The Mistakes of Christianity

hi OP. i'm trying to get to the bottom of this also..

i spent a lot of time in the occult scene only to come back to what i left in the first place (bible teachings) ..i'm not going to preach to you but this is how i see all this..

we've got what seems to be 2 different camps here, the first is a group who want us to believe everything starts around 6000 years ago, they've effectively scrubbed all the prehistoric records clean and have used the bible as a basis for this. (let's get into the jewish traditions, mithraism, zoroastrianism, gnosis roots later?) this is a monotheistic system (we all know this much) it purports man is inherently flawed and claims a savior is required. i can't say if this is the truth or not, as one poster said, it's been 2000 years and noone's been able to crack it yet.

the second camp lurks behind this first camp. they are often alluded to but not officially recognized by the mainstream, they've been revealing themselves carefully, slowly, strategically.. these are the heralds of the gnosis, new-age, spiritual movement (paganism) ..it's polytheistic, and the core belief is 'man is god' and creates his own destiny (no need for a saviour)

in the past we're told these groups at times cooperated (eg: the crusades, vatican/templar alliance) and we're also told at times they fight amongst themselves (eg: the destruction of the templars and death of Jacque DeMolay)

interesting bedfellows..

part of your opening statement;

The thing is, Christianity in America has evolved over the years in such a strange and outlandish way. But with so many different offshoots and sects of the same religion, they all tend to have the same set of beliefs that are actually wrong, based on the very book that they worship.

noone can argue with this and everyone dislikes Benny Hinn. most of these offshoots and sects you mentioned were attempts to graft-on new ideologies onto the existing biblical system, and most of the core beliefs were all 'borrowed' from the new age movement. an example is Joseph Smith (iirc) claiming the moon is inhabited by beings who dress like Quakers (this was redacted sometime in the 20's or 30's iirc?.. there are also many other examples)

the problem i have with this is how it's exactly like the mystery school (masons, etc) system of gradiated knowledge being imparted in successive degrees, which changes at every degree.. there is no truth in it. personally i came to prefer the message of Jesus (the same yesterday, today and tomorrow) who tells us we shall know the truth and it shall set us free ..but as i said, i'm still trying to get to the bottom of it, as of now i'm just going on faith (pause for laughter)

you've also claimed christians worship 'that book' ...most christians take issue with these "same religion(s), they all tend to have the same set of beliefs that are actually wrong" (and were attempts to graft onto the established christian system) ...in many ways we're still on the same page



..i'll come back and finish this asap, i've just been drafted into peeling potatos

Originally posted by micmerci
reply to post by jiggerj

 

I am interested in where it says all homosexuals are thrown into hell. Can you provide a reference?

Neither fornicators, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals,...will inherit the Kingdom of God.
(1 Corinthians 6:9-11)

If they don't inherit the kingdom of god, where else but hell will they go? There's more here: Bible warnings

But, please don't make this a gay thing. It's about not believing in the entire bible, or even just disagreeing with parts of it. If you don't agree with parts of the Christian bible, then you are not a Christian. This makes you free to make a religion of light and inspiration without all the crudeness and fear-spreading of the Catholic bible.

Originally posted by micmerci

No, sorry, reading comprehension is an important thing. In the first verse of Exodus 34, the LORD said that HE (the LORD-still with me?) would write what was on the first 2 stones. Then, the LORD told Moses to write the covenant in verse 27 which you so kindly referenced above. Still two different things- still fail. [/endquote]



Do you guys realize that you are arguing over a piece of literature written hundreds of years ago that's talking about a guy that walked around the desert for a long time with out eating, then climbed a mountain hallucinated and heard a voice in his head that said was god?

reply to post by allenidaho

what is the meaning of atheist in USA ! I know that you are not a live dictionary but I see sort of monotheism in your first post. then how do you call yourself an atheist ! in this sense we should call all of those who are really worshiping The One God or at least invoke him for help, as atheist.

Originally posted by allenidaho
6. No one will ever be able to read the full version of the Bible.

Um...

No. You are clearly not an historian of scripture, but if you saunter over to your nearest Catholic bookstore, and get a Catholic Bible, you are getting "the full version of the Bible". Protestant Bibles differ only in that they do not include the Apocrypha -- a handful of books of the Hebrew Bible (not the New Testament) that Martin Luther took issue with.

For the last several centuries, several books of the bible have been removed by the church and lost to history for one reason or another.

Take the Gospel of Eve, for example.

Again, no. Non-canonical books are non-canonical for a reason -- they were never a part of the orthodox Christian Bible. Most, in fact, were never even considered for inclusion, because they are not Christian texts. The Gospel of Eve, for example, is a Gnostic text, and would not be considered for canon because it is a work of a different religion -- you might as well complain that there are no Islamic or Hindu texts included in the Christian Bible.

Before making such grandiose claims, do yourself a favour and study the history of what you're talking about -- since you are making historical claims, being (apparently) completely ignorant of Christian history does not further your cause.

Originally posted by allenidaho
All the good stuff taken out. And they wonder why I'm an atheist.

God does NOT wonder why you are an atheist.

All of your excuses will mean NOTHING on the day that you stand before Him.

He gave you HIS Word BUT He will never force it upon anyone.

So MANY here are deceived concerning the importance of taking God at His word.

Below is an interview with someone who had a face to face encounter with Jesus.

Jesus explained to her that we MUST believe God and trust HIM to protect His written word.

Nathan Leal interviews "CJ"

A Testimony of a Face to Face Encounter with the Lord Jesus Christ

This quote is the key point: "You don't believe my word the Bible."

"It's My responsibility as God to protect My word for you."

A powerful testimony from a woman being interviewed by Nathan Leal. She tells of how she continued living her life in religious and self deception until she had a face to face encounter with the risen Lord, Jesus, who rebuked her and made it clear to her in no uncertain terms that it's either she was going to surrender all or nothing at all. On his terms, and not on hers. Her testimony will really challenge you to want to make sure your heart is in the right place and that you're not detracted by idols.

reply to post by Murgatroid


God does not exist. So I think I will take my chances.

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reply to post by allenidaho


A couple of other things that Christians get wrong are:

1) God is love. Wrong! God, Yehweh, was a jealous, wrathful, vengeful god of war.

2) The Hebrew were monotheistic from the time of Abraham. Nope! Not only did the Hebrews honor other god's, Yahweh had a female counter part, a wife! They had a goddess, Ashera!

reply to post by adjensen


All of this proves one thing for sure, these are works of men, or not men but other beings who are hell-bent (lol) on making sure you believe the Creator of All has something to do with what they have commanded.

I guess what I am saying is, it makes no sense to believe any of the translations, when none of them in fact were meant to be included and packaged together in a book that is supposed to be the "Word of God".

To believe that "God" would ever feel the need to write inspired words, is very limiting indeed, sounds like the work of a group of descended masters, who must make sure the world never finds out the real truths, so they make these perfect storm religions, to confuse and give people purpose, against one another instead of against the deception.

It is even more bizarre that people will defend there masters, even when confronted with multiple anomalies, this is called FEAR...and nothing,ever, more.

Fear is the tool being used, and it is what is being fed to (what?) oh those darn terrorists again !

reply to post by allenidaho


I think what you have gotten, is everything wrong, because those 10 commandments aren't in my bible. No chapters, no verses and i can pull up 10 different jewish rabbis who do not even believe in Jesus to dispute your 10 commandments.

It seems to me what you have done is found yourself a website.

You? Atheist? LMAO, no such thing as an "Atheist".

In fact here is the real 10 commandments straight out of Exodus 20

And God spoke all these words:
2 “I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.
3 “You shall have no other gods before[a] me.
4 “You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. 5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, 6 but showing love to a thousand generations of those who love me and keep my commandments.

7 “You shall not misuse the name of the Lord your God, for the Lord will not hold anyone guiltless who misuses his name.
8 “Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is a sabbath to the Lord your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter, nor your male or female servant, nor your animals, nor any foreigner residing in your towns. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

12 “Honor your father and your mother, so that you may live long in the land the Lord your God is giving you.

13 “You shall not murder.
14 “You shall not commit adultery.
15 “You shall not steal.
16 “You shall not give false testimony against your neighbor.
17 “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house. You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, or his male or female servant, his ox or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbor.”

So much for your statement that they aren't in the bible. By the way, christians are not bound by the Law, Christ became the curse for us, and our only Law is his Royal Law. He became our law.

So Mr. Amateur, go do more research before you come here to troll about things you don't know anything about, because right now, you just made yourself look foolish to every one of us who are believers.

reply to post by allenidaho


Technically, his name was Emmanuel. Just sayin'.

Originally posted by Murgatroid

Originally posