Humans Trekked Out of Africa Via Egypt, Study Suggests

The major gateway for modern humans out of Africa may have been Egypt, a new genetic analysis suggests.

This finding may help scientists reconstruct how humans evolved as they wandered across the globe, the researchers added.

Modern humans first arose about 200,000 years ago in Africa south of the Sahara. When and how the modern human lineage crossed the Sahara and dispersed from Africa has long been controversial.

Previous research suggested the exodus from Africa started between 70,000 and 40,000 years ago. However, a recent study hinted that modern humans might have begun their march across the globe as early as 130,000 years ago, and continued their expansion out of Africa in multiple waves. [See Photos of Our Closest Human Ancestor]

Scientists had suggested two routes for the exodus from Africa. One, known as the northern route, has humans exiting through what is now Egypt and Sinai. The other, the southern route, brought humans through what is now Ethiopia and Arabia. The available evidence for either migratory path remains inconclusive.
www.livescience.com...
www.cell.com...(15)00156-1
More detailed link.^

Pls klik^ for much more,seemed like the southern route just lost out to the northern one although not exclusively,also the massive mix in the current Egyptian population is much more recent, like 750yrs ago that came with the spread of Islam.
Pls excuse me if I seemed inattentive of this thread quite busy with new beach project, on line time cut drastically

a reply to: Spider879

Interesting…scientists are also reporting to have found another fossil similar to Lucy but older and in another part of Africa

then what accounts for the dozens of Neanderthal sites all over Israel-Palestine/Levant?

long occupied sites, say from 50,000 y.a. to the most recent dwellings closer to 20-30,000 y.a.
dis Neanderthals migrate with the sapiens?
did some groups/clans/tribes of Neanderthals just stay on the Arab Peninsula instead of braving the Ice caves of Europe-Asia ?

a reply to: St Udio

of course also I live on rock that is 4.5 billion years old, so really we only have records from un glaciated, unscraped, land masses, that aren't now out on the flooded continental shelf
so our total history will NEVER be known

Interesting stuff.

Im one who exercises thought, that leans less away from human origins from Africa, and more from Antarctica.

The flash freeze of the super continental land mass of Antarctica, hides so much history that has been unseen for for possibly hundreds of thousands of years.

The escape from such catastrophe, that is whatever caused the great deluge, and froze two hemispheres thst obviously were not always frozen, lead to a continental retreat.

The Earth's wobble, is evidence something shook things up pretty badly.

The southern most parts of the globe, which would be north of Antarctica, we're the closest regions to retreat to, hence "origins" in Africa, South America, South Australia (which has long genetic history of black species as well).

I made a thread about this some months ago here.

The more we research, the more we uncover, the closer to our origin we come. Got to wonder why military, top global scientists and multi national governments are so interested about when it comes to Antarctica.

They are all there niw and have been since the nazI times.

Thanks for sharing, good luck on your beach project

originally posted by: Danbones
a reply to: St Udio

of course also I live on rock that is 4.5 billion years old,...

We can only concern our historical record with the most recent 150 million years.... when the way was finally clear for mammals including humans to dominate the planet & flourish....

so... of your noted 4.5 billion years ~~ toss aside 4.35 Billion of those years as having no anthropomorphic histories or fossilized records... the only thing pertinent for humans during those 4.35 billion years was in creating a biosphere for evolution to take hold

a reply to: Spider879

Cool. This more or less corroborates an earlier study released this past January. The earlier study found that AMH were in Egypt ~130Ka- 150KA and didn't cross from Yemen to Arabia until ~130-100KA but that they all sort of met up in the Levant in a generalized time frame. Though that "generalized" time frame has a range of 20-30 KA. It would appear that the newer study you are citing is based on genetic data whereas the earlier study was based on a mapping artifacts across east Africa, North Africa and the ME.

news.nationalgeographic.com...

originally posted by: St Udio
then what accounts for the dozens of Neanderthal sites all over Israel-Palestine/Levant?

long occupied sites, say from 50,000 y.a. to the most recent dwellings closer to 20-30,000 y.a.

Neanderthal, unlike HSS, was not an African derived hominid. They are an entirely European species in regards to the evolution and development. When weather became harsher in Europe they moved South, landing them in the Levant, Iraq etc... I'm not aware of any sites that are as recent as 20-30 KA. The only sites I know of that fall into that date range are on Gibraltar if I remember correctly.

dis Neanderthals migrate with the sapiens?

