'Jesus NEVER existed': Writer finds no mention of Christ in 126 historical texts and says he was a

a reply to: phishfriar47

A good question!

Reportedly, we don't have the original documents of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. It is commonly accepted that we have later copies and translations... which were arguably from Hebrew, to Greek, to Latin. These would show the name of the Son as 'Yeshua' (Hebrew), 'Iesous' (Greek) and 'Jesus' (Latin), depending on which language you were reading.

Nehemia Gordon, a Jewish Biblical scholar, has found Shem Tov's addendum, the Gospel of Matthew, in the original Hebrew. Nehemia accepts this as the original language of the book of Matthew, because of indications such as distinctive Hebrew word puns. From this and other clues, he has also deduced that Luke, Acts and Revelation were also written originally in Hebrew.

An ossuary found bearing the name of 'Yeshua' (Feel free to google this) is automatically 'translated' into English as 'Jesus', but that is NOT the actual name on the ossuary; which is also why it can't be used to prove the existence of 'Jesus' [sic] in those days.

Why can't we just use the original name of Yeshua in English? Do we really need to translate it into another form?

I thought the jesus stories were based on Osiris from Egypt

a reply to: blackz28

They are. You are correctly thinking that.

originally posted by: blackz28
I thought the jesus stories were based on Osiris from Egypt

Nope...wrong.

All based on the pseudo-historic nonsense of Youtube video makers and not based in accurate historic study by any real historians. What you are speaking of has been debunked time and time again by real historians and history experts over the last few years.

Those who watch and agree with "The Zeitgeist Movies" from Youtube are unaware of things they should pay close attention to. its hogwash and quickly dismantled with a little research into the facts behind these false claims.

here is a nice article that explains it well enough. No scholar agrees with the Orsiris-Jesus connection and they all state firmly it is insane and not supported by any real research or study.

In other words...its Youtube nonsense and being eaten up by those too lazy and/or clueless to seek real answers.

www.washingtoncitypaper.com...

PS-The link above simply explains it well. You can find thousands of creditable sources to read from if you decide to use Google correctly instead of watching Youtube Vids for your views on history.

MM

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: blackz28

They are. You are correctly thinking that.

No...he is not.

In fact, it is one of the most laughable conclusions one can come to...based on Youtube videos no less.

Its hogwash. Jesus and Osiris are not related historically, factually or mythically in any way. Nor will you find a single scholar agreeing such evidence exists to support such a claim. In short- its nonsense.

MM

a reply to: Mr Mask

The similarities between Christianity and the Egyptian Mysteries are stunning. But it isn't just Christians that lifted Egyptian thought. The Old Testament is littered with it! Some of the Psalms were lifted from the pyramids and city walls. Heck, the Ten Commandments were lifted from the Egyptian Book of the Dead! The Golden Calf is Hathor and the "Lion of Judah" is the Sphinx, (The Child of the Lion Goddess Sekhmet)

Isis and Mary are inextricably connected. Both were virgins whose pregnancies were divine. Both were foretold of their pregnancy by divine creatures. Both children were visited by "kings" bearing gifts. Both fled from threats against their children and hid. The list goes on.

Both Isis and Horus are depicted with solar globes over their heads. Both Jesus and Mary are depicted with solar globes over their heads (halos).

Regardless of the truths and falsehoods behind any religious beliefs, providing those who follow them do so in a manner which helps their fellow human beings I have no problem with that at all.

I am not qualified enough to say for certain whether Jesus or any other religious character actually existed (although I was brought up to believe he did) - nor whether they actually did what they are proclaimed to have done - but when religion is used for good, it is a fine thing indeed, encouraging people to behave kindly and giving them some level of solace at the difficult points during their lives.

Like many other things, it is only when religion is taken to extremes or used as a vehicle for the personal gain of others - be it financial or philosophical - it becomes a problem.

a reply to: windword

Annnnd those vids you linked are the exact Youtube vids I was rightfully calling pseudo-historic nonsense.

All debunked and littered with lies and manufactured nonsense.

Here, this may help you stop trusting invented nonsense such as the solar globes you think you are seeing.
www.skeptic.com...
Sorry...

MM

a reply to: Mr Mask

There's nothing to debunk in those videos. One compares the Catholic veneration of Mary to pagan goddess worship and one is merely a picture montage.

In the meantime, kindly debunk these very real similarities and issues, please.

The Old Testament is littered with it! Some of the Psalms were lifted from the pyramids and city walls. Heck, the Ten Commandments were lifted from the Egyptian Book of the Dead! The Golden Calf is Hathor and the "Lion of Judah" is the Sphinx, (The Child of the Lion Goddess Sekhmet)

Isis and Mary are inextricably connected. Both were virgins whose pregnancies were divine. Both were foretold of their pregnancy by divine creatures. Both children were visited by "kings" bearing gifts. Both fled from threats against their children and hid. The list goes on.

Both Isis and Horus are depicted with solar globes over their heads. Both Jesus and Mary are depicted with solar globes over their heads (halos).

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: Mr Mask

There's nothing to debunk in those videos. One compares the Catholic veneration of Mary to pagan goddess worship and one is merely a picture montage.

In the meantime, kindly debunk these very real similarities and issues, please.

The Old Testament is littered with it! Some of the Psalms were lifted from the pyramids and city walls. Heck, the Ten Commandments were lifted from the Egyptian Book of the Dead! The Golden Calf is Hathor and the "Lion of Judah" is the Sphinx, (The Child of the Lion Goddess Sekhmet)

Isis and Mary are inextricably connected. Both were virgins whose pregnancies were divine. Both were foretold of their pregnancy by divine creatures. Both children were visited by "kings" bearing gifts. Both fled from threats against their children and hid. The list goes on.

Both Isis and Horus are depicted with solar globes over their heads. Both Jesus and Mary are depicted with solar globes over their heads (halos).

I will debunk that nonsense gladly...but you will most likely trust your sources who are not supported by scholars of any kind.

1- Isis was not a virgin. She was a widow and she had sex. Isis is not historically noted as a virgin and this lie is invented and spread by a select few sources who are outside academics as a whole. Nobody agrees with this nonsense within historic circles.

2-There is no record of kings visiting Horus. This is also invented by a select few who intentionally lie about this to sell nonsense on the internet.

3-Visited by divine creatures? No ideas what you are getting at.

yes...the list goes on and on. There is about 50 things in that list...all invented by the same people. All debunked by scholars and history experts loudly as nonsense.

Same goes with the list of about 70 things that connect Jesus to Mithras. its all hoaxes and debunked nonsense.

How about you just read this and let a world leading expert in history debunk it all for you?

Please notice the source...unlike your youtube videos- its solid academia and should be respected as such as it destroys your nonsense you are spreading.

Hope this helps clear up your world view just a little. breaks my heart when people get lost in hoaxes and invented tomfoolery.

www.academia.edu...

In short- you are advertising for liars and hoaxers. And have fallen for pseudo-history presented to you by laughable Youtube videos. I'm sorry.

MM

a reply to: Mr Mask

Alright, thank you for your answer.

First of all, those videos weren't my source. I posted them as examples.

1- Isis was not a virgin. She was a widow and she had sex. Isis is not historically noted as a virgin and this lie is invented and spread by a select few sources who are outside academics as a whole. Nobody agrees with this nonsense within historic circles.

Isis most certainly was "The Great Virgin", by her own proclamation.

According to the Theological Dictionary of the Old Testament, at the Abydos Temple of Seti, Isis claims that she is "The Great Virgin" Ptolemaic text require that women acting, for ritual purposes, on behalf of Hathor, Isis or Nephthys must be virgins.



Here's another Egyptian inscription from the Temple of Luxor depicting a nativity scene of a virgin birth, mirrored in an "As above so below" template of Isis, the perpetual virgin mother, and the birth of Pharaoh Amenhept III that dates from the 14th century BCE, 1390-1352 BCE. Pharaohs were considered divinity and were the representatives of Horus, on earth.

3-Visited by divine creatures? No ideas what you are getting at.

Isis was visited by Thoth, Hermes, who told her to conceive Horus and conducted the ceremony. Here we a have a depiction of the God Thoth telling the Pharaoh Amenhept II, that his wife is miraculously pregnant, very similar to the story of the angel telling Joseph that is wife to be, Mary, is miraculously pregnant with a divine child.

how about this one?

The Tablet of ISIS, or “Bembine Tablet” was recovered in 1527 after the sacking of Rome. It now resides in the Museum of Antiquities at Turin and is a bronze tablet measuring 50 by 30 inches. It was probably used as an altar, and it is said that it was present in the subterranean vault under the Great Pyramid when Plato received his Initiation there.

This is the origin of Christianity's "Trinity"

“The Egyptians considered the Divinity in two manners, as an Eternal Existence, self-constituted and quite apart from terrestrial concerns, or in connection with created objects which it governs by ministering spirits, and secondary powers. They admitted a Triple essence of Deity, and also a triform secondary divinity, as they had learned of Hermes Trismegistus. This Divinity imprinted his seal upon all earthly things, both living and dead. Upon this same essential plan was this Tablet constructed.” [Athanasius Kircher, Oedipus Aegytiacus, 1654 AD.

The Tablet of Isis

Tradition teaches that the goddess ISIS was instructed by Hermes, or Thoth, the god of magick, writing and words. By magick power ISIS promulgated writing and learning, caused men to love women, was the protectress of sailors and all vessels that sail the seas. She provided law and justice and instructed mankind in the sacred mysteries. In ISIS, truth is made perfect and beautiful. The inscription from her temple at Sais reads: “I am Isis, I am all that is, that has been, and that will be, and no mortal has ever yet withdrawn my veil.” To the Initiates of her mysteries, she lifts her veil – but they are to remain forever silent about what they have seen.

Then there's the Saitic Isis, by Plato where Plato reiterates the claim. archive.org...

“I, Isis, am all that has been, that is or shall be; no mortal man hath ever me unveiled. The fruit which I have brought forth is the sun."

The face and form of Isis were covered by a veil of scarlet cloth, symbolic of ignorance and emotionalism standing between man and Truth. Isis lifts her veil and discovers herself to the true and wise investigator who unselfishly and humbly seeks to understand the mysteries which surround him in the universe; and warns Wise Men concerning the mysteries which they have seen: "If you know it, be silent."

The "veil" of Isis represent virginity, by the way.

2-There is no record of kings visiting Horus. This is also invented by a select few who intentionally lie about this to sell nonsense on the internet.

Here's Isis and baby Horus receiving gifts.





Here's Horus receiving gifts

a reply to: windword

Your Youtube nonsense is fun and all...

But why don't you take time to read a history expert explain why there is absolutely not connection between Mary and Isis and why its wrongfully being said by "nonacademic sources".

Like i said...you are spreading hogwash. Here, learn "real history" from someone who is certified to teach it to you. You may find it more solid (and based in real evidence) than your little Youtube theories that hold no water.

www.academia.edu...

Again...please notice your sources vs mine and the validity of both.

If you want fictional cartoon answers, please continue adhering to fictional cartoon sources.

If you want "academic consensus based on decades of real research and the historic method, then please use my sources.

PS- Historians (and Egyptians alike) credit the Isis myth as being "Isis was impregnated by having intercourse with the spirit of the dead Osiris". She was not a virgin nor is she portrayed as one.

After Osiris is hacked into 14 parts- Isis puts him back together again (except for his penis which was tossed in a river). Then Iris makes a substitute penis for him, has sex with him and gets pregnant to birth Horus.

Mythical Isis was not a virgin. And your ideas can be traced to one man...a hoaxer from the 1920s.

MM

a reply to: windword

Oh...and to further stir your little hoaxed mind.

The bible has no reference of three wise men coming to visit and give gifts to Jesus.

See how misguided you are? Less Youtube...more academia.

There is also no record of three "deities" (as the false hoax claim always goes) ever visited Isis.

MM

a reply to: Mr Mask

You haven't refuted anything by throwing around insults and websites. There's nothing wrong with my sources. It's a fact that Isis was widely known to be The Great Virgin as early as 429 BC when Plato wrote about her and her temple. If anyone is making up lies it's those apologetic biblical scholars that you keep pointing to. Biblical Mary was not the first mythical virgin to give birth to a god, nor the first to be called the Queen of Heaven. The "Trinity" is an Egyptian Mystery School knock off.

From your posting style, one would think that your only motivation for posting in this forum is to shut down conversation with insults and appeals to authority, without specifically citing anything to back your own case. You certainly haven't displayed any open mindedness or willingness to discuss what or why you perceive to be lies.

originally posted by: Mr Mask
a reply to: windword

Oh...and to further stir your little hoaxed mind.

The bible has no reference of three wise men coming to visit and give gifts to Jesus.

See how misguided you are? Less Youtube...more academia.

There is also no record of three "deities" (as the false hoax claim always goes) ever visited Isis.

MM

When did I claim the Bible cites 3 wise men? I merely said that both were visited by "kings" who offered gifts.

Matthew 2:2

After Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea, during the time of King Herod, Magi[a] from the east came to Jerusalem 2 and asked, “Where is the one who has been born king of the Jews? We saw his star when it rose and have come to worship him.”

a reply to: windword

Again...Isis in the Isis Myth had sex to get pregnant.

What don't you get?

Historians have debunked this connection between Mary and Isis many times over. Its not true.

Plain and simple.

Its funny how most of you hoax believers tend to call "showing academic evidence" something as silly as "an appeal to authority". No...its called "educating yourself".

Until you do such, you will continue to play these games with history.

And now you are saying the holy trinity is a rip off of ancient mystery school eh? lol...mind showing me the evidence of that as well? This should be fun.

I'm not insulting you...I am attacking and dismantling false information that is garbage. Garbage information is poison to learning minds and it should be exposed and attacked at all chances. Its hogwash and it leads people into false world views.

Like yours.

MM

a reply to: windword

The most important thing you are over looking (intentionally or unaware) is that 100% of all you are regurgitating is from the mind of one man. Gerald Massey. A man with no proper education in Egyptology who was overly speculative.

His writings are not supported by mainstream history and he is basically a joke to academia.

No experts support his findings and many have gone very far to debunk him in hopes to educate the gullible folks who have fallen for his mindless drivel.

Until recently his writings have largely been forgotten after being debunked and destroyed by real scholars so easily over the decades. But due to a certain Youtube movie they have come back to haunt the internet and the minds of those who trust websites over real academic research.

Massey was a joke...nothing more.

That's why I ask you to pay attention to my sources and not yours (since yknow, I am posting real academic views/sources/links and not Youtube nonsense).

Youtube loses every time my friend...every time.

MM

a reply to: Mr Mask

Mr. Mask...I understand your conviction to the scriptures....but please dont for one second believe that Mary, the WIFE of Joseph, was a virgin. As we know from the Muslins, that the Arabs and other Middle East tribes were very fond of claiming teenage girls and marrying them quite young, this has gone on for many thousands of years for these desert people.
You can bet Without a doubt, Mary would have lost her virtue on the first night she married Joseph, if not even before.
This whole "Virgin Birth" myth is just superstitious rubbish, created for simple minded people of 2000 years ago.
We know for a fact through our science, that a new life, a baby if you wish, is made with the sperm of a male and an egg of a female......No hocus pocus "Magic" of a "God" creature can "make" a baby........only Nature and a billion years of evolution can do that.
2000 years is a blink in time, compared to the spawning of life on Mother Earth.
If you insist on praying to something, dont waste your breath on Myths/legends and the fantasy of Man. Pray to Earth and the Sun instead... Like all ancient man use to.

a reply to: Mr Mask

Again...Isis in the Isis Myth had sex to get pregnant.

What don't you get?

What? Why do you think this? There is no legitimate mythology that portrays Isis having sex. She was worshiped as "The Great Virgin". There is no denying this. It written all over the pyramid and temple walls. Mary, the mother of Jesus was NOT the first mythical virgin! Isis was!

Historians have debunked this connection between Mary and Isis many times over. Its not true.

Please prove this bald face lie!

And now you are saying the holy trinity is a rip off of ancient mystery school eh? lol...mind showing me the evidence of that as well? This should be fun.

Do you think that Christians just pulled the Trinity out of the Pope's ass? Where do YOU think the Trinity's origin lies?

I'm not insulting you...I am attacking and dismantling false information that is garbage.

You have dismantled nothing! Please prove your argument with more than a wave of dismissal and alluding to scholarship that you have yet to present, if it exists at all.

a reply to: Mr Mask

What does any of this have to do with the topic or any of the evidence that I provided? Where did I quote Massey?

At any rate, please attack the evidence provided, not the source.