Wow, Proof Positive The Judicial System Has Failed...For The Millionth Time.

originally posted by: Legman
a reply to: Jenisiz

You worry too much about stars and too little about different viewpoints... think about it bra.




sort of how isis works.


but you will never see this.


cheers

really did you just do that....? and throw in an isis label while you are at it ?....take a break dude....you just made a leap from johnny rotten selling coke to stars and isis....talk about a slow day......

I agree with the OP why on earth does a coke dealer get a free ride when users get jailed....this system is so broken its quite sad bordering on pathetic

originally posted by: rockintitz

Wow, Proof Positive The Judicial System Has Failed...For The Millionth Time.

So you're saying that there's at least 999,999 other times this has happened.

When's the proverbial "S" supposed to start to "HTF"?

Look at the number of people alone currently locked up for possession of weed. 1000s are set to be released here in America alone from wrongful DNA reporting on top of that...yeah it's failing millions. Not to mention me and you. Judicial systems around the world are becoming corrupt, and just like mushroom said...it's money that's the culprit.

Did you miss the part in the article where the offender says he was pressured into selling? That is why he got off; he wasn't dealing because he wanted to, but because he was in debt and basically told he had to deal coke to pay off his debt. Intent is everything when it comes to justice.

originally posted by: Legman
Your title is stupid but somehow adequate for ATS.... but we have the best judicial system in the world... Move to Mexico or the middle east if you doubt me.



No you will not.


Cast stones anonymously.

you have the best legal system in the world......lmao....wait a minute.. hang on a sec i have to find it...

a reply to: Jenisiz

The guy owed money and was pressed into doing something illegal in order to "pay his debt". Things like that do happen. I think the judge made the right call frankly. Even if the guy was spouting total horse pucky, it's nice to see a judge give people the benefit of the doubt for a change.

The whole post is hypocritical; on the one hand it says "don't lock people up for non-violent crimes" on the other hand... "unless they are coc aine dealers"...? It's just another personal spin on locking up people we don't like instead of people that are dangerous to society.

Having said all of that, I do think that there is an incentive to lock up marijuana users because they tend to be about as non-violent as any (technical) law breaker is going to get. Nice, placid meat for the machine compared to most others. I just don't think that this one was necessarily a good example of that.

a reply to: Jenisiz

Wait wait. This looks like a first time offense. The defendant isn't a long time dealer and was forced to sell to clear a debt he had. Seems to me the judge was giving the kid a break for once and now you guys say this is a failing of the courts? Lol I celebrate whenever a drug conviction doesn't send someone to jail. Yes, even coc aine.

BTW, your blog makes a remark about the judge sending people away for marijuana but doesn't cite any figures as to who and how many he has sent away. Just that he's done it. Seems to me that is emotional rhetoric to get you to side against the judge who made a good decision.

This whole thread is a fail. You are getting angry because a judge DIDN'T ruin some kid's life over drugs and trying to position it as the judge being hypocritical for ruining other people's lives with different circumstances.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Not my blog and I'm not angry in the slightest. However coc aine imho is a much more serious drug. Regardless of being a first offense. I've counseled dozens on a first offense charge for intent to sale who've been in similar situations. You can't call it Justice when the rules don't apply to us all equally. I'm skeptical this guy owes anyone any money...if so the last thing he'd be doing is walking about smiling about it.

a reply to: DestroyDestroyDestroy
I've known quite a few individuals whom had no choice to sale due to unemployment being so high. Two of which were paying for medical expenses, one his daughter's chemo. He was locked up and they couldn't afford to pay. She passed during his sentence...where's justice in that? Imho, that is a sign it's failed.

a reply to: Jenisiz

I don't really care if the defendant's story is true or not. NO ONE and I repeat NO ONE should be put in jail for drug use or sales of any kind. The fact this guy got let off is a VICTORY, not some stupid excuse to spin it so we can lament on the judge's supposed jailing rate of marijuana convictions (that is noticeably absent from the source).

Yes, it is annoying that a guy who got busted selling coke got off while marijuana users go to jail, but those are different circumstances. I don't excuse sentencing marijuana users to jail, but using a coke case to highlight it is poor form. If you want to complain about marijuana sentencing, produce some numbers and make a thread about it, but don't throw some guy who happened to get lucky in the eyes of the law under the bus because the drug he was convicted of selling is considered worse than marijuana. Just be happy that the War on Drugs didn't claim another victim and ruin another person's life.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

That's the entire point, luck has no place in the justice system...period. Justice is supposed to be blind and universally applied to all parties which the article highlights. It has failed the system when the rules don't apply to everyone, criminal or not. People held under threat and forced to do crimes is nothing new, but getting off is in this case. The guy owes money to some shady individuals, he's obviously not some innocent non-streetwise kid.

