramids of the Sun and Moon in Mexico also feature that bend.

The thought is it is geomancy being done. They arrange the temples/pyramids/structures on the Earth in the alignment of stars. The prominent constellation is thought to be Orion. Specifically the stars of the belt.

Amazing that people from different times and places are all doing the same thing! Hum... wonder if any modern people are doing that?

(amazon) - The Secret Architecture of Our Nation's Capital: The Masons and the Building of Washington, D.C.

a reply to: TEOTWAWKIAIFF

Yeah I know the type. Perfectionist lost in technological details instead of making music. You know I once recorded something with just the laptop, garage bands in the old days had nothing but a tape recorder, but you need the perfect equipment first. Ts, ts, ts. A shame I bet you're really good.

Come on show me a snippet, please?