State Senator: "My Home isn't Threatened By ISIS. My Home is Threatened by Police"

a reply to: grandmakdw

So...we have to be ok with the brutalization and oppression by policing forces if we want to be safe? Finally someone makes sense! (Sarcasm intended)

Sign me up for the do-not-respond/leave-me-the-hell-alone list.

I, along with my girlfriend and one other person were held hostage at gunpoint for over 4 hours by a half-drunk paranoid maniac family friend who used to work for a company much like Blackwater/Xe, but much less known. He thought I had something to do with a creepy message he received that said something along the lines of "we know where you are".

Did I use my cellphone to alert the police while he was in the other room? HELL NO. Because I know they would just as soon kill me as they would do their job and apprehend/takedown the gunman. That among other reasons, including the fact that I like to handle my own problems. I had opportunities to kill him. I could find him and kill him today if I wanted to. I decided to keep a cool head about it and used reasoning to help him understand the truth that I had nothing to do with it. Yeah I know I could've died that day. I could die anytime I step out my front door, or even lying in bed during a mistaken address no knock raid.

In the end, we all got out unscathed other than an imprint of a barrel of a pistol just above the center of my eyes that stayed there for about a week after, during a particular intense moment of our debate, he tried to use the gun to push me back in the chair I was sitting in and I pushed my forehead into the barrel just as hard, refusing to budge or show fear because I felt that's what a guilty person would do and plus my girlfriend was sitting on a couch 10 feet away and I wouldn't let her see me be intimidated, or afraid should it happen to be my last moments on this planet.

Then we all went out and got pizza. But I slowly and safely distance myself from this unstable individual and only saw him about 3 times after that. Some people might say they would never let someone get away with disrespecting them like that and would have killed him the first chance they had (i was armed. strangely he let me keep my gun in case it wasn't me behind the message and the real deal guys showed up at our location), but real life isn't like the movies, and I might have been charged with murder, or any number of things could've gone wrong (I assessed the situation and would have taken action if I felt it was necessary. It turned out not to be.) Just like real life isn't like the movies when you call the cops for help. I escaped with all our lives intact as well as the respect of my girlfriend. I think I did everything right and calling the police would have had a very good chance of being a catastrophic error.

This was definitely the most precarious of them, but there have been other situations I've been in where a normal person might have called the cops but I declined to pursue that option for similar reasons. And I'm still walking around living and breathing to this day. That might not be the case if I was the type to rely on the cops to solve my problems for me.

originally posted by: grandmakdw
What I see are a bunch of immature whiners.

You think the police are terrible, awful, wretched examples of human beings, whose only goal is to harass and harm people of color.

But when you are being threatened or harmed, you want these terrible, awful, wretched examples of human beings to run to your rescue.

Do you not realize how ridiculous that is. To name call them in one breath and demand they protect you in the next breath?

Of course I was being tongue in cheek with my statement on page 1.

It was simply an extension on the other side of the henious things many of the posters were saying about police.

Yet when I pointed out, if you think they are so awful, then keep them away from people who think the police are worse than ISIS and likely to behead/rape/or burn you alive;
then why on earth would you want them to protect you? Doesn't make sense.

Most police I know are decent human beings, with families, who care about their job and are doing their best daily. Too bad 99% of you posting here refuse to say even one decent thing about these people who do put their lives on the line daily for you.

You hate the police, fine, just don't call them when you need them, don't be hypocrites or worse yet bipolar about what you think of police.

What I find funny about replies like this are they usually come from people who claim they want smaller governments and for governments to stay out of people's lives.

What I've come to realize is they don't want government to interfere with their lives. But they have no problem with government interfering with, harassing, or brutalizing other American lives. Especially if those other Americans are different from them, or don't share the same views.

And the "all or nothing" approach is stupid. We want to be treated as equals in the eyes of the law. Why is that so hard to understand? Or do you simply not think all Americans deserve equal rights? Perhaps you should get acquainted with the 14th Amendment. Here's Section 1 of the 14th Amendment (emphasis added by me):

Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Since you sound like you're pro-law enforcement, why don't you agree with the US Constitution (you know, the supreme law of America)?

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: grandmakdw
What I see are a bunch of immature whiners.

You think the police are terrible, awful, wretched examples of human beings, whose only goal is to harass and harm people of color.

But when you are being threatened or harmed, you want these terrible, awful, wretched examples of human beings to run to your rescue.

Do you not realize how ridiculous that is. To name call them in one breath and demand they protect you in the next breath?

Of course I was being tongue in cheek with my statement on page 1.

It was simply an extension on the other side of the henious things many of the posters were saying about police.

Yet when I pointed out, if you think they are so awful, then keep them away from people who think the police are worse than ISIS and likely to behead/rape/or burn you alive;
then why on earth would you want them to protect you? Doesn't make sense.

