Area 51 on ATC screen showing 3 aircraft.

a reply to: gariac

Or loose your wings.

a reply to: gariac

I had an idea of a chase plane too. But you'd imagine during Red Flag they'd curtail any important testing. I'm with you on F-16 proficiency training. What's not a better time to do some mock intercepts with all those blips flying around.

www.solipsys.com...
This is what we are looking at. BC3 - Battle Control Center. Looks like she's utilizing a mock IADS?

a reply to: aholic

Yeah, I think the article was wrong. This isn't aggressor ATC at all. We're looking at an integrated air defense radar picture. Man, things just got more interesting.

originally posted by: Kapusta

originally posted by: gariac

originally posted by: Kapusta
Maybe it's a training simulation program
Of them breaking the box ?




Just a guess.....

You don't break the box. In an emergency, you punch out and crash the plane before breaking the box. During Red Flag, if you break the box you are getting a lecture then going home.

Right ,well more of a reason for me to believe it was a simulation program .

No, those planes are probably flying over Groom Lake. They just aren't planes from weapons school, Red Flag, etc.

Sometime around 9:30AM, the base will fly non-Janet stuff. That is, the main batch of Janets have made their flights and there won't be another flight until noon. From scanner audio, you can tell whatever they are flying is doing proficiency training to stay current. Often simulated flame out exercises.

This is a SU-27 flying over Groom Lake.
youtu.be...

I spotted the SU-27 in "free territory". I suspect the base wanted it known that the SU-27 was being exploited.
www.lazygranch.com...

I'm not familiar with this sort of data display. Is there anything we can say about the speed of the aircraft from their tails?

Perhaps one is the black hawk going to buzz some visitors?

originally posted by: aholic
a reply to: Aarsvin

But three? So close together?

....the two north bound ones intrigue me the most.

Since you said you could tell us what they're not, I thought you meant Janets, and/or swamp gas. Personally I don't think all three of them are Janet flights.

The time says 19:53 UTC, isn't that around noon, 1PM or so pacific time? So that would be around the time Noon flights would be coming in, according to Zaphod.

Is there anything we know about how this system works? Personally, I'm not familiar with flight control stuff. Are the green points previous radar returns? If that is true, does that mean the 059 bird is giving off a low radar signature? However, there are green squares under it, it could be hovering as well, so maybe a helicopter?

And since the 08x and 092 birds are flying perpendicular, but not very close, relatively speaking(at least, I think), is this some sort of chase configuration?

Interesting stuff.

@gariac Probably a stupid question, but is there anyway to replicate foreign aircraft by stealing the blue prints, the specifications of hardware/software and then build it? Or based on a good guess place the aircraft in a simulator with similar traits and constraints?

I don't know squat about radar so this might be a rather worthless post but could it be possible that there is only one aircraft there and the other two are false returns generated by the single aircraft? Like as if they were testing something out?

originally posted by: Laxpla
@gariac Probably a stupid question, but is there anyway to replicate foreign aircraft by stealing the blue prints, the specifications of hardware/software and then build it? Or based on a good guess place the aircraft in a simulator with similar traits and constraints?

I think pretty much we just acquire the aircraft. Defectors and such. The SU-27 could be purchased for all I know. You can create shell companies to do the deal, or we get some other nation to do the purchase.

In Red Flag, the "reds" fly US jets in a manner that had similar performance to the real thing. So it is similar to your hypotheses, but the plane itself isn't replicated. Rather the performance is replicated.

originally posted by: BASSPLYR
I don't know squat about radar so this might be a rather worthless post but could it be possible that there is only one aircraft there and the other two are false returns generated by the single aircraft? Like as if they were testing something out?

In a real war, they would have a EF-18 creating false returns, as you suggest. But for ATC, they are using beacons. So there probably are three planes in the air.

a reply to: gariac

TacAir bought two Su-27s a few years ago and converted them to civilian use rules. They also fly Kfirs, and several other foreign aircraft as Red Air for whoever hires them.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: gariac

TacAir bought two Su-27s a few years ago and converted them to civilian use rules. They also fly Kfirs, and several other foreign aircraft as Red Air for whoever hires them.

I photographed the kfir in the range.looks like a Mirage but with a canard.
www.lazygranch.com...