Recently Vaccinated Individuals Spread Disease

originally posted by: STTesc
You mean injecting someone with a live virus may, potentially, involve becoming ill by this virus? And that it may be contagious? I had no idea!

#I'mprochoice

Because I can choose what goes in my body just like I can choose what comes out.

if they did that and the virus was unaltered in any way I would have to agree with you.
However, since the virus is attenuated, contagion isn't an issue.
Here's the definition of attenuated in respect to vaccines.
medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com...

And please share how you choose what comes OUT of your body.
You must have control of your body on a cellular level to be able to do that.

#I'mprohealth
#I'mantiantivax

originally posted by: STTesc
#I'mprochoice

Have the anti-vaxxers hijacked the pro-choice label now?...

Because I can choose what goes in my body just like I can choose what comes out.

Hmm not really, you don't get a choice on what comes out....

originally posted by: Prezbo369

originally posted by: STTesc
#I'mprochoice

Have the anti-vaxxers hijacked the pro-choice label now?...

Because I can choose what goes in my body just like I can choose what comes out.

Hmm not really, you don't get a choice on what comes out....

All of the respectable source links don't lead to anything related to vaccines.... Only checked the St. Jude, Hopkins and one other site I recognized and not one lead to anything vaccine related.


Masterful job of fooling the ATS community! The OP looks amazing! Almost like it's a pro not a random person..

AAaannd its another attempt at anti-vaccination,

with the usual mix of misunderstanding medicine, vaguely stating and complete ignorance of facts.


Welcome to the wonderful world of anti-vaccers. You want choice? You want to choose between every-single-doctor in the world and some anonymous people on the internet?

Well, be my guest. Just, if you are unvaccinated, please stay away from me and my family, thank you.

originally posted by: and14263
It's all futile.

One side presents sources to support their argument. The other side refutes.

Vice versa.

Argument ensues.

Thread becomes just like every other.

Morning ATS

True! And so it is with many other topics on the web.
So I scoure thru to make sure what I want to say, hasn't
already been said and try to make it most pertinent.

In this case Lady Green Eyes has beat'n me to the punch.

I can understand debating this, and that's all good. The folks that worry me are the ones who claim they would literally shoot someone for not being vaccinated, and treat them as some "threat" to "public safety". That's beyond ridiculous!

And there are many members here that are this ( RADIO EDIT )!

SnF OP

By this alone



No pro vaccer should be at all sure of themselves.
But they do pretend to be.

originally posted by: randyvs

originally posted by: and14263
It's all futile.

One side presents sources to support their argument. The other side refutes.

Vice versa.

Argument ensues.

Thread becomes just like every other.

Morning ATS

True! And so it is with many other topics on the web.
So I scoure thru to make sure what I want to say, hasn't
already been said and try to make it most pertinent.

In this case Lady Green Eyes has beat'n me to the punch.

I can understand debating this, and that's all good. The folks that worry me are the ones who claim they would literally shoot someone for not being vaccinated, and treat them as some "threat" to "public safety". That's beyond ridiculous!

And there are many members here that are this ( RADIO EDIT )!

Any chance you can quote and link to anyone who's has said on any thread that they would shoot an anti-vaxxer?

Then go through them and find the posts where anti-vaxxers have said they would shoot anyone who tried to "forcibly inject them".

(HINT: You'll find posts only stating one of the above)

www.danbuzzard.net...
skeweddistribution.com...
www.cfox.com...

a reply to: Pardon?

So,,,,, you have a point?

You don't see a difference there?

originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: Pardon?

So,,,,, you have a point?

You don't see a difference there?

I really don't know what you're trying to say there at all.
Can you be more specific?

And as for your editing in the Youtube video above...
Well, you've convinced me there.
All I know about vaccines has been completely quashed by a self-styled "infectious disease expert" who's produced no research on vaccines (or any related discipline for that matter) and who promotes his own brand of "medicine" (bio-identical hormone therapy. Wait. What?) spouting out on Fox News.
How can I have been so stupid than to think the benefits far outweighed any negative aspects.
Back to the drawing board for me!

a reply to: Pardon?

You
don't
see
a
difference
?

If some one comes at my kids with a hypo full of some crap
against my will? I would shoot their ass defending them.

If an unvaccinated person came near me I would shoot them.

You don't see a huge difference as far as who is saying what
for good reason?

As far as who said what I'm just making an example.

And the gentleman is a doctor and an expert
who
would
not
let
his
kids
be
vaccinated. Would it mean more if the guy was on CNN?

a reply to: Grimpachi

Clearly these studies are undertaken to determine why pertussis is occurring worldwide year round even in highly vaccinated populations. How can you say "No" when the scientific/medical community really does not understand either ?Cocooning and herd immunity would also be impossible for various factors such as:

Possible shedding
mouse study

Possible genetic shift

It as been proposed that selective pressure of immunity derived from the whole-cell vaccine used in the Netherlands prior to the introduction of the acellular vaccine caused genetic drift in circulating B. pertussis with reduced immune recognition, decreased vaccine efficacy, and reemergence of pertussis [13].

genetic drift

possible vaccine failing/resistant

"There are at least three reasons vaccinated individuals can become infected: one, the vaccine
failed to induce sterilizing immunity to the pathogen [5], two, the vaccine mounted a sterilizing
immune response that waned over time [6], or three, the pathogen evolved to escape sterilizing
immunity induced by the vaccine [7]. A recent study by Warfel, Zimmerman, and Merkel [5] using
non-human primates as a model for pertussis infection, suggests that pertussis vaccine efficacy may
be more nuanced than previously thought. Their results suggest that individuals vaccinated
with current acellular pertussis vaccines (aP) can become asymptomatically infected, and can then
transmit infection to susceptible individuals."

arxiv.org...

vacinne resistant pertussis

The vaccine was changed from whole cell to accelular vaccine in the late 1990s because of side effects. Repeated boosters are not going to improve its efficacy if it is failing (like mumps) as well we may also may be lulled into a false sense of security.









1www.cdc.gov... accessed January 22nd, 2014

a reply to: STTesc

I like to drink and drive.

#I'mprochoice

originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: Pardon?

You
don't
see
a
difference
?

If some one comes at my kids with a hypo full of some crap
against my will? I would shoot their ass defending them.

If an unvaccinated person came near me I would shoot them.

You don't see a huge difference as far as who is saying what
for good reason?

As far as who said what I'm just making an example.

And the gentleman is a doctor and an expert
who
would
not
let
his
kids
be
vaccinated. Would it mean more if the guy was on CNN?

So you wouldn't try to reason with them first?
You'd just shoot?
That sort of highlights a bizarre and irrational mentality don't you think?

Not that anyone would be forced to be vaxxed against their will anyway.
If it's mandated the worst that could happen is that you would be sanctioned somehow.
It's a mandate to wear a seatbelt.
And it's your choice not to wear one but no-one comes and physically puts it on you do they?
You make the choice, you face the consequences.

I have to assume you haven't read the links detailing how anti-vaxxers have made bomb and death threats otherwise I'm sure you would have agreed that behaviour such as that is reprehensible and is certainly not a stance you would support...

As for your gentleman doctor "expert".
What field is he an expert in exactly?
I can't find any research papers regarding vaccines that he's been involved in so he's not an expert on them.
He's not a paediatrician not virologist either.
I do know he's at odds with the scientific medical community as he promotes an unproven therapy though.
Which says a lot.
And you've only his word that he won't vaccinate his kids...

originally posted by: GetHyped
a reply to: STTesc

I like to drink and drive.

#I'mprochoice

So wait, not vaccinating is equivalent to being visually, mentally and emotionally impaired operating a 2 ton vehicle that can reach speed of close to 200mph?

You're #proretard

originally posted by: STTesc

originally posted by: GetHyped
a reply to: STTesc

I like to drink and drive.

#I'mprochoice

So wait, not vaccinating is equivalent to being visually, mentally and emotionally impaired operating a 2 ton vehicle that can reach speed of close to 200mph?

