Charles Pierce: There Is Only One Way to Defeat ISIS

Pierce's take on ISIS is so succinct and spot on, the fact that we (as a nation) aren't doing this is an indictment of our government;

There Is Only One Way to Defeat ISIS
We must hold accountable our Middle Eastern "allies"—the states and bankers and political elites—who persist in funding mass murder.
Esquire.com; Nov 14, 2015

These are a few things that will not solve the terrible and tangled web of causation and violence in which the attacks of Friday night were spawned. A 242-ship Navy will not stop one motivated murderous fanatic from emptying the clip of an AK-47 into the windows of a crowded restaurant. The F-35 fighter plane will not stop a group of motivated murderous fanatics from detonating bombs at a soccer match. A missile-defense shield in Poland will not stop a platoon of motivated murderous fanatics from opening up in a jammed concert hall, or taking hostages, or taking themselves out with suicide belts when the police break down the doors. American soldiers dying in the sands of Syria or Iraq will not stop the events like what happened in Paris from happening again because American soldiers dying in the sands of Syria or Iraq will be dying there in combat against only the most obvious physical manifestation of a deeper complex of ancient causes and ancient effects made worse by the reach of the modern technology of bloodshed and murder. Nobody's death is ever sacrifice enough for that.

...

Abandoning the Enlightenment values that produced democracy will not plumb the depths of the vestigial authoritarian impulse that resides in us all, the wish for kings, the desire for order, to be governed, and not to govern. Flexing and posturing and empty venting will not cure the deep sickness in the human spirit that leads people to slaughter the innocent in the middle of a weekend's laughter. The expression of bigotry and hatred will not solve the deep desperation in the human heart that leads people to kill their fellow human beings and then blow themselves up as a final act of murderous vengeance against those they perceive to be their enemies, seen and unseen, real and imagined. Tough talk in the context of what happened in Paris is as empty as a bell rung at the bottom of a well.

...

It's not like this is any kind of secret. In 2010, thanks to WikiLeaks, we learned that the State Department, under the direction of then-Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton, knew full well where the money for foreign terrorism came from. It came from countries and not from a faith. It came from sovereign states and not from an organized religion. It came from politicians and dictators, not from clerics, at least not directly. It was paid to maintain a political and social order, not to promulgate a religious revival or to launch a religious war. Religion was the fuel, the ammonium nitrate and the diesel fuel. Authoritarian oligarchy built the bomb. As long as people are dying in Paris, nobody important is dying in Doha or Riyadh.

...

It's time for this to stop. It's time to be pitiless against the bankers and against the people who invest in murder to assure their own survival in power. Assets from these states should be frozen, all over the west. Money trails should be followed, wherever they lead. People should go to jail, in every country in the world. It should be done state-to-state. Stop funding the murder of our citizens and you can have your money back. Maybe. If we're satisfied that you'll stop doing it. And, it goes without saying, but we'll say it anyway – not another bullet will be sold to you, let alone advanced warplanes, until this act gets cleaned up to our satisfaction. If that endangers your political position back home, that's your problem, not ours. You are no longer trusted allies. Complain, and your diplomats will be going home. Complain more loudly, and your diplomats will be investigated and, if necessary, detained. Retaliate, and you do not want to know what will happen, but it will done with cold, reasoned and, yes, pitiless calculation. It will not be a blind punch. You will not see it coming. It will not be an attack on your faith. It will be an attack on how you conduct your business as sovereign states in a world full of sovereign states.

The cold hard fact is that the United States - as well as other Western powers - have been bending over backwards to cover up Saudi Arabia's involvement in proliferating Wahabism and backing the creation of radical Islam Caliphates in other gulf nations. Perhaps it is more sinister than that - we are directly conspiring with them in order to bring about the downfall of those nations designated by the PNAC for "regime change" for their resistance to our corporate interests, so long as our interests and theirs overlap.

I'm sure as soon as the oil runs out or we make a complete switch to electric cars we will crack down on countries like...say, Saudi Arabia.

As long as Saudi upholds the petro dollar our corrupt government will back them.