Most police I know are decent human beings, with families, who care about their job and are doing their best daily. Too bad 99% of you posting here refuse to say even one decent thing about these people who do put their lives on the line daily for you.

You hate the police, fine, just don't call them when you need them, don't be hypocrites or worse yet bipolar about what you think of police.

What I find funny about replies like this are they usually come from people who claim they want smaller governments and for governments to stay out of people's lives.

What I've come to realize is they don't want government to interfere with their lives. But they have no problem with government interfering with, harassing, or brutalizing other American lives. Especially if those other Americans are different from them, or don't share the same views.


Since you sound like you're pro-law enforcement, why don't you agree with the US Constitution (you know, the supreme law of America)?

People like me have no problem with the police interfering with the lives and careers of criminals, especially violent ones.
Speaking of the Constitution, it says the government is responsible to provide for the common defense and enforce the laws. Nothing about subsidized housing or bureaucrat-run health care. We need a government that will perform its basic functions and no more.

originally posted by: works4dhs

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: grandmakdw
What I see are a bunch of immature whiners.

You think the police are terrible, awful, wretched examples of human beings, whose only goal is to harass and harm people of color.

But when you are being threatened or harmed, you want these terrible, awful, wretched examples of human beings to run to your rescue.

Do you not realize how ridiculous that is. To name call them in one breath and demand they protect you in the next breath?

Of course I was being tongue in cheek with my statement on page 1.

It was simply an extension on the other side of the henious things many of the posters were saying about police.

Yet when I pointed out, if you think they are so awful, then keep them away from people who think the police are worse than ISIS and likely to behead/rape/or burn you alive;
then why on earth would you want them to protect you? Doesn't make sense.

Most police I know are decent human beings, with families, who care about their job and are doing their best daily. Too bad 99% of you posting here refuse to say even one decent thing about these people who do put their lives on the line daily for you.

You hate the police, fine, just don't call them when you need them, don't be hypocrites or worse yet bipolar about what you think of police.

What I find funny about replies like this are they usually come from people who claim they want smaller governments and for governments to stay out of people's lives.

What I've come to realize is they don't want government to interfere with their lives. But they have no problem with government interfering with, harassing, or brutalizing other American lives. Especially if those other Americans are different from them, or don't share the same views.


Since you sound like you're pro-law enforcement, why don't you agree with the US Constitution (you know, the supreme law of America)?

People like me have no problem with the police interfering with the lives and careers of criminals, especially violent ones.
Speaking of the Constitution, it says the government is responsible to provide for the common defense and enforce the laws. Nothing about subsidized housing or bureaucrat-run health care. We need a government that will perform its basic functions and no more.

We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

You are quite right. The Constitution does call for the government to
"provide for the common defense" of the people.
It is one of the very very few things that is
constitutional that the government (s) is/are doing these days.

So it is consistent that those who don't want the police
or think they are evil, awful people,
who are worse than ISIS who beheads/rapes/burns people alive;
are also big government people.
Both ideas are unconstitutional.

A well regulated police force is constitutional
along with a smaller government:
to ensure domestic tranquility (keep the peace)
provide common defense (against criminals as well as foreign armies)

Those who hate the police as vigorously as they do on this thread
should band together to make DNR happen,
call Jesse or AL, I bet they'd help you.
Make it so the police will leave you alone,
unless, you openly break the law and harm someone else or their property,
because it is their constitutional duty to protect other citizens from you
if you hurt or rob someone or break traffic laws which can result in harm to others,
But all of you say you have never or would never do these things, so you should welcome DNR.

But if you want no police force at all because all police are corrupt,
evil people, worse than ISIS
what is your alternative?
Return to the wild west where everyone is armed at all times?
with no one prosecuted for anything, and vigilante justice?

Have the national guard or military take the place of the police?
Is that your solution?

Fire all the police and start over?
(with the military doing police work in the meantime?)

Because of the people on ATS, I have for the past year
started purposely going up to police officers and
thanking them for the work they do in spite of
people who hate, despise, loathe them -
yet expect them to come running to help at the
drop of a hat (or lack of chicken nugget) -
I have even written notes of encouragement
to the young police officer down the street
and his young wife on a regular basis -
because all they get from people is
hate, hate, hate, hate AND
help, help, help, help
and they do help, despite the hate

a reply to: jude11

I just saw this video today and I thought it was an amazing way that police departments should be handling today's modern society.

a reply to: jude11

I believe that most "real" people are more afraid of the "secret government" and the power elite than they are of ISIS or any terrorist group. We have come to the point were the biggest terrorist is our own government.

So if they want to rule without our consent or our input, if we are simply pests, then they can rule an empty world:

Secessio plebis

a reply to: grandmakdw

Please feel free to put me on that list.

I don't need bullies in uniform answering my call. What I need is a cop. There is a difference.

