Republican Congress Strips Women and Gays of Rights Under Guise of ‘Religious Freedom’

originally posted by: Onslaught2996

originally posted by: poncho1982


Apparently as hard as it is for you to see that it's NOT DISCRIMINATION to refuse a cake for a gay wedding. (an event, not a person)

It IS DISCRIMINATION to refuse to serve gays in general. (meaning, if you just flat out refuse to serve gays all the time because you don't like them)

But refusing YOUR services to an event you have religious objections to... not discriminatory.

I was not going to reply to this because of the lack of intelligence.

Denying someone based on your beliefs is discrimination.

discrimination

1.
an act or instance of discriminating, or of making a distinction.
2.
treatment or consideration of, or making a distinction in favor of or against, a person or thing based on the group, class, or category to which that person or thing belongs rather than on individual merit:
racial and religious intolerance and discrimination.
3.
the power of making fine distinctions; discriminating judgment:
She chose the colors with great discrimination.
4.
Archaic. something that serves to differentiate.

Making or designing a cake for the public is considered a service and to deny that service to someone based on their lifestyle is discrimination. Get it.

So I assume then that if you were a baker and someone wanted a cake that said "Rape all women"...you would gladly do that? Even with it being repulsive to you? I have to assume you would from your last sentence. And if so...you are truly an ass.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

OK people quit your dang pouting.

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE

So I assume then that if you were a baker and someone wanted a cake that said "Rape all women"...you would gladly do that? Even with it being repulsive to you? I have to assume you would from your last sentence. And if so...you are truly an ass.

Again extremes with you people..ugh!

What sane person would actually do this..

Live in your fantasy world..but the reality is...no one would do this. Asking to a baker to make a cake asking for people to commit a crime is idiotic.

originally posted by: arpgme
a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

The difference is the baker would say "I'm sorry but I can't do that" while the gay person says "screw your God...make my cake". So who is wrong here?

Actually, the baker would be saying...

"screw the justice system and laws against discrimination made so that each citizen can be treated as equal. Screw treating others as you would like to be treated."

To which the gay person responds,

"Then your business is unlawful and should be brought to justice to make sure others aren't discriminated against."

This is about The Christian God the same one who says to obey the laws of the land?

The same God who says to treat others as you would like to be treated yet now some religious hypocritically cry discrimination and persecution while wanting to treat gays the same way?

Legally...you are correct. The gay person can legally force the baker to break the rules and laws of his God...a thing that may be more important to him than life itself. You are legally right...but morally so very wrong. And any law forcing someone who believes like that do go against his religion, is about as bad of a thing to do to another person as I can imagine.

I wouldn't do that to anyone. You would just like the gay person in the story chose to do. Enjoy living with that. I couldn't.

originally posted by: Onslaught2996

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE

So I assume then that if you were a baker and someone wanted a cake that said "Rape all women"...you would gladly do that? Even with it being repulsive to you? I have to assume you would from your last sentence. And if so...you are truly an ass.

Again extremes with you people..ugh!

What sane person would actually do this..

Live in your fantasy world..but the reality is...no one would do this. Asking to a baker to make a cake asking for people to commit a crime is idiotic.

Not extreme...accurate. You know quite well that my quote is no more distasteful than breaking his morals to his God is to a religious person.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

The gay person saying to the baker, "I don't care about your stupid religion and I don't believe in your God so I'm going to force you act against your God's wishes even when you believe you will be damned in Hell for it" could also be called discrimination.

The gay person would be wrong because it isn't against the baker faith to make the cake for the gay person. The big religions say it is a sin to be a homosexual but no where in their holy books does it say it is a sin to do business with a homosexual. Mainly because another persons sexual preference is no one else's business. It is only the Creators place to judge a persons sexuality.

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE

But I know you understand my point. While I don't believe in God or like religion, I do realize that the 10 commandments wouldn't be a bad thing for society to adopt. It wouldn't be a bad thing to promote one parent to be a stay-at-home parent nor would it be a bad thing to teach kids that pot isn't a good choice. We need things to aspire to. Much like there can't be a God without a Devil. There can't be good...without things we decide are bad.

Some of them sure. Like don't kill, steal, lie, bang your neighbors wife, etc. But then there are some others that just don't fit like Not worshiping any other Gods. That is a totally opposing view to anyone other than a Christian. It's certainly against the views of any non-believers.

Imagine being a christian and having to go to court in a building that had a monument to Baal outside that said "Worship Non Other Than Me Baal". Think you might be a bit nervous about how fair the hearing would go being that you don't worship Baal???

originally posted by: Onslaught2996

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE

So I assume then that if you were a baker and someone wanted a cake that said "Rape all women"...you would gladly do that? Even with it being repulsive to you? I have to assume you would from your last sentence. And if so...you are truly an ass.

Again extremes with you people..ugh!

What sane person would actually do this..

Live in your fantasy world..but the reality is...no one would do this. Asking to a baker to make a cake asking for people to commit a crime is idiotic.

What sane person would forcefully make a religious man break his allegiance to his God?

