The Debt Collective, Student Debt Strike Gaining Momentum

I'm also one of those people who put themselves through a major university by working lame jobs.

It really was an incentive to get my degree in Engineering by working at fast food, factories, fruit picking, forklift driving (seasonal) and other jobs that don't pay well. I lived frugally and was debt free on graduation.

I was really a starving college student.

Others can do it as well.

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: Ameilia

Yeah 18 year olds are perfectly capable of making these descisons.

What a joke

Then 18 year olds shouldn't vote either?

a reply to: onequestion

Let's see... according to progressives, teens are mature enough to have abortions without parents permission. They are mature enough at age 5 to know they should be transgendered. They are mature enough to enter the military. Mature enough to vote.
Yet now when it comes to student loans, they are too dumb? GTFO.

Student loan debt is a problem. However, the solution isn't more student loans. Nor should we be forgiving existing student loans.

College costs are out of control because of this false notion that every kid with a GED ought to go to college. In addition, since the student financing is basically guaranteed, colleges have no incentive to control costs since the consumer (students) are willing to leverage themselves to the hilt to attend.

If you want college costs to decrease, you have to limit student loans. The market will then adjust based on value of the particular school since the financing will control what schools can charge. For example, a star student might get a $100k student loans to attend MIT in engineering. In addition, a prudent bank is going to want to ensure the student is getting good grades, etc throughout their college career. However, that same bank would not lend $100k to a 2.5 GPA student to attend Podunk U. So Podunk U is probably only going to charge maybe say $5k in tuition vs the $50k that MIT can charge. Granted the career prospects out of the two are a little different, but you at least don't get these students graduating with mortgage sized student loans from these bottom tier schools anymore.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
Well, I can see the students getting some support if they can show the job placement rate was indeed a lie. Otherwise, they don't own the banks, and if the banks stop offering loans, no one is going to college except the rich.

It used to be possible to afford college on nothing more than a full time low wage summer job. No loans, no scholarships.

Getting the government/banks out of college funding is a way to return to that, given time.

Just WHO is going to fund it if not the government of WE THE PEOPLE?

College for all who qualify benefits us all and we all should participate in funding it. But Big Business has to pay their 'fair' share of taxes as they receive the most benefit (and complain about lack of well educated employees). Want to slow immigration - educate our citizens.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

if the banks stop offering loans, no one is going to college except the rich.

Loans are what causes rates to go up .

Prices are set by what the consumer is willing to pay. Popcorn cost pennies but Movie theatres charges the customer $10 because they are willing to pay it.

Loans are no different. If everyone can get loans for 100K to attend college that is what colleges are going to charge you to go to school.

Take away loans or decrease loan amounts, and the price of college would significantly drop to rates that are affordable by the majority.

This has happened in every industry that loans became the norm. Car industry, leisure industry, education, homes, heck even the mattress industry.

I went to a store the other day next to a mattress store who had a sign that said everyone gets approved. I was intrigued since I haven't had to buy a mattress in quite a while and I wanted to see what a mattress looks like that requires a loan. I was shocked at what a normal mattresses cost , in the thousands and nothing special about them.

Loans are a catch 22 and opens the door for consumer raping.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
Well, I can see the students getting some support if they can show the job placement rate was indeed a lie. Otherwise, they don't own the banks, and if the banks stop offering loans, no one is going to college except the rich.

Well according to supply and demand, if the banks stopped offering loans, then less people would be able to go to college. Therefore, the demand decreases, so supply will go through the roof. Thus price decreases. Once the price stabilizes again, poorer people would be able to go to college again. Though, the poorest would still be S.O.L.

originally posted by: Edumakated
College costs are out of control because of this false notion that every kid with a GED ought to go to college. In addition, since the student financing is basically guaranteed, colleges have no incentive to control costs since the consumer (students) are willing to leverage themselves to the hilt to attend.

Being in industrial sales I see this all the time. Many of our larger customers (Stryker, Boeing, Sikorsky, Colt, etc.) cannot get enough qualified CNC operators to fill the shifts the have available. If many of these college students shifted to a trade instead of a worthless Humanities or Liberal Arts degree they could be making solid salaries within a few years.

The 'everyone needs to go to college' paradigm is brought to you by universities which are in the education business.

a reply to: FyreByrd

Bernie Sanders has the best solution.

Tax Wall Street speculation.

We bailed them out now they bail us out.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: Edumakated
College costs are out of control because of this false notion that every kid with a GED ought to go to college. In addition, since the student financing is basically guaranteed, colleges have no incentive to control costs since the consumer (students) are willing to leverage themselves to the hilt to attend.

Being in industrial sales I see this all the time. Many of our larger customers (Stryker, Boeing, Sikorsky, Colt, etc.) cannot get enough qualified CNC operators to fill the shifts the have available. If many of these college students shifted to a trade instead of a worthless Humanities or Liberal Arts degree they could be making solid salaries within a few years.

The 'everyone needs to go to college' paradigm is brought to you by universities which are in the education business.

