US crumbling. Detroit shuts off water to residents. UN asked to help.

a reply to: Destinyone

Maybe they cant afford to pay the bill.

a reply to: Klassified

This is exactly the reason I moved from the SF Bay Area over 15 years ago to a rural mountain area. Many could see the direction crowded city living was heading. When it comes to the point of every aspect of your living conditions is controlled by governing agencies, you have little to no say in what is done that can drastically effect one's life.

Treat the land Detroit is built on like farm land. Moving the people out to other areas, like rotating crops. Let Detroit go natural...wait for society to bring it back to life with a new economy in the future.

I don't see propping up Detroit again as a solution. Maybe the money would be better spent in the form of subsidies for moving to a better area with better job opportunities. I'd rather all the damn money we send to foreign countries be used for people in our own country first.

Des

a reply to: gladtobehere

I honestly would not be able to shut off someone's water supply, simply because they were delinquent in paying their water rates. If a person is having trouble with paying their bills, they are not going to be able to afford bottled water, and I really think that forcing people to thirst, purely over a matter of money is an inhuman, and utterly reprehensible practice.

I realise that in a capitalist society, people are expected to pay for every damned thing in the universe, but I really think that something as basic as water rates, should be paid by general taxation, and not on a by use basis, except in cases where that water is being used to grow huge gardens, or on a commercial basis.

The idea of cutting water off to anyone, let alone HALF A BLOODY CITY is absolutely ghastly, and I honestly believe there must be something morally wrong with the leaders of Detroit's city council, or with any council which would consider depriving a person of such a basic amenity.

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic
I had no idea it was this bad! This is horrendous! I hope the people get some help!

It isn't this bad. An overwhelming majority of those threatened with a water shut off have cable TV and manage to pay that bill just fine.

The problem is that they were allowed to get away with not paying it because government officials were more concerned with bilking city funds and doling out bogus inflated contracts to their friends and family and didnt want or need to right the wrong. They just made up for it by treating the suburbs like their piggy bank and jacking up their rates because the city has a water monopoly on the entire Metro Detroit area. The inflation of water prices in the outlying suburbs over the last decade has been insane. It has gone up over 100% from year to year on occasion and I'd venture to guess suburbanites pay near 1, 000% more for water today than they did within the last decade in some places.

Now the chickens have come home to roost and these people are being held accountable and told the free ride is over. If they were doing what they should have been doing all along (paying their bill as is required of every other utility, lest you risk a shut off) then this wouldn't be an issue.

Its been made out to be some crisis, as if these people are equivalent to those in third world countries living in huts with no access to clean water or electricity. BS. They chose to not pay a bill because their neighbors and cousins and friends were getting away with it.

Are these some incredibly poverty stricken people in Detroit who probably can't afford their bill? Sure, but the vast majority of these people have cable TV and the latest iPhone. They aren't well off, but can certainly afford to pay for something required to sustain human life. Lets at least call this what it is and not make it into a faux humanitarian crisis; its insulting to those who really are in desperate need.

At this point, it's not about who has paid their bill and who has not paid their bill. Shutting off water to that many people creates a public health crisis. Without running water for sewage, Where are they going to go, the streets? This will ultimately effect every single resident of Detroit; including those that are up to date on their bills.

On a side note, they are not being fair in who does and does not get their water shut off. Many municipal buildings, businesses and even Ford Field (home of the Detroit Lions) are also delinquent; in some cases owing 10s or even 100s of thousands of dollars to the water utility. Yet, these select establishments remain to have running water.

If I lived in Detroit, I'd be praying for the UN to step in. Where are the churches? Where are the charities? Humanity is doomed! Doomed I tell you!

What precedent is being set if tax payers do pay the bill for everyone delinquent?

a reply to: TrueBrit

I totally agree with everything that you say. Water is a basic of life. Water falls out of the sky for free. Ok you have the cost of purifying (but that's only down to the greedy companies dirtying it before hand) and the infrastructure of delivery. This all aught to be covered with government money. Water aught to be free. The US spends trillions on weaponry yet wont spend a few million to give its citizens free clean water.

This is nothing more than people taking advantage of the system. Detroit is in shambles because of poor government oversight. The only thing scarey about this is that it's the same style of government our president believes in. Entitlement on top entitlement. A government is supposed to help people get out of the ghetto not give people a reason to never get out.

And the UN? What the f*** will they do?

a reply to: gladtobehere

I am waiting for the full onslaught of a Robo-Cop Corporate take over. This one of the many blows to come to those who hold out living in that city. Detroit is a proving ground for what is to come for all major cities and most of the US in the next decade or two. Corporatacracy in full form.

originally posted by: Willtell
a reply to: Destinyone

Maybe they cant afford to pay the bill.

Then, you and that great big old heart of yours...pay it for them. I don't have any money left over after paying my own bills on time.

Des

originally posted by: Destinyone
a reply to: Klassified

This is exactly the reason I moved from the SF Bay Area over 15 years ago to a rural mountain area. Many could see the direction crowded city living was heading. When it comes to the point of every aspect of your living conditions is controlled by governing agencies, you have little to no say in what is done that can drastically effect one's life.

Treat the land Detroit is built on like farm land. Moving the people out to other areas, like rotating crops. Let Detroit go natural...wait for society to bring it back to life with a new economy in the future.

I don't see propping up Detroit again as a solution. Maybe the money would be better spent in the form of subsidies for moving to a better area with better job opportunities. I'd rather all the damn money we send to foreign countries be used for people in our own country first.

Des

Agreed.

a reply to: LeatherNLace

I agree, I don't think the solution is to start shutting off water. I don't know what the fix is, but its affecting more than just the city proper. Suburban residents are getting railroaded, they're being looked at as the monetary solution and are being forced to pay ridiculous amounts for their water. You better believe if someone in Royal Oak can't afford their bill that went up hundreds of dollars their water is getting cut off post haste.

Its a mess, and ironically enough in a state surrounded by water.

Poor, unemployed people can't afford to pay water bills, so they get shut off.. What about the 100,000 immigrants coming in. I'm sure they get free water ,health care , food and shelter. What about our own citizens? Do we not get first in line for help before these people drain our assets? a reply to: gladtobehere

All I have to say is, "This is Detroit, what did you expect?"

I bet they still have wooden pipes in the system, I know they still did before I left almost 20 years ago now.

They used to shut down the street lights in different neighborhoods on a rotation basis.

I knew it wouldn't be getting better then, look at it now. So glad I out of there, I could imagine what condition I'd be if I hadn't.

The U.N. involvement seems strange though. Can't see why in this case. Sounds fishy to me.

originally posted by: Destinyone
a reply to: strongfp

I'm sure some people who *don't* pay their bills, spend money on things like booze, ciggies, dope...and many other things that aren't necessities.

Des

Assumptive, arrogant, overly simplistic and frankly, stupid. I am surprised.

originally posted by: Kgdetroit
a reply to: LeatherNLace

I agree, I don't think the solution is to start shutting off water. I don't know what the fix is, but its affecting more than just the city proper. Suburban residents are getting railroaded, they're being looked at as the monetary solution and are being forced to pay ridiculous amounts for their water. You better believe if someone in Royal Oak can't afford their bill that went up hundreds of dollars their water is getting cut off post haste.

Its a mess, and ironically enough in a state surrounded by water.

I don't quite know what the solution is either. However, Detroit did file for Bankruptcy, so maybe they could simply write off a large portion of the money owed to them; making each person's late fee affordable and perhaps place the delinquent accounts on a payment plan. That seems reasonable and certainly more humanitarian.

Well, what is your opinion of Delaware bailing out casinos to a tune of 50 million dollars? I think gambling is not a necessity, why do their taxpayers have to foot the bill, This type of bailouts can surely go to a better cause! Just a reply to an earlier post. a reply to: Destinyone

a reply to: gladtobehere

There are ways these people can get assistance, if they really needed it. Michigan and Detroit have many of these assistance programs and all the people need to do is apply.

If they are being denied assistance, there is likely a good reason. If they are not looking for or applying for assistance, then they are the only ones to blame.

What the government is wasting money on is not relevant when talking about people getting a service shut off for non-payment. Everybody else in the country either pays their utility bills, or they are on some form of low income assistance, or they get their service shut off.

Detroit is no different and should not be treated any different.

originally posted by: Destinyone
a reply to: gladtobehere

I don't understand why over 110,000 people think they can just not pay their bills. If I didn't pay my utility bills, service would be cut off. That' s the way it works.

What is the U.N. supposed to do. Pay their bills for them...

We have huge segments of society that think they should get everything for free. Instead of trying to prioritize what is needed in their lives, they just expect it to all be provided to them.

I'm sorry for the people of Detroit. If I lived in that place, I'd be looking to move. I'd also be looking at my budget and figure out what I'd have to cut back on to pay my freaking utility bills.

Des

Thus the great shake up is well on its way to correct where society currently is. From there though, we must be sure to not go down this path again. We have to find a solution to the backwards economy we have. To keep using monetary economics would be the first mistake.

The correction will likely remove all the people who do not understand HOW or simply refuse change.

originally posted by: Kgdetroit
It isn't this bad. An overwhelming majority of those threatened with a water shut off have cable TV and manage to pay that bill just fine.
...
Sure, but the vast majority of these people have cable TV and the latest iPhone.

Do you have a source for this? I HOPE you're right!

Looks like you are...

However, studies found that about 75 percent of residents are able to pay for things such as cable television or cell phone usage, and only 50 percent are willing to pay for water. Does this deserve an appeal to the U.N. for human rights violation? Is this a grave moral predicament?

Source

WTF is going on here?