You're #proretard

I think you missed the point.
And insinuating someone's a retard doesn't help anyone's cause.

#I'mprosarcasm

a reply to: Pardon?

So you wouldn't try to reason with them first?
You'd just shoot?
That sort of highlights a bizarre and irrational mentality don't you think?

An expert on infectious diseases stated clearly in the vid.

Let's run a test? I"ll stand at the ready, ruger redhawk in hand.
You have as many zombie ass pro vaccers hell bent on vaccinating
every living organism that motivates, come at me with a syringe.
And we'll see how many find thier mark. I wouldn't just shoot,
I'd peel off thier skullcap with a bullet. and feel justified before
all mighty God.

Do monkeys vaccinate?
Do horses vaccinate?
Do dogs are you getting the picture yet?

And you've only his word that he won't vaccinate his kids...

Are you dense or something? Why would anyone speak
against their own profession unless they were revealing a truth?

Oh and i'm only arguing with you for the readers sake. Because
you're obviously a know it all goner.

Boil it all down to this. You trust the medical field not to be
corrupted by the power of it's gov't. I however do not!
You trust the politicians the lawyers the doctors, judges
who make up this society to never conspire to do
harm to anyone. Even tho they all congragate and know
each other all thru their school years each and everyone
of them living nothing but the good life all the way thru.

I gaw damn don't and never will!

originally posted by: Prezbo369

originally posted by: yorkshirelad
wow the anti vac paranoia has plunged to new lows today. I have never read so much nonsense in all my life. Complete utter ignorance. FYI it does not matter how many links to the intrent you post it does not make it "true" if all the links are to like minded sites all regurgitating and copying the same original nonsense.

I suggest you read this weeks New Scientist for a very nice explanation as to how people can have such unbelievable beliefs....a real eye opener.

The OP and many of the regular 'I have an anecdotal tale about vaccinations' crowd seem to feed off it.

And the OP claims to work in the health industry....

My cousin got autism from the vaccine. What BlueJacket said about the 4th child rang home for me since my cousins mother said almost the same thing. "I took daughter to the clinic, and brought home someone totally different."

Anecdotal!? *snip* you!

originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: Pardon?

So you wouldn't try to reason with them first?
You'd just shoot?
That sort of highlights a bizarre and irrational mentality don't you think?

An expert on infectious diseases stated clearly in the vid.

Let's run a test? I"ll stand at the ready, ruger redhawk in hand.
You have as many zombie ass pro vaccers hell bent on vaccinating
every living organism that motivates, come at me with a syringe.
And we'll see how many find thier mark. I wouldn't just shoot,
I'd peel off thier skullcap with a bullet. and feel justified before
all mighty God.

Do monkeys vaccinate?
Do horses vaccinate?
Do dogs are you getting the picture yet?

And you've only his word that he won't vaccinate his kids...

Are you dense or something? Why would anyone speak
against their own profession unless they were revealing a truth?

Oh and i'm only arguing with you for the readers sake. Because
you're obviously a know it all goner.

Boil it all down to this. You trust the medical field not to be
corrupted by the power of it's gov't. I however do not!
You trust the politicians the lawyers the doctors, judges
who make up this society to never conspire to do
harm to anyone. Even tho they all congragate and know
each other all thru their school years each and everyone
of them living nothing but the good life all the way thru.

I gaw damn don't and never will!

Wow.
You have some real issues don't you?

I'm a bigger expert on infectious disease than he is. Much bigger and better and cleverer.
There, I just stated it here so it must be true.
And you have to believe me because I told you so, just like he did.

Essentially, the man's a quack and is as qualified to speak out on vaccines as the Fox News interviewer with him.
In fact, it seems like the interviewer actually knows more about vaccines.

Here's Kent's 4 "research" articles he's been involved in (none of them are actual research, just commentaries designed to promote his pointless medicine which isn't surprising).
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...
NONE OF HIS WORK HAS BEEN IN INFECTIOUS DISEASES. NOR VACCINES. NOR ANYTHING ELSE TO QUALIFY HIM TO SPEAK.
Can it be any clearer.
But you won't read that will you?