I believe all drugs should be legal...it's people's choice what they choose to use or not. This however was a completely hypocritical sentence, again majority of inmates are there due to drug related offenses and he's not the first to be held under duress. Justice was not blind here, it was opinionated...plain and simple. Regardless my stance on drug usage, the judicial system was constructed to blindly serve it's citizens negating bias or opinion...are you saying it did for this "innocent" man? And I hate to even take it there, but if it was a minority dealer, I doubt this would've even happened.

Huffington Post -

America's prisons are dangerously overcrowded, and the war on drugs is mainly to blame.

Over 50 percent of inmates currently in federal prison are there for drug offenses, according to an infographic recently released by the Federal Bureau of Prisons (see chart below). That percentage has risen fairly consistently over decades, all the way from 16 percent in 1970.

The second-largest category, immigration-related crimes, accounts for 10.6 percent of inmates. This means that people convicted of two broad categories of nonviolent crimes -- drugs and immigration -- make up over 60 percent of the U.S. prison population.

originally posted by: Jenisiz
a reply to: Krazysh0t

That's the entire point you appear inept at comprehending. Luck has no place in the justice system...period. Justice is supposed to be blind and universally applied to all parties which the article highlights. It has failed the system when the rules don't apply to everyone, criminal or not. People held under threat and forced to do crimes is nothing new, but getting off us in this case. The guy owes money to some shady individuals, he's obviously not some innocent non-streetwise kid.

I comprehended your point JUST fine. But now you are adding assumptions to the information provided. We don't know the circumstances on why he owed money or who he owed money to. In fact, it is irrelevant to the case and the information about it can't be taken into account when determining sentencing. All the judge can do is take the story the kid told him about being handed a bag of coke and told to sell it to clear his debt.

Besides, we also know he was a long time marijuana user. CLEARLY he knows some drug dealers. So that means it is also likely that he knows the game well enough to know some coke dealers. Heck, it's also possible they are friends. After all, I don't know many drug dealers willing to loan me money then hand me a bag of drugs and tell me to sell it to pay it back. But again, stop assuming things about the kid's character that wasn't provided. There are PLENTY of examples of upstanding individuals knowing a shady character or two that can provide a shady loan to them in a fix.

I believe all drugs should be legal...it's peoples choice what they choose to use or not. This however was a completely hypocritical sentence, again majority of inmates are there due to drug related offenses and he's not the first to be held under duress. Justice was not blind here, it was opinionated...plain and simple. Regardless my stance on drug usage, the judicial system was constructed to blindly serve it's citizens negating bias or opinion...are you saying it did for this "innocent" man? And I hate to even take it there, but if it was a minority dealer, I doubt this would've even happened.

There are people who get off all the time from drug convictions without going to jail. Like I said, he was a first time offender and he had a story that sounded credible to the judge, so he let him off. Maybe his race did play a part in it. Though only the judge knows that for a fact.

But you are being overly critical of the justice system. For one, the justice system is staffed by humans. Humans are prone to bias. For two, you haven't cross analyzed a SINGLE marijuana case where the judge sentenced the defendant to jail to see if he is being level across the board or not. All you have done is taken the one quote from your OVERLY sensationalized blog article saying the judge has sent tons of marijuana defendants to jail and are pretending like that is enough details to compare to this case just because the offending substance happened to be coc aine instead of marijuana.

Huffington Post

Maybe you are unfamiliar with my posting history, but I am VERY well informed about the war on drugs and the problems it is causing. Actually, come to think of it, you are posting a link explaining that our prisons are overcrowded and at the same time are demanding that this kid should have gone to jail instead of being let off. That is pretty damn hypocritical.

Instead of opining about this kid getting off, go opine about the marijuana users going to jail. The kid isn't the problem. The marijuana users going to jail IS the problem. This thread is a distraction to the real problem.

a reply to: Krazysh0t
To surmise, I'm saying the justice system has failed us by allowing a pass to a drug user and dealer who from what I've observed, is lying. He's a long time user and owes some serious people money. He's obviously dug himself a hole if they give him a gun and coke to pay off his debt. It doesn't take a rocket s scientist to figure out this guy played the system. They wouldn't hand out drugs and weapons to innocent Joe Schmo...think about that. The judge let a man walk who owes someone money that trusts this guy enough to sale blow for them. Of course he seemed stressed and under duress...he got caught selling coke as a dealer. He'd say anything to avoid jail time. Something isn't right here. Possession of marijuana is punishable by up to one year in jail and a minimum fine of $1,000 for a first conviction. He has coke and walks away. I am using this as an example to explain how the justice system is biased and the rules don't apply equally to everyone.

Stephanie George was sentenced to life in prison without parole at age 27 after the police found a lockbox of coc aine in her attic. The judge on the case defined her role as "a girlfriend and bag holder and money holder but not actively involved in the drug dealing, so certainly in my judgment it does not warrant a life sentence," The New York Times reports.

Edit: why is it that the forum won't let me spell coc aine?

a reply to: Jenisiz

I can pick out better examples than this of our justice system failing us. In this particular case, I believe it actually DIDN'T fail but administered justice correctly. All the other times when it sends drug users/sellers to jail is when it fails us.

A lot of the people being locked up are predominately poor. I don't have any stats off the top of my head to cite, but I'm sure if you looked at the demographics of those who are in prison, most of them don't have a ton of money.

Money buys your freedom.

Public defenders make money regardless if they win/loose a case. They usually are young, inexperienced and really wish they were doing something else. The money sucks doing PD work, but its considered valuable experience -- so they do it.

The PD's have a vested interest in getting along with the prosecutor. Someday, they'd like the cushy job of being a prosecutor!

The whole system is rigged based on who you know, what lawyer you hire, what judge you get...

Go to a bar near the courthouse or near the area of town where all the law firms are. You'll see prosecutors and defense attorneys slapping each other on the back and buying each other drinks. The same thing happens with Republican and Democrat politicians. A lot of politicians were/are lawyers. . .

The court systems are so backlogged right now, that people are being rammed through without jury trials. It's faster to just scare the crap out of someone and tell them to take a plea deal than to careful examine the evidence in a discovery phase to look for anything that can be exploited at trial.

Prisons...the new homeless shelters of America....

originally posted by: Jenisiz
a reply to: Legman

When a justice system can't hand out equal sentences then, imho, it has failed. Justice is only Justice when all men are treated equal and punished equally as well. Sorry if you found my title moronic...maybe next time you can try reading the article before posting as you'd find the title fits what the article describes pretty well.

all men HAVE NEVER been treated equal, I don't know if you are young and/or idealistic, or simply naïve. I'm 62, and have seen and learned over time, that being treated equal is an aberration rather than the norm. in this capitalistic system, money, more than anything will buy you equality at the least, and preference at the best. cynical view, I know, but one that is not without truth.
we are taught about "equality" from an early age, so as to promote the best qualities in ourselves. each of us wish for this, and a few strive and attain it. it is something we have been trying to perfect over thousands of years, and yet there are those that work at achieving the opposite.

originally posted by: Legman
Your title is stupid but somehow adequate for ATS.... but we have the best judicial system in the world... Move to Mexico or the middle east if you doubt me.



No you will not.

Cast stones anonymously.

I am a US citizen and must say the US does NOT have the best judicial system in the world. Anyone who believes this truly needs to go out and experience the world.

We are also no where close to having the worst judicial system in the world, I have to make this clear before someone tells me to move to the Middle East if I do not like the US judicial system.


Can the US do better? I hope so, but currently we have a War on Drugs that locks up more drug offenders than violent criminals.

This is a great injustice!

a reply to: jimmyx

Trust me, I know all to well that it's not equal. I'm a black 32 year old that has been constantly hassled by police for doing nothing wrong. My step mom who's close with the DA here has managed to get a Sheriff and two officers terminated after witnessing first hand.

The system has failed when individuals who can't afford proper representation are reprimanded for being poor. A judicial system that requires money to prove innocence is broken. This guy clearly wasn't innocent and I don't have to assume anything to arrive at that verdict. First time weed dealers...even people with a gram of weed and no intent to sale get slapped harder than this guy. It's not right...people can't seem to grasp that in this thread. Every time someone buys their innocence, the system has failed us all.

originally posted by: Jenisiz
a reply to: jimmyx

Trust me, I know all to well that it's not equal. I'm a black 32 year old that has been constantly hassled by police for doing nothing wrong. My step mom who's close with the DA here has managed to get a Sheriff and two officers terminated after witnessing first hand.

The system has failed when individuals who can't afford proper representation are reprimanded for being poor. A judicial system that requires money to prove innocence is broken. This guy clearly wasn't innocent and I don't have to assume anything to arrive at that verdict. First time weed dealers...even people with a gram of weed and no intent to sale get slapped harder than this guy. It's not right...people can't seem to grasp that in this thread. Every time someone buys their innocence, the system has failed us all.

your step-mom is one of the few that thrived and got justice. not knowing the full legal details of "this guy", I will take your word on it. legal punishment of personal self-inflicted "sins", has been the bane of man for a very long time. it will not end soon enough.

a reply to: jimmyx
I'm hoping for change. I happened to be lucky she was carpooling with me on the way back from a family dinner. My vehicle looked suspicious so they proceeded to search it with dogs even going as far as having me remove my subs from the boxes. She is a City Director so it paid off luckily...others not so much and this was just a drop in the bucket.

I got handcuffed in Scottsdale for stopping two Caucasian 20 somethings from stealing my car. The police believed I was dealing and that they were searching my car for cash or drugs. After my lawyer showed up I got an apology and the two thieves got a warning...system is all wrong. I hope you're right though, something needs to change.

a reply to: DestroyDestroyDestroy

He may have become a snitch and that was good enough for the judge to let him off. Give up the higher level dealer and get off the hook.....

This happens often with drug busts.