Migrate? No. But there is ample evidence of their cohabitation at some sites in the Levant as well as shared lithic technology. When the HSS first met the Levantine Neanderthal, the HN actually had better quality tools and taught the HSS how to make them.

did some groups/clans/tribes of Neanderthals just stay on the Arab Peninsula instead of braving the Ice caves of Europe-Asia ?

As I mentioned above, no. They moved into the ME when temps dropped enough that they could survive there. When temps went back up, their bodies weren't developed to deal with the increased heat very well and moved back north.

a reply to: peter vlar

So in the Book of Genesis, when Cain is expelled from Eden for killing Abel (his brother), he had a famous concern:

Genesis 4:14-4:15
Today you are driving me from the land, and I will be hidden from your presence; I will be a restless wanderer on the earth, and whoever finds me will kill me.
But the LORD said to him, "Not so; anyone who kills Cain will suffer vengeance seven times over." Then the LORD put a mark on Cain so that no one who found him would kill him.

Was he talking about Neanderthals? I mean, playing along that the story is true.

If you think about it, when the Homo Sapiens first left Africa they encountered other hominids all throughout the world.

The modern human is truly a "mutt", although mostly "Homo Sapien".

It's funny when people use this to support racist arguments too, because modern black people have little to no admixture from Neanderthals (or Denisovans in Asia), while Europeans and Asians do. I mean, you can make some truly absurd statements misusing this info if you try. Like this:

Ex.:
White people are smarter on average than black people because white people are part Neanderthal, and Neanderthals had larger brains than Homo Sapien.

The next Hitler will be a black man.

a reply to: r0xor

It's funny when people use this to support racist arguments too, because modern black people have little to no admixture from Neanderthals (or Denisovans in Asia), while Europeans and Asians do.

Actually, almost all africans are now shown to have small amounts of Neanderthal dna and some eastern africans have minute amounts of denisovan dna.
The tropical west africans that don't have any Neanderthal dna do have a corresponding amount of DNA from an as yet identified African specific archaic.

a reply to: Spider879

This is one of my favourite toys...

www.bradshawfoundation.com...

...it is pretty near the cutting edge, as such, you need to use some discretion with some of the theories masquerading as "facts" but even so, hours and hours of fun for exploring the various possibilities and ideas out there.

originally posted by: punkinworks10
a reply to: r0xor

It's funny when people use this to support racist arguments too, because modern black people have little to no admixture from Neanderthals (or Denisovans in Asia), while Europeans and Asians do.

Actually, almost all africans are now shown to have small amounts of Neanderthal dna and some eastern africans have minute amounts of denisovan dna.
The tropical west africans that don't have any Neanderthal dna do have a corresponding amount of DNA from an as yet identified African specific archaic.

Wow really? I didn't know that, that's pretty awesome.

I knew Eastern Africans had small amounts of Neanderthal, but this as of yet undiscovered Western African hominid ancestor is pretty intriguing.

a reply to: r0xor

Yeah, the last 15 years have been amazing in Anthropology. Between the Human Genome Project,
Neanderthal Genome Project and all of the data obtained from those correlations and the final nails in Clovis First coffin plus the increased sensitivity of genetic testing alone the entire field has jumped light years ahead if where it was in the late 80's/early 90's. Here's some reference for the unknown hominid lineage as well- www.sciencedirect.com... ccp=y

a reply to: St Udio

That would seem to, if the study is correct, indicate that the migration into the Lavant was simultaneous, or at least close together.

Though I seem to recall reading that Neanderthal may have originated in colder climes, and traveled south.

If this study is correct, it would seem much remains to be learned of our ancestors.

originally posted by: r0xor

originally posted by: punkinworks10
a reply to: r0xor

It's funny when people use this to support racist arguments too, because modern black people have little to no admixture from Neanderthals (or Denisovans in Asia), while Europeans and Asians do.

Actually, almost all africans are now shown to have small amounts of Neanderthal dna and some eastern africans have minute amounts of denisovan dna.
The tropical west africans that don't have any Neanderthal dna do have a corresponding amount of DNA from an as yet identified African specific archaic.

Wow really? I didn't know that, that's pretty awesome.

I knew Eastern Africans had small amounts of Neanderthal, but this as of yet undiscovered Western African hominid ancestor is pretty intriguing.

But couldn't this small amount of Neander dna came from contacts with trades men especially during the Swahili ascendancy on the east coast.

a reply to: Spider879

It's possible.

In fact, given the amount that's unknown? That's as likely as anything else...

originally posted by: Spider879

originally posted by: r0xor

originally posted by: punkinworks10
a reply to: r0xor

It's funny when people use this to support racist arguments too, because modern black people have little to no admixture from Neanderthals (or Denisovans in Asia), while Europeans and Asians do.

Actually, almost all africans are now shown to have small amounts of Neanderthal dna and some eastern africans have minute amounts of denisovan dna.
The tropical west africans that don't have any Neanderthal dna do have a corresponding amount of DNA from an as yet identified African specific archaic.

Wow really? I didn't know that, that's pretty awesome.

I knew Eastern Africans had small amounts of Neanderthal, but this as of yet undiscovered Western African hominid ancestor is pretty intriguing.

But couldn't this small amount of Neander dna came from contacts with trades men especially during the Swahili ascendancy on the east coast.

Spider,
Yes, some of the admixture is recent and relates to eurasians moving into east africa relatively recently, less than 4k years,and its with these people that the denisovan component shows up, but Neanderthal admixture shows up in San populatiions that have been gentically isolated for nearly 40,000 years, their admixture levels are minute but still there.

originally posted by: punkinworks10

originally posted by: Spider879

originally posted by: r0xor

originally posted by: punkinworks10
a reply to: r0xor

It's funny when people use this to support racist arguments too, because modern black people have little to no admixture from Neanderthals (or Denisovans in Asia), while Europeans and Asians do.

Actually, almost all africans are now shown to have small amounts of Neanderthal dna and some eastern africans have minute amounts of denisovan dna.
The tropical west africans that don't have any Neanderthal dna do have a corresponding amount of DNA from an as yet identified African specific archaic.

Wow really? I didn't know that, that's pretty awesome.

I knew Eastern Africans had small amounts of Neanderthal, but this as of yet undiscovered Western African hominid ancestor is pretty intriguing.

But couldn't this small amount of Neander dna came from contacts with trades men especially during the Swahili ascendancy on the east coast.

Spider,
Yes, some of the admixture is recent and relates to eurasians moving into east africa relatively recently, less than 4k years,and its with these people that the denisovan component shows up, but Neanderthal admixture shows up in San populatiions that have been gentically isolated for nearly 40,000 years, their admixture levels are minute but still there.

The Khoisans are carriers?..wow! I'd peg them as the least likely candidates, so there must have been a few Neanderthals who ventured further south than the Levant, matter of fact I don't see why geographically speaking they would not have been able to do so given their extremely ancient presence .

originally posted by: Spider879

The Khoisans are carriers?..wow! I'd peg them as the least likely candidates, so there must have been a few Neanderthals who ventured further south than the Levant, matter of fact I don't see why geographically speaking they would not have been able to do so given their extremely ancient presence .

Not necessarily. Southern Levant/Iraq seems to be the extent of their Southernmost range based on currently known remains and Mousterian tools. Obviously that's subject to change if something new comes to light but the time frame of these extensions south seems to coincide with a change in climate where the ME became slightly colder and more hospitable to Neanderthal. There are no remains, either physical Neanderthal or Mousterian tools across the Red Sea into Egypt or anywhere else in Africa. Most of their genes being found in the Khoi-San people seems to be from a later regression of Europeans back into Africa approximately 3KA. Physically, there is no reason they could not have made the trek into Africa. the limiting factor seems to be their intolerance to warmer climates. It also ties in with recent finds the last few years that extends their range farther East into Siberia (about 1200 miles/2000 km farther east than previously known). There is also a possible Neanderthal site in China as well which would extend their range and successfulness even farther.


news.nationalgeographic.com...

en.wikipedia.org...#/media/File:Carte_Neandertaliens.jpg

www.newscientist.com...

a reply to: peter vlar
Peter,
dont forget about morrocan neanderthals, they seem to get forgoten alot.
Infact one of the morrocan site is one of those site where we see cultural continuity acroos the transition from HSN to AMH.