Has "E.T." gone home?

a reply to: Aliensun

Aliensun...

I think that I have been misunderstood.

I no more trust the word of governments and their operatives on this matter, than I would consider connecting myself to the mains for a cheap thrill.

However, I do believe that if there is something out there to find, then it must be found with tools which the majority of people can respect and relate to, and the only thing which unifies the greater majority of nations on our planet, is the language and techniques of science. We have different religions, different levels of appreciation for the mystical, and different approaches to ritualised activity of all kinds. But a test tube and a gas chromatograph mass spectrometer have the same uses all over the world, and the language used to describe their results of use of these tools is identical all over the world, and is the only cultural convention which is both applicable to this issue, and accepted widely enough, for its word and findings to hold weight.

If UFOlogy is to be taken seriously, then we need to remove noise from the signal we are putting out into the public domain, to just those things which we can test independently, using techniques which are difficult to argue with, no matter where one is from. We need to ensure that we make no outlandish claims, without having the evidence which backs it up, we need to quit spouting unverifiable information (like blather about the names and locations of alien worlds, species, what their politics are like, and so on), and in so doing giving ammunition to those who suspect the entire UFOlogy issue of being claptrap.

Many people wonder why, if there are so many species abroad in the universe, why we have not seen any. I posit that it could be because we honestly do not know what to look for. We know how to find life like ours, and haven't yet done so, but we have not the experience to know just yet, what might be out there which falls outside of our understanding, but is none the less life, and perhaps intelligent life at that!

However, until or unless something can be discovered by a method that people can all understand and appreciate the validity of, until the scientists with the know how are spurred to act, rather than skirt round the issue entirely, the subject as a whole will have trouble gaining traction.

Personally, I am of the opinion that we need to get to the stage where we can perform out of system missions, if we have any hope of answering the big question in a full, and unequivocal manner, and furthermore that it is a goal that we should strive toward regardless of that!

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: Uggielicious

I would echo the sentiments of those who have commented thus far, that the drop in UFO reporting here, and sundry related topics being shared, is down to the quality of critical thinking to be found here. Personally speaking, I hope that one day there will be answers to some of the good questions about UFO and alien related issues that have come up over the course of the history of interest in those topics.

However, I believe that those answers must come in a format which can be probed, examined, stand up to logical criticism, has evidence which can be independently verified, which MAKES PERFECT SENSE!

snip

Only by doing so, can those who have an interest in these matters, expect to see serious scientists involve themselves directly in focused, valid research and investigation, into those phenomena which have already occurred, and those which may unfold in the future, and it is only by THAT method, that any answers of value will ever come to light.

What I am saying, is that if we are getting less reports here, then that means that the ones we do get are going to be worth more of a look, than the countless examples of utter CGI twaddle that had been before!

I would like to share your positive outlook but the fact is that wishing that "serious" scientists involve themseleves in UFOlogy is next to impossible for there is nothing for them to study. All that exists, presently, are reports, photos and videos. Hardly anything worth to examine beyond what has been done already. All that scientists could do at the moment is express an opinion but without the weight of evidence.

Even if scientists could be given something to take to a laboratory, how would they know anything beyond that the evidence was not made on earth. Unless the evidence was presented by a being that was seen and recorded stepping out of a "craft" that landed in public view. There would be a need to prove that the being(s) & craft actually travelled vast distances as opposed to from another reality that was earth-based. We cannot know the future so we don't know what revelations will take place if ever.

In the meantime the quality of reports here have not changed from the first thread to the present ones.

originally posted by: Aliensun
a reply to: Uggielicious

The "critical thinking" crowd and the James Oberg crowd ... And they back that view up by constantly saying UFOs don't exist. ...

You state some good points but I'll address the ones that need a little clearing up. The "critical thinking" crowd and the James Oberg crowd" consists of people who question because they have not had a satisfying UFO experience in which the observed UAO (Unidentified Aerial Object) cannot be explained with their mental database. I'm a skeptic by nature and I don't have a belief system. But until I experience anything I will always be curious as to what it is that was experienced. Before I had my first UAO sighting I was curious about reports but not being a hard-line skeptic I didn't deny that people were seeing things that were not human-made, there had to be something to the mystery. Being a hard-line skeptic such as Robert Sheaffer is not healthy. One has to develop a curiosity to accept that we humans don't know everything about ourselves and the world we live in. What keeps hard-line skeptics from accepting the vast circumstancial evidence that exists is beyond me.

The whole business used to be contained in a simple paradigm, see a UFO or photograph it and there you have proof of ETs. Those triggers continue to spark a lot of conversions into the believer crowd if as much by personal experience as any other reason. But of course, such evidence carry no weight with the opposition that totally denies the phenomena as being related to intelligent being visiting us. ...

Seeing a UFO or photographing it or videographing it is not automatic proof of E-Ts, that is an assumption not based on evidence. We don't know if there are other beings besides humans, regardless of the Drake Equation which starts with zero and ends with zero. Pronouncements do not create reality.

The public is waiting on government to provide some good news about the ETs, but there is no good news for humanity as it resides on the planet today. We are not alone. ...

It is obvious for governments to exist but governments are composed of citizens and because they're politicians they don't automatically drink at the fountain of knowledge. As evidenced by the incompetence and downright stupidity of some or most of our elected representatives, I do not expect any of them to know more about UFOs than I do. They cannot provide one iota of knowledge about UFOs or alleged "aliens" anymore than you or I can. Good news? All we get is bad news.