Are all cops like the one's so many here take such glee in stereotyping? Not even remotely...but far too many are. ...and it's time to wake up to that fact, folks. Seriously.

Well, the U.S.A. has had a supposed "war on terrorism" for quite sometime now. Typically people think of bomb-strapped muslims yelling "Allahu Akbar!" But that's only one instance of terrorism. Terrorism is defined as: "The use of violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims."

So yes, there's no doubt the police have an overwhelming amount of terrorism/threat under their belts compared to ISIS. No question about it. They've fatally injured, killed, extorted, intimidated, and mistreated far more people than that zealous group of radicals known as ISIS. Or any other 'terrorist' groups people have been spoon-fed to believe.

a reply to: Honcho

You might want to revisit those numbers, not to mention do a bit of research for yourself.

There are bad cops out there, of that there is little doubt. There are also accusations of evil doing that are without merit, and are tossed around to fit an agenda.

There are also cops out there who have done nothing but good in their careers.

I'd hazard a guess that the ones who've done nothing but good, far outweigh those who've been "terroristic".

I grow very tired of entire groups being colored because of the actions of a minority.

a reply to: grandmakdw

Someone likes their strawmen. No one is saying the police are worse than isis, merely pointing out an obvious truth; statistically speaking police officers are far more likely to unjustly kill me than isis is. Honestly, they are far more likely to kill me than "terrorists" in general. If you want to misconstrue that further, and say I don't want a sane, reasonable police force that offers me protection, well that's on you. It's absolute bull# and intellectually dishonest, but that doesn't seem to bother you at all.

After reading this thread I realized something, the amount of blame heaped on the police for executing warrants misses something. To conduct a raid a warrant is needed. And who issues said warrants? Lets be honest for all the abuses that get screamed about the police committing most people would not be able to survive without them. Other than people who have served in the military, in EMS or in work in the ER most of us have not really seen how bad people really are. You can tell yourself that people are good but you're just lying to your self. My father was a cop for many years and some of the things he witnessed were plain out disgusting. We ask the police to take care of "law and order" but refuse to recognize the cost on them. Most of us don't have to see children being abused in ways that would give nightmares [those who do or have my heart go's out to you] to anyone. Ever wonder how that will make you look at people? Maybe overall as a society we have failed to clean up our mess, the people who become cops are like everybody else. Is it any wonder that we have such problems with our law enforcement? They are just a product of the world we live in, just like the people they arrest for legitimate reasons. Are they perfect by no means but just like in any profession you get those who are crooked and power hungry. It seems that the only answer our so-called leaders have is to make more laws on top of all the ones we already have.

originally posted by: seagull
a reply to: Honcho

You might want to revisit those numbers, not to mention do a bit of research for yourself.

There are bad cops out there, of that there is little doubt. There are also accusations of evil doing that are without merit, and are tossed around to fit an agenda.

There are also cops out there who have done nothing but good in their careers.

I'd hazard a guess that the ones who've done nothing but good, far outweigh those who've been "terroristic".

I grow very tired of entire groups being colored because of the actions of a minority.

I never said all of them were this way. You're much too reactionary. I said that the American police overall have been more of a threat, and larger terrorists than ISIS and other varied factions have been. In other words, there is more domestic terrorism and life destroying doings domestically within the American police force, rather than Foreign 'terrorist' groups. Police have killed more Americans within America, rather than foreign terrorists have killed Americans within America. They have caused more overall havoc and mayhem in America compared to foreign terrorists. Killing Americans would only be the start of all of the things they have done to the American public.

a reply to: Honcho

Reactionary?

I've been called many things in my life... That's never been one of them, 'til now.

Though reading back on my post, I can certainly see why I may come across that way. At least where this topic is concerned.

You may not have said that all of them are like that... For that you have my apology for implying that you were.

But...

There is little doubt that many do believe that, or choose to push that viewpoint in order to further some agenda or other... Though to be honest I've always had trouble deciding what that agenda may be...if there even is one.

I think the thing that bothers me the most is the lack of any ideas about how to fix the problem. ...and I'll agree that police are far, far too quick to use deadly force, and far too many of them are in love with the "power" of their badge. As I said in a previous post, I've encountered the bullies, and, while it took some doing, I got them both fired...well, one fired, and the other resigned.

So I certainly don't buy into the "there's nothing we can do about it" train of thought. We can do something about it if we're willing to do something about it. Operative words being "willing" and "do".

Again, my apologies for doing what I hate, lumping you into a category.

originally posted by: works4dhs

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: grandmakdw
What I see are a bunch of immature whiners.

You think the police are terrible, awful, wretched examples of human beings, whose only goal is to harass and harm people of color.

But when you are being threatened or harmed, you want these terrible, awful, wretched examples of human beings to run to your rescue.

Do you not realize how ridiculous that is. To name call them in one breath and demand they protect you in the next breath?

