The Snowden Psyop Continues: Now Comes The Fallout

Heff, I also want to say I totally agree with you that information like Wikipedia and open source software needs to be protected. Open source software and Wikipedia are made by people who enjoy what they are doing, and would like to donate their time and work to the community.

What is so bad about having that kind of information and programs available for those who want to use Linux, or have an open source word processor (which I use) and such?

I see no issues with having open-source software available for people to use. There is plenty of information already in the creative common domain, including movies, fairy tales, and whatnot. In fact, I think it is a great idea to have open-source software.

I think that the indie movement is a good one, as it supports hobbyists who are not interested in buying expensive software and would not - but simply enjoying their hobbies in their off time

In the process, people in poor countries might even find use for the software that they could not afford to buy anyway!

Some smart businesses are adapting to that, for example, Unity, which is a software platform for creating Indie games that can even be released to Xbox Arcade. It comes with all you need to make a game, however,

There are also content packs you can buy for things like vehicles, characters, weapons, scenery, scripting, anything you can think of! A lot of the content packs are even donated.

I have a rock band, and it is an indie band, I am not interested in buying thousand-dollar software and twenty-thousand dollar studio equipment, because it would not be cost-efficient for a hobby.

Therefore, I am quite happy with open-source software like "Audacity." If that kind of software came under attack, I would get furious and probably never buy from the offending company again, tell my friends not to, and write my senator -

Who, by the way, I am on good terms with at the moment.

Look what happened to the music industry, they totally shipwrecked because they didn't adapt. I mean there are positive ways for any kind of media company to move forward given the newly presented opportunities in the market.

In fact, a changing business climate is one of the best times to make tons of money, as finding something innovative that meets the new needs of the customers is available - this is an opportunity, not something scary!

The companies that refuse to recognize new opportunities will hopefully lose tons of money, although they may try to spend a lot of money to make laws in order to force their unpractical business methods on people,

That is kind of hilarious that they would spend all that money bribing senators and all of that time and effort tricking people instead of just making something useful

Like Netflix, Netflix is a great success! I love subscribing to them for $10 a month and having access to a quality streaming library. It is not necessarily about getting things for free for me,

But entirely about the fact that watching Netlix pisses me off way less than watching television and having ads slammed in my face for about 2/3 of the time and not being able to pick what I want to see.

In the past, without Netflix, of course I was going to download shows! I would never watch television while there was another option that was much more user-friendly.

reply to post by Hefficide


Interesting thread Hefficide,

But don't worry lol, NO ONE will ever come after Linux lol, it would be like humans attacking an advance alien race that gave the humans every scrap of technology they ever had.

Seriously they write the codes for every commercial operating system with FOSS, and the only reason they sell is because commercial OS are idiot friendly. Every government on Earth would be hacked and trashed if they even slightly hinted that they would do such a thing.

Besides Snow was an administrator, meaning he is the one who controlled the USB ports. They guy was the watch dog. Sure he could be a US agent or a Kremlin Agent or a corporation agent, most likely he is all three lol. He is after all a contractor.

But don't worry about FOSS, what's happening is everyone is trying to make ends meet and no true person at the helm of this idiocracy, just a bunch of idiots trying to get a second term, or stay in office, or hit a second quarter goal, or just pay the damn rent. No one has time to think about the future. With the exception of FOSS the way things should, have, and will be done.

The Rat.

reply to post by Hefficide

The above, directly from an Associated Press article seems fairly innocuous and non-problematic on the surface. But between the lines there are some very, very dangerous tones being tiptoed around.

I see, so although it isn't in there, it is in there if you use your imagination really hard.

Anyone with a fair amount of computer knowledge will probably begin to zero in on the issues rather rapidly. Snowden was almost certainly utilizing FOSS ( Free open source software ) both in his job and in his ( supposed ) extra curricular activities.

Seems like he hacked his way around their computers, whatever or how he did it, what does this have to do with the public?

If it takes imagination and speculation, it is not evidence.

IE it is beginning to appear that the powers that be are going to be shifting blame toward the FOSS software Snowden ( and all of us ) had access to...

A giant leap, based on a connection that isn't there at all.

He was working on their network for god sakes.

the gaping HOLE IN THE STORY OF HOW A FEDERAL CONTRACTOR IN A SENSITIVE INSTALLATION WAS ABLE TO NOT ONLY SMUGGLE USB THUMB DRIVES IN AND OUT - BUT WAS PLACED AT WORK STATIONS WITH LIVE AND UNCONTROLLED USB PORTS!!!!

More speculation and assumption.

If you are not going to put forward any piece of tangible evidence that says they are going after FFOS software, apart from making stuff up "between the lines", I have no reason to see your claims as likely to be true.

This is one of the many reasons I personally believe Snowden is an active agent and that this entire episode was planned

I believe that much, but the objective seems to be to get people as scared and paranoia as possible of big bad NSA.

reply to post by Hefficide

Even if you don't know a thing about Linux - think of it this way... In cyberspace Linux is every bit as important to our freedoms as the fight for gun rights is. The two fights are very, very similar in scope and consequence. If FOSS software is classified as dangerous by the US government, and we are all left with just Windows and Apples OS as our choices? Well we might as well just pull up a second chair and sit an NSA agent down next to us when we are online - because their view to our activities will be exactly that open and unimpaired.

Nice comparison.

I don't know much about the stuff, but why do you think that the NSA can't track you if you use Linux?

Also who cares anyway? I don't use Linux. Let them watch.

I never had the illusion that the information I send trough the systems of other parties, is private.

The whole idea is prepostrous though, as if for every single person using the net, an NSA agent would be looking along. And especially if you are not using Linux.

Get real Heff.

Click here for more information.

Originally posted by NeoParadigm

Nice comparison.

I don't know much about the stuff, but why do you think that the NSA can't track you if you use Linux?

I never actually suggested anything of the sort. The entire data stream is susceptible to intrusion or compromise.

Originally posted by NeoParadigm

Also who cares anyway? I don't use Linux. Let them watch.

I would think a lot of people care - especially those who understand the First, Fourth, and Fifth Amendments.

Originally posted by NeoParadigm

I never had the illusion that the information I send trough the systems of other parties, is private.

Then you are more cynical than most as, pre Snowden, a "reasonable expectation to privacy" was the norm.

Originally posted by NeoParadigm

The whole idea is prepostrous, as if for every single person using the net, an NSA agent would be looking along. And especially if you are not using Linux.

Get real Heff.

Apparently you totally missed the ball and bit a bit too deeply into the analogy on this one. Windows and the Apple OS are closed source. It is common knowledge, for example, that Windows has quite a number of backdoors built into it... Many of which cannot be shut down or eliminated without breaking the OS/ Linux, as of now, is transparent and one can make sure that there are no backdoors running.

The preposterous part, IMO, is that some fail to understand that the data is being analyzed and that it doesn't take a 1 to 1 ratio of NSA agents to accomplish it.

reply to post by TucoTheRat

There has been a huge attack on FOSS for ever dude, it's called Windows and Mac OS. The fact that you have to use "wine" to play a game or use some Win/Mac only programs is proof enough. The fact there are like maybe "two?" ,if that, viruses for FOSS is proof enough that there is a huge attack on users using anything but idiot friendly Corp Crap products. Please understand that flapping your trap does not make you sound like you know what your talking about.

I just said I don't know much about the stuff.

Anyway, what you say has nothing to do with Snowden or that article. If an OP makes claims he should offer more than "it is between the lines". I see no connection, not even implied.

Seriously, evidence? evidence of what are you asking for? Are you so incapable of reading between the lines that that the need to do so makes you grumpy, impolite and soap box for evidence?

Like I said, I see nothing in the article that supports the claims made by the OP.

You have the passion of a true thinker, but you totally lack thought when you post and you come off as this annoying thing that just wont go away.

Maybe the problem lies with you. Maybe you should just discuss on topic things instead of talking about me personally.

STOP ASKING FOR EVIDENCE ON MATTERS OF OPINION!!! (this is a discussion, debate but not a grammar school showdown for the teacher)

Stop asking for evidence? That is your advice?

Matters of opinion? Is this thread in Skunk Works?

If an op makes claims I expect evidence, not speculation and imagination.

I suggest that you stop talking to me.

reply to post by Hefficide

I never actually suggested anything of the sort. The entire data stream is susceptible to intrusion or compromise.

So why say this?

Even if you don't know a thing about Linux - think of it this way... In cyberspace Linux is every bit as important to our freedoms as the fight for gun rights is. The two fights are very, very similar in scope and consequence. If FOSS software is classified as dangerous by the US government, and we are all left with just Windows and Apples OS as our choices? Well we might as well just pull up a second chair and sit an NSA agent down next to us when we are online - because their view to our activities will be exactly that open and unimpaired.

What is the importance of Linux if they can follow you anyways. Like I said, who cares?

The preposterous part, IMO, is that some fail to understand that the data is being analyzed and that it doesn't take a 1 to 1 ratio of NSA agents to accomplish it.

I am fully aware of that, so why do you say stuff like this,

Well we might as well just pull up a second chair and sit an NSA agent down next to us when we are online - because their view to our activities will be exactly that open and unimpaired.

Yes everything is analyzed by software, in very few cases this might lead to actual observation. It's not quite like the picture you painted there.

The entire data stream is susceptible to intrusion or compromise.

That is my point, what are you warning about?

It's already here. It has been for years.

The only thing we can do is not be scared.

reply to post by NeoParadigm

Originally posted by NeoParadigm

I just said I don't know much about the stuff.

Anyway, what you say has nothing to do with Snowden or that article. If an OP makes claims he should offer more than "it is between the lines". I see no connection, not even implied.

This has much to do with how the big picture is eluding you. The closed source / control angle that the NSA and FBI enjoy with Microsoft and Apple - both companies that are increasingly litigious and protective of "their markets" ( which include ALL digital communications devices BTW - and which the courts are beginning to be much more helpful with as of late ) versus open source options.

The NSA, with the complicity of my ISP, my social networking sites, and my email providers, having access to every single thing I transmit digitally is ONE thing... But thanks to Linux I can have a fairly comfortable knowledge that the NSA and FBI are not rooting through my physical storage devices as will - and that, if they are, my superior firewall, encryption, and other measures are making it a very difficult task for them.

Whereas a Microsoft user literally has an open door for these agencies ( as well as private corporations ) to simply waltz in and rummage through whatever they wish.

Frankly put, FOSS software makes spying on us more difficult and that is why many ( myself included ) feel that it is soon to be targeted. The first wave of such a targeting will be by negative association... Terrorists rely upon Linux.... That horrible man who did that horrible thing used Linux as part of his preparations... etc.

While I am not a psychic nor infallible... I do happen to be someone who does know "about the stuff" and who has a pretty good track record for seeing coming trends.

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reply to post by Hefficide

The NSA, with the complicity of my ISP, my social networking sites, and my email providers, having access to every single thing I transmit digitally is ONE thing... But thanks to Linux I can have a fairly comfortable knowledge that the NSA and FBI are not rooting through my physical storage devices as will - and that, if they are, my superior firewall, encryption, and other measures are making it a very difficult task for them.

Illusions, if they are already observing you, they are going to get to your files too, if they want.

There is still no tangible connection between the article and your claims, whatsoever.

Frankly put, FOSS software makes spying on us more difficult and that is why many ( myself included ) feel that it is soon to be targeted. The first wave of such a targeting will be by negative association... Terrorists rely upon Linux.... That horrible man who did that horrible thing used Linux as part of his preparations... etc.

What is stopping them from using those words right now, if this is the obvious agenda? If this is the objective of the article then why is there no connection made? Why didn't they mention Linux or any FOSS? Why do we have to read between the lines?

Click here for more information.

reply to post by TucoTheRat


And you don't see the pattern off you baiting and harassing me while I am in a discussion with the Op of a thread, about the thread?

There has been a huge attack on FOSS for ever dude, it's called Windows and Mac OS. The fact that you have to use "wine" to play a game or use some Win/Mac only programs is proof enough. The fact there are like maybe "two?" ,if that, viruses for FOSS is proof enough that there is a huge attack on users using anything but idiot friendly Corp Crap products. Please understand that flapping your trap does not make you sound like you know what your talking about.

Ok, but you just said this,

But don't worry lol, NO ONE will ever come after Linux lol, it would be like humans attacking an advance alien race that gave the humans every scrap of technology they ever had.

Besides Snow was an administrator, meaning he is the one who controlled the USB ports.

But don't worry about FOSS

So first you refute Heff's claims. Then I refute Heffs claims. Then you try to refute my claim by stating the exact opposite of what you said to Heff.

And even call me a shill?

You basically did the same thing I did.

It is clear that you simply must argue with me, and you will even make a 180 to do so.

ATTENTION........

You are responsible for your own posts. and that means we expect civility and decorum within all topics.

--Off Topic, One Liners and General Back Scratching Posts--

Failure to heed this message has consequences.


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reply to post by NeoParadigm

Illusions, if they are already observing you, they are going to get to your files too, if they want.

NP?

You should have stuck with, "I don't know much about this". Listen, I am a connoisseur of stirring up #; you aren't very good at it. You are trying to do a lot of it, it's obvious that you have just recently discovered your desire to do it, and you suck at it.

I will admit that I had high hopes, but you fold under pressure because you don't bring enough rigour to the game to have any kind of follow-through.

Now, would you like to live in a world where computers drive everything are the basis of everything, but you are only allowed access to the type of computer and software that you are authorized to have in your possession?

There are a lot of folks running around that don't have the knowledge to understand that there is a war on concerning this very thing. It's okay, though, the learning curve is very steep, and the world is such a busy place, can't expect everyone to be on top of everything.

So, we'll give you a break here, if you promise to behave, go read this; it's the abstract from a 1 hour talk by Cory Doctorow called The coming civil war over general computation, again, it's the short version.

Why don't you give that a read and then come on back to the discussion?

boingboing.net...

Have a nice day.

reply to post by Bybyots


Why are you discussing me?

I'll just repeat this question that is still unanswered.

What is stopping them from using those words right now, if this is the obvious agenda? If this is the objective of the article then why is there no connection made? Why didn't they mention Linux or any FOSS? Why do we have to read between the lines?

This is about this thread and its premise. It is based on imagination.

I don't need to review other information about what's going on in the world. The thread's premise is flawed.

Either refute that claim, or stop talking.(like you are some sort of authority, joke).

There have been plans for some time for Internet 2.0 would you not think? A way to follow, and watch, and know everything that a person is doing?

1. Collection - this is the step to where we are all catalogued. Grouped. We are pushed by our browser searches and what we read about and visit each day. We are fed what we believe as a collective.

2. Sort - After we are grouped, we are then sorted into smaller subsections and split further. Here is where the limits are set. Where we reclassified not based on who we are, what we are or what we believe in but molded. Shaped. Shown a path through data that TPTB want us to be.

3. Control - When we are finally categorized and conditioned we can then be convinced of what we do not need, what we do not want and who we do not want to be. The final event will be something that will usher in not censorship but a new way to look at the web. A new, safer way for the public and the government. We are almost done with this phase.

Manning and then Snowden. There will be one more and it will be the final strike. 3 phases are all that is needed. A major hit against the NASDAQ, or a power grid and there will be no questions. TPTB will have control because the collective will 'think' that is what is needed.

When that happens, you can have all the happy penguin programming you want and it will mean nothing if you cannot connect to others. Just my two cents...

reply to post by NeoParadigm

Why are you discussing me?

That has been your refrain on two threads that I have shared with you over the last couple of days. I guess it's because you are loud and are drawing attention to yourself.

What is stopping them from using those words right now, if this is the obvious agenda? If this is the objective of the article then why is there no connection made? Why didn't they mention Linux or any FOSS? Why do we have to read between the lines?

As a system administrator, Snowden had the ability to move around data and had access to thumb drives that would have allowed him to transfer information to computers outside the NSA's secure system, Alexander has said.

www.military.com...

What sort of operating systems and applications that are able to discreetly transfer files run on USB sticks, NP? Those might be the lines to read between.

reply to post by Bybyots

That has been your refrain on two threads that I have shared with you over the last couple of days. I guess it's because you are loud and are drawing attention to yourself.

In both cases I was in a discussion with an OP, asking him questions. Then people start heckling me and then when I respond I get blamed for the off topic discussion.

I am not going to play anymore. I was talking to the OP. You are again, off topic, talking about me, despite being asked not to do so. It is clear that the problem lies with you, not me.

What sort of operating systems and applications that are able to discreetly transfer files run on USB sticks, NP? Those might be the lines to read between.

That's it? That's the rebuttal you are trying to justify your presence here with?

They are saying that he used thumb drives to smuggle the data from the NSA centre to a computer elsewhere. That's it.