Americans as a whole tend to view any kind of manual labor as unappealing. Going to college used to be a ticket to white collar careers that had higher pay than many of the blue collar jobs in an era where graduating from high school was good enough. Unfortunately, there are only so many high paying white collar fields now due to productivity gains so not everyone is going to get a plumb corporate job. However, too many waste their time going to these worthless schools getting worthless degrees when they would have been better off just learning a trade in high school and a real usable skill.

a reply to: Edumakated

Building trades used to pay a lot more than regular jobs and they have more upward mobility.

The problem is that between immigration and the housing crisis all construction took a massive poop.

It's very hard very very competitive market now and a lot of people who were in the trades are now becoming radiologist and accountants.

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: FyreByrd

Bernie Sanders has the best solution.

Tax Wall Street speculation.

We bailed them out now they bail us out.

Transaction taxes might help in a short term, but might reduce capital gains taxes later.

And I thought the "bailouts" were loans and most are already paid back?

The problems still exist.

The amount of debt relief students may get is probably equal to the number of Congressmen who are investors in said Colleges. The school still gets paid even when they commit fraud? Someone else have an explanation?

originally posted by: onequestion
The problem is that between immigration and the housing crisis all construction took a massive poop.

The industries I mentioned above have nothing to do with construction and were hiring during the recession as well.

Several offer apprentice programs and others have starting pay of $60,000+ (and benefits) for experienced machinists.

First off, I agree that our economy sucks, our job market sucks, and college is expensive as hell. I myself had a hard time finding the job I have now. But let me make one thing clear:

If you are so dumb as to go into tens of thousands of dollars of debt in order to get your education, you are a total idiot and are a part of the problem.

It's simple supply and demand. As long as total idiots are going to go into such extreme debt to pay for an education, then colleges will continue to increase the cost of tuition. This will continue until people stop being total idiots and refuse to go into debt to pay for their educations.

I didn't take the shortcut. I worked a minimum wage job for 8 years to pay for a degree from a community college. I have a better job now, I'm much happier, and I don't dread going into work anymore (well most of the time, anyway). I have never taken out a loan or owned a credit card. I'm not in any debt whatsoever. But I'm 30 years old and have just started my career. That 8 years I spent flipping burgers most other people would have wanted to spend at universities working on a PhD. If that's the road you took and you used loans to get there, you have no sympathy from me. Pay off your debt - no one forced you to take it in the first place and it's only just that you suffer the consequences for your actions. It's not the place of society to pamper you and hand you every one of your expectations on a silver platter.

I hate banks as much as anyone else, they are corrupt and engage in shady business practices - you can find any number of examples on ATS. But student loans are one case where I don't think they are doing anything wrong. It was your decision to take out a loan and try to take the shortcut through life. You know I have scars on my hands from all the cuts and burns I got at my last job - but I still wouldn't have done things any other way, because I don't want to be in debt. This is a case where a lot of people are faced with a choice, and they make the obviously bad one. No sympathy.

Damn brother, calm down. I can't help but feel like that was like directly aimed at me and my post. I know I effed up early on in life, that's cool. I don't blame anyone else but myself and my choices but I also don't hold onto regrets. Instead i turn regrets into lessons.

I've lived a pretty interesting and fulfilling life all while doing it outside the box. It sounds like you've got your plan all mapped out and good for you. I just wanted to point out that some people like myself have fell into the system. If you want resort to name calling me an idiot then that's on you. That's your true colors reflecting buddy, have a great weekend.

a reply to: peskyhumans

originally posted by: xuenchen
Then 18 year olds shouldn't vote either?

No, they shouldn't. Lower the drinking age to 16 so that people go out and do irresponsible things when their parents still help them. Raise the voting age to 25. Raise the age you're legally an adult to 25 too. At that point you actually have some experience in the world and can support yourself. That's also shortly after the time your brain finishes developing.

My voter ID card came in the mail today, I found the concept so ridiculous as to how easy it is to register. Sign a form and wait. There's no attempt to explain what the issues are and no attempt to see if the voter can say what they think the issues and solutions are.

originally posted by: FyreByrd
Just WHO is going to fund it if not the government of WE THE PEOPLE?

College for all who qualify benefits us all and we all should participate in funding it. But Big Business has to pay their 'fair' share of taxes as they receive the most benefit (and complain about lack of well educated employees). Want to slow immigration - educate our citizens.

The colleges? They already have the money to do so, from the ivy leagues to the state schools they all have quite large endowments. If they wanted to off of just the returns from those endowments they could send most of their students to college for free, but they don't. To be fair the smaller schools don't have these things but it's still an easy fix.

You make the college supply the money to attend their classes. Where they get it from doesn't really matter... endowments, bank loans, or anything else. The colleges loan that money out to the students to attend. If the student finds the loan deal reasonable they go, and if not they go to a school that gives them a better deal. Since this system puts the college on the hook for the value of the loan it's in their interest to minimize the size of it, and maximize the chance the person can graduate and repay it.

As long as the nation is committed to not giving free education to all, it becomes necessary for a system like this to give both parties a fair deal.

a reply to: peskyhumans

I don't mean to belittle your achievement, I have a CC degree too (also obtained with no loans). Community College degrees however aren't worth the paper they're printed on. I actually use mine as a coaster.

Statistically you will make more money with nothing more than a HS degree than with an Associates. Even most HR departments filter out people with Associates before they mass filter people with no degree. Having one is quite literally worse than not having one.

a reply to: onequestion

Education should be free