Of course I was being tongue in cheek with my statement on page 1.

It was simply an extension on the other side of the henious things many of the posters were saying about police.

Yet when I pointed out, if you think they are so awful, then keep them away from people who think the police are worse than ISIS and likely to behead/rape/or burn you alive;
then why on earth would you want them to protect you? Doesn't make sense.

Most police I know are decent human beings, with families, who care about their job and are doing their best daily. Too bad 99% of you posting here refuse to say even one decent thing about these people who do put their lives on the line daily for you.

You hate the police, fine, just don't call them when you need them, don't be hypocrites or worse yet bipolar about what you think of police.

What I find funny about replies like this are they usually come from people who claim they want smaller governments and for governments to stay out of people's lives.

What I've come to realize is they don't want government to interfere with their lives. But they have no problem with government interfering with, harassing, or brutalizing other American lives. Especially if those other Americans are different from them, or don't share the same views.


Since you sound like you're pro-law enforcement, why don't you agree with the US Constitution (you know, the supreme law of America)?

People like me have no problem with the police interfering with the lives and careers of criminals, especially violent ones.
Speaking of the Constitution, it says the government is responsible to provide for the common defense and enforce the laws. Nothing about subsidized housing or bureaucrat-run health care. We need a government that will perform its basic functions and no more.

A person is only a "criminal" after they're been convicted of a crime. Until conviction, they're only "suspects". And all suspects are supposed to be treated as innocent until proven guilty. That's the whole point of having a court system. The accuser (be it individuals or a government) present their case against a suspect; the suspects defend themselves; and the courts decide the outcome. If an outcome isn't satisfactory to either party, they can appeal to a higher court to overturn the verdict. This process continues until either the higher courts refuse to hear the case or until the Supreme court hears it. That's also American law, for the record.

And what do housing and health care have to do with people getting treated equally under the law? We're Americans too. So why shouldn't we be treated equally as Americans by American law enforcement or American courts? Since you quoted my post, I'm assuming you read the part with Section 1 of the US Constitution. So why can't we have the rights Section 1 of the US Constitution gives us? That's why I find it hypocritical when people who claim they are pro-law enforcement conveniently ignore or outright oppose the parts of American law that they don't agree with. It doesn't work like that.

originally posted by: hangedman13
After reading this thread I realized something, the amount of blame heaped on the police for executing warrants misses something. To conduct a raid a warrant is needed. And who issues said warrants? Lets be honest for all the abuses that get screamed about the police committing most people would not be able to survive without them. Other than people who have served in the military, in EMS or in work in the ER most of us have not really seen how bad people really are. You can tell yourself that people are good but you're just lying to your self. My father was a cop for many years and some of the things he witnessed were plain out disgusting. We ask the police to take care of "law and order" but refuse to recognize the cost on them. Most of us don't have to see children being abused in ways that would give nightmares [those who do or have my heart go's out to you] to anyone. Ever wonder how that will make you look at people? Maybe overall as a society we have failed to clean up our mess, the people who become cops are like everybody else. Is it any wonder that we have such problems with our law enforcement? They are just a product of the world we live in, just like the people they arrest for legitimate reasons. Are they perfect by no means but just like in any profession you get those who are crooked and power hungry. It seems that the only answer our so-called leaders have is to make more laws on top of all the ones we already have.

You bring up good points. But you have to understand that there are other sides to the stories, as well. For every disgusting thing he saw, did he also tell you about any of the abuses he saw from other officers? Or from judges? To me, it's like the people who fought in Vietnam (like my uncle) saying the atrocities the Vietcong committed gave them nightmares. That may be perfectly true, but what about the atrocities our soldiers committed, as well? What kind of nightmares did they give to the innocent civilians in Vietnam?

The problem a lot of people have is they act like it has to be 100% yes or 100% no, all or nothing. And that's just wrong. That's also not what we're asking for. This whole time we've been fighting, protesting, and literally begging to be treated as equals by the country we were born in. And yet in 2015, we still have BS like the Stop & Frisk policy. And people here who say we were better off as slaves. And a criminal justice system that immediately thinks we're criminals since the only "ethnic people" they've ever seen were in a Lil Wayne video lol

double post. grrr not sure how that happened.

a reply to: grandmakdw

Sign me up to opt-out please.

a reply to: penroc3

honestly the only reason i have ever delt with them is because i didn't want to get in trouble for dealing with stuff my self.

Exactly.

originally posted by: grandmakdw
When someone says something like this publicly.

The police should take them literally.

They should be put on a list and left alone.

Left entirely alone by the police.

Kind of a DNR (do not resuscitate type code attached to them) - Do Not Respond
This should be official policy for all police nationwide

Does that mean that they won't be stopped for revinue generating traffic tickets?
That seems to be the only time I see a non youtube cop/citizen interaction.