Oops...double.

originally posted by: mOjOm

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE

But I know you understand my point. While I don't believe in God or like religion, I do realize that the 10 commandments wouldn't be a bad thing for society to adopt. It wouldn't be a bad thing to promote one parent to be a stay-at-home parent nor would it be a bad thing to teach kids that pot isn't a good choice. We need things to aspire to. Much like there can't be a God without a Devil. There can't be good...without things we decide are bad.

Some of them sure. Like don't kill, steal, lie, bang your neighbors wife, etc. But then there are some others that just don't fit like Not worshiping any other Gods. That is a totally opposing view to anyone other than a Christian. It's certainly against the views of any non-believers.

Imagine being a christian and having to go to court in a building that had a monument to Baal outside that said "Worship Non Other Than Me Baal". Think you might be a bit nervous about how fair the hearing would go being that you don't worship Baal???

Yes

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE

Not extreme...accurate. You know quite well that my quote is no more distasteful than breaking his morals to his God is to a religious person.

How is any of what you said accurate.

Tell me how asking a baker to create something for two people who love another is the same as asking them to create a cake for violence against another?

Why can't you people see the difference? How hard is it?

Again quit pouting and trying to use extremes to make a point.

a reply to: mOjOm

its federal law...

and all portions of that law protect us all, in one way shape or form.. both the religious and the not religious..

if your job asks you to do something that goes even against your morals.. (even an atheist can have strong moral convictions about something such as lying to customers or what have you) you have the right to say no, you cannot and that federal law will protect you...

accommodation is something that all employers have to provide... a Sunday school teacher can request every Sunday morning off of her "real" job, and not risk loosing his/her real job over doing so... a satanist can need special time off for whatever their observances are, without fear of loosing their job... a Muslim can request break-times for their prayer - and not loose their job over it.. an atheist can tell their employer they wont tell a customer a lie, and not be fired for refusal...

whether you realize it or not... these laws protect everyone in one form or another... sure, a Muslim is better suited to a Muslim owned business.. but according to the left.. Muslims are not allowed to be Muslims in their own place of business.. because the business itself should be secular..same with Christians according to you, same with atheists who have morals according to you..same with the satanist who needs a special day off for some satanist type of holiday...again, according to you...

Its a big wide door you are willing to open.. these laws exist because they were necessary for one reason or another...

originally posted by: Onslaught2996

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE

Not extreme...accurate. You know quite well that my quote is no more distasteful than breaking his morals to his God is to a religious person.

How is any of what you said accurate.

Tell me how asking a baker to create something for two people who love another is the same as asking them to create a cake for violence against another?

Why can't you people see the difference? How hard is it?

Again quit pouting and trying to use extremes to make a point.

Man...you just don't get it. For some...a religious person's love for God is more important to them than anything. ANYTHING! Understand??? If you force them to insult or disobey their God...you might as well kill them. You see it as words on a cake, they see it as sacrilegious. I understand that you don't believe in all that stuff...neither do I. But I understand how that is just about the worst thing you can do to such a person.

And I'm done...if you don't get it, you never will.

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE

What sane person would forcefully make a religious man break his allegiance to his God?

If they didn't cherry pick what part of the bible, I might not have an issue.

Divorce, sex before marriage, remarry..etc.

Did they have any issue with these?

originally posted by: Onslaught2996

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE

What sane person would forcefully make a religious man break his allegiance to his God?

If they didn't cherry pick what part of the bible, I might not have an issue.

Divorce, sex before marriage, remarry..etc.

Did they have any issue with these?

Turning off the computer.

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE

Man...you just don't get it. For some...a religious person's love for God is more important to them than anything. ANYTHING! Understand??? If you force them to insult or disobey their God...you might as well kill them. You see it as words on a cake, they see it as sacrilegious. I understand that you don't believe in all that stuff...neither do I. But I understand how that is just about the worst thing you can do to such a person.

And I'm done...if you don't get it, you never will.

What part of the bible are they cherry picking from..if God is so important to them then do they ask everyone why they are baking a cake?

If God is important to them put a sign in the window that states.."if you have broken any of the ten commandments or have broken any of God's rules..then we will not serve" or "questions may be asked as to how loyal to the bible are you and service may be denied if we think you are not"

a reply to: OpinionatedB

Hold on. You're using way too many different examples that aren't comparable. For one, we need to separate relationships between employer and employee versus business and customer. We also need to separate the difference between a Religious Establishment and an Establishment that just has a Religious owner.

A church is an establishment that makes sense to cater to those of that religion. But a shoe store like any other shoe store that just happens to be owned by a christian is something different in my opinion.

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE

Turning off the computer.

You better because it is hard to argue for religious freedom when they decide to cherry pick bible parts.

a reply to: WeAreAWAKE

I guess it depends what your morals are. My morality is equality, for all to be treated fairly, to treat others as you would like to be treated. So, there would be no guilt ("live with that").

Luckily, The law agrees with the morality of my God to treat everyone fairly or we would continue living like the slavery days where women were second class cities.

Here's a humorous blog but truthful and showing hypocrisy:
10 Situations Where Christian Bakers Should Refuse To Bake Wedding Cakes

Here's an article about a bakery caught in hypocrisy:
Bakery Will Do Pagan, Cloning, and Divorce Cakes But Not Gay Weddings