I remember reading Noam Chomsky a couple decades ago. That was when I truly understood evil and the meaning of State Sponsored Terrorism. Directly, indirectly, via proxy, I'm mean at this point who gives a #.

The whole world wants to destroy ISIS now, hmm didn't see that coming. Did ISIS? Or maybe they are just cynical psychopathic poets who are simply just "raging against the dying wind".

We war with the ME for decades murdering men, women and children.

We funnel money to the "good" terrorists.

We (the west) opens our borders to "refugees"

And we get a series of terrorist attacks, by terrorists who go out of there way to ensure we know they're Syrian ISIS. Eh? Eh? Come on..,now that's cute. It was really smart of the other Syrian suicide bomber to be sure to bring his passport with him, should he you know....need to book a flight to the Holy Land. Allah demands passport I heard. Keeps the infidels out.

a reply to: abe froman

If any of you remember the Iran hostage crisis..... it has not gotten better....just worse....As I mentioned in another thread. ... let's elect Trump and bomb the $hI+ out of them!!!


www.history.com...

It was a good well thought out analysis of the situation in my opinion as well. The Emirates are largely to blame for fueling this hatred and violence and the West should call them to account.

originally posted by: ReadLeader
a reply to: abe froman

If any of you remember the Iran hostage crisis..... it has not gotten better....just worse....As I mentioned in another thread. ... let's elect Trump and bomb the $hI+ out of them!!!


www.history.com...

We've been bombing the # out of these people in the Middle East for over a decade.....
and look where it's got us.

a reply to: Blackmarketeer

If we just remove our military from the region they will go back to killing each other instead of us. They have been killing each other for 1,000's of years and all we are doing is stirring up a hornets nest.

a reply to: lambros56

Bombs away. More is better!!! maybe there are some things that we "dont" know, eh?

www.washingtonpost.com... ry.html

You forgot Saudi Arabia and Israel.

2 middle eastern nations who love to stir up crap in a cowardly way to get their enemies to kill each other without actually being involved I the war themselves.

a reply to: Blackmarketeer


Great OP!

ME allies: Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Kuwait, and Turkey.
You could add Pakistan to the list as well.

Good idea but the US is too greedy and the politicians like Hillary, Bush and, Obama are under control and take orders NOT to disturb their ME business partners.
As well the people are to trusting of their government and just can’t believe the horrors that really exist like their own government supports the hated jihadists.

Turkey is new to this demonic Saudi religious depravity since Erdogan is a Muslim brotherhood puppet.

But this is solid truth that the US/Saudi relationship is one of the keys to this terrorism.

Wahhabi/Salafi Islam is the distorted monstrosity that fuels the dogma of these medieval religious monsters from the ME, a zombie crew of demented fanatics.


This approach should be taken along with an international military and security force I’m afraid will eventually will have to be done.

It’s going to get uglier and uglier because they let this cancer grow

a reply to: Metallicus



Were in the world haven't humans been killing each other for 1000's of years

The American Civil war where almost 1 million were killed?


WWII where millions were killed?

Finally, someone actually was willing to tell an accurate statement.

The problem isn't with humanity, the problem isn't totally due to our presidents, it is not even totally due to the terrorists. The problem with humanity is the 1/10 of 1% of wealthy people.

They are the ones with the capital, connections, and influence to manipulate world events, (including 9/11 attacks), they are the reason why the world cannot progress any further, they are the reason why the world is frozen, they are the ones who stifle our best and brightest, they are the ones who artificially slow down progress because they don't want to lose power.

a reply to: Blackmarketeer

Good OP....It is all playing out like a really piss poor B grade movie

As mentioned directly below the OP as long as the petro dollar is being propped up all kinds of evil will be allowed to go unheeded

a reply to: Blackmarketeer

bravo, bravo, bravo, bravo, bravo, bravo, bravo, bravo, bravo, bravo, bravo, bravo, bravo, bravo, bravo, bravo.

Sombody is standing up at last. I have no idea who this bloke is and i dont care either but he deserves the Nobel Peace Prize in my book.

They are importal words, the words of a hero, the words of our time, words that change history.

a reply to: Blackmarketeer

You missed an important one:

CCTV all over the place won't stop a terrorist act!

1 or 2% need to be watched... the other 98% do not.

a reply to: abe froman I think spending our resources on a replacement for oil instead of trying to change every regime in the region would be a much more fruitful and effective tactic. Problem is our hard line Islamist allies also buy our lucrative defence contracts to subdue their own rebellious populations so it's more than just one conflict of interests going on

Nice idea, cutting off the funding, all funding, but even if we could control the elite with their multiple agendas, that still doesn't have a snowball's chance in hell from stopping what has already been set in motion.

The best thing we could've done was to stay out of the ME and Africa. But we didn't, and we here pretty much all know why (see above).

The only sane recourse we have now to stem the tide and try to fix the future is to get out...all the way out, with funding and with troops. But even if we did that, which we more than likely won't, the world will still be suffer the results of the damage that's been done for decades and generations to come.

a reply to: Blackmarketeer

And it's not just Hillary or America. Here's an interview with David Cameron.

He starts talking about Syria around the 4 minute mark. Then he's asked about why the UK made a deal with Saudi Arabia to be allowed on the Humans Rights Council of the United Nations (around the 5:50 mark). It takes until the 6:38 mark for him to start admitting the special relationship between the UK & Saudi Arabia.

As for the OP, I agree that the financiers and the others who arm & fund them should be stopped first. But I highly doubt that will ever happen. Western countries (especially the US) have bases all throughout the Arabian Peninsula; including Qatar, which is the other major Wahhabi powerbroker. Qatar is a small country with only 280,000 or so citizens (and another 2 million migrant workers), so it's not like it would take a full scale war to stop their leadership.

But I've said it plenty of times, the West backs these people. The Wahhabis are loyal to the petrodollar, purchase lucrative defense contracts from the West, and invest heavily in Western companies & industries. They also provide the "rebel" soldiers who can be our proxy fighters when we need "boots on the ground" in a proxy war. They did this in Afghanistan vs Russia, in Chechnya against Russia's allies, in the Balkans, as the "rebels" in Libya against Qaddafi, and more.

In fact, people forget the main reason Bin Laden had a falling out with the Saudi royal family. He wanted his Wahhabi fighters & their allies to defend Saudi Arabia from Saddam (before the Gulf War), but the Saudi royals wanted the US & its allies instead. Then he kept running his mouth against the royals, so the royals had him exiled. Think about that for a second. The Saudi royals have such a strong bond with the Western militaries that they'd even choose the West to protect them over their own Wahhabi fighters (hence the bases).

Saudi Arabia even does that now. Their Wahhabi powerbrokers call for foreign jihads, but the government won't let most of the fighters return to the kingdom afterwards. There's a reason for that too, but I don't know if I'd have enough time to explain it. But just note this: the Wahhabis in Saudi Arabia are a faction. Not all Saudis are Wahhabi & not all Wahhabis are violent. Most of the Saudi royals are actually more liberal than they let on, but the Wahhabis are like their Tea Party on steroids. So the government appeases them while also working with organizations to contain them. It seems they're trying to prevent any more uprisings like the Grand Mosque seizure.

originally posted by: TruthxIsxInxThexMist
a reply to: Blackmarketeer

You missed an important one:

CCTV all over the place won't stop a terrorist act!

1 or 2% need to be watched... the other 98% do not.

To be fair, CCTV won't stop domestic violence killings, gang & organized crime killings, killings during robberies, or any other form of killings. So if the goal's to save lives in general, watching just the 1or 2% like you said won't work.

originally posted by: lambros56

originally posted by: ReadLeader
a reply to: abe froman

If any of you remember the Iran hostage crisis..... it has not gotten better....just worse....As I mentioned in another thread. ... let's elect Trump and bomb the $hI+ out of them!!!


www.history.com...

We've been bombing the # out of these people in the Middle East for over a decade.....
and look where it's got us.

True...the problem with this is that the US never took over the oil...you can blame the previous and current president for that.

If Trump gets in...you know he will finish the job that cost the US trillions of dollars and thousands of US solider lives.