We are alone! No evidence for the opposite.

originally posted by: Uggielicious
A few years ago this forum was abuzz by alleged abductionists, by claims of interaction with "aliens", etc. Now I return and there's nary a similar thread. Where are the "greys"? Did they stop "floating" victims through the roof to a waiting craft to receive a physical tune-up? To have your psychic oil changed?

What alien ? there never been an alien ever proven visiting the earth in any one of the thousands of UFO cases investigated by real field investigator.

I believe that Regan and then Bush's and probably Bill made some agreements with the Aliens to bring a New World Order to earth and to create a peaceful humanity. They gave us a chance and for a short period we got close to it in around year 2000. 911 brought the end to humanity joining the Universe of intelligent Aliens out there any time soon.

Aliens have left the building for now. We failed to meet the standard required to be given access to advanced alien knowledge and technology. If we are lucky at least some humans were allowed to join them in exploring and traveling the Universe.

Perhaps when we mature beyond belief in Santa Clause that cause most of our wars, we will be given another chance.

originally posted by: MrJohnSmith
Respectfully, the good ship Ufology has foundered on the rocks of critical thinking skills....

( Hopefully.)

One has nothing to do with the other. UFOs do not depend on any human trait, they're here and not even the brightest mind can explain anything about them.

What's foundered is our inability to explain them since we have nothing to go on. All we are able to do is see them, photograph them, video them, and discuss them as we are doing. We are all on the same playing level, no one has any advantage.

originally posted by: 3n19m470
If et exists they are well aware of our level of technology and may have taken steps to hide themselves better. Plus during the 50s, it was the Atomic age and they had a good reason to be here in greater numbers and maybe wanted to make themselves known as a warning or whatever. Now it's hard to say what is ET or top secret human built craft.

The problem with your thinking is that you obviously believe that et exists even though there isn't one iota of evidence. We humans created et, like god and jesus. No evidence. And et is a romantic notion based on the extrapolation of UFOs having to originate outside of earth and very far away. The alleged reality of et is based on faulty logic.

And it's already been said, but the beating is what is driving these people away. And the fact that the rules are enforced depending on if you are on the side of the debunker or believer. You can get away with calling someone pretty much every name in the book if they come here with an odd story. You can break the rule of not discussing members or ex members and accuse anyone of being "Bernie Schnitzle" if they have a story that is too out there for you. Breaking that rule is an ongoing joke around here.

Not true. First, since this is an open forum and anyone can join and post whatever is in their minds, hoping to attract similar thinkers, no evidence is required and enforced. Every single thread that I read dealing with aliens and alien abduction was flimsy. Not everyone can write like Whitley Strieber, except me!

It doesn't really matter if this site dwindles away because the site has already made truckloads of money for all involved to retire off of.

Those pesky, aggravating money-making popups!

originally posted by: milomilo

originally posted by: Uggielicious
A few years ago this forum was abuzz by alleged abductionists, by claims of interaction with "aliens", etc. Now I return and there's nary a similar thread. Where are the "greys"? Did they stop "floating" victims through the roof to a waiting craft to receive a physical tune-up? To have your psychic oil changed?

What alien ? there never been an alien ever proven visiting the earth in any one of the thousands of UFO cases investigated by real field investigator.

Precisely! But you gotta admit that there is an "alien" culture that does not depend on evidence. "Don't bother me with the facts" is their motto and authors see this culture as a cow sees a green pasture, waiting to be eaten or in the case of alien believers waiting to be fleeced with sometimes well-told tales. Whitley Strieber has a permanent grin from his constant visits to the bank!

originally posted by: Xeven

Aliens have left the building for now. We failed to meet the standard required to be given access to advanced alien knowledge and technology. If we are lucky at least some humans were allowed to join them in exploring and traveling the Universe.

Perhaps when we mature beyond belief in Santa Clause that cause most of our wars, we will be given another chance.

Kind of agree with you - I think that it is entirely possible that ET has been and gone, but not because we failed to meet standards or strike deals.

It's taken for granted that when ET comes, they'll come and stay forever, but it's entirely possible that they were operating under a finite time limit all along (possibly measured in thousands of years) and have to head back. What if experiences so far have been just an advance scouting party?

I doubt "they" have gone home. Ever since we learnt how to make fire they have been watching and observing. I don't see any reason why that would change. And besides, if some of the reports are to be believed, they need us for our DNA, genetic materials and maybe our resources like Gold. And with us messing about with nukes and other weapons of mass destruction, they don't want their supplies to destroy itself anytime soon. It just may be that they have stepped back into the shadows for a bit whilst we tackle the religious zealots and hatred that is running riot around the world right now. Personally I think we need a cosmic kick up the backside with a very much overdue First Contact situation. It would help sort out that religious hatred for starters, although I realise you will get die hards who have such blinkered vision of the world.

They are watching and always have been.

originally posted by: Xeven
911 brought the end to humanity joining the Universe of intelligent Aliens out there any time soon.

i dont understand why would 911 brought the end of humanity ? it is just a local event in USA and only resulted in a minuscule deaths compared to the horrible deaths of innocents in iraq and afghanistan from the illegal US invasion and occupation..

originally posted by: milomilo

originally posted by: Xeven
911 brought the end to humanity joining the Universe of intelligent Aliens out there any time soon.

i dont understand why would 911 brought the end of humanity ? it is just a local event in USA and only resulted in a minuscule deaths compared to the horrible deaths of innocents in iraq and afghanistan from the illegal US invasion and occupation..

Indeed. Look at WW2 and the Holocaust. Horrific in every way. Humanity at it's worse.