Do monkeys vaccinate (well gorillas aren't monkeys but you won't know the difference)?
www.animalresearch.info...
Do horses vaccinate?
www.animedvets.co.uk...
Do dogs vaccinate?
www.vets-now.com...


You'd feel justified in almighty god killing a medical professional for giving a vaccine?
Firstly, that's pretty much certifiable.
Secondly, which god would you feel justified doing this under?
Certainly not the same god I know of.



By the way, you're not "arguing" with me.
You're going off on a bizarre and at times, random rant
You're deluding yourself and there's a serious air of resentment and entitlement in your posts.
But most importantly, you need help before you act on your thoughts and hurt someone.
Seriously, get some help.

originally posted by: MALBOSIA

originally posted by: Prezbo369

originally posted by: yorkshirelad
wow the anti vac paranoia has plunged to new lows today. I have never read so much nonsense in all my life. Complete utter ignorance. FYI it does not matter how many links to the intrent you post it does not make it "true" if all the links are to like minded sites all regurgitating and copying the same original nonsense.

I suggest you read this weeks New Scientist for a very nice explanation as to how people can have such unbelievable beliefs....a real eye opener.

The OP and many of the regular 'I have an anecdotal tale about vaccinations' crowd seem to feed off it.

And the OP claims to work in the health industry....

My cousin got autism from the vaccine. What BlueJacket said about the 4th child rang home for me since my cousins mother said almost the same thing. "I took daughter to the clinic, and brought home someone totally different."

Anecdotal!? *snip* you!

That's pretty much anecdotal to a tee.

Your cousin's autism was noticed at around the same time as her vaccinations and the vaccination is the highlight in that timeframe therefore it's focussed on.
Putting 2 and 2 together and getting potato.

a reply to: Pardon?

You have some real issues don't you?

Yes, with vaccines but, if writing it out helps you to stay in context
that's fine.

NONE OF HIS WORK HAS BEEN IN INFECTIOUS DISEASES.

How does any of his work disqualify the man to speak as an expert?
You just provided me with the proof the man is more qualified than you
partner. Just telling me that you're better on ATS means squawt to me.

Hormones in wellness and disease prevention:

Human beings give animals lots of shots Einstien.
Doesn't mean they vaccinate no matter how squirrely
you get.

You'd feel justified in almighty god killing a medical professional for giving a vaccine?

No need to rebuke this asinine comment cause everyone surely
sees you putting words in my mouth.

Self defense is never certifiable.

So much for bombastic accusations.

Now show us some of your work homey?

All you've managed to prove so far is your typical dishonesty.

Oh yes and WOW.

originally posted by: Pardon?

originally posted by: MALBOSIA

originally posted by: Prezbo369

originally posted by: yorkshirelad
wow the anti vac paranoia has plunged to new lows today. I have never read so much nonsense in all my life. Complete utter ignorance. FYI it does not matter how many links to the intrent you post it does not make it "true" if all the links are to like minded sites all regurgitating and copying the same original nonsense.

I suggest you read this weeks New Scientist for a very nice explanation as to how people can have such unbelievable beliefs....a real eye opener.

The OP and many of the regular 'I have an anecdotal tale about vaccinations' crowd seem to feed off it.

And the OP claims to work in the health industry....

My cousin got autism from the vaccine. What BlueJacket said about the 4th child rang home for me since my cousins mother said almost the same thing. "I took daughter to the clinic, and brought home someone totally different."

Anecdotal!? *snip* you!

That's pretty much anecdotal to a tee.

Your cousin's autism was noticed at around the same time as her vaccinations and the vaccination is the highlight in that timeframe therefore it's focussed on.
Putting 2 and 2 together and getting potato.

Whether or not you can define it as that, is not as damaging as classifying it as such. If the main stream and medical industry continue to deny it and not accept or even investigate individual reports, then what avenue would an anecdotal claim take?

Do you classify car crashes as anecdotal if there was no scientific paper accepted by corporate media to classify it as a MVA?

Are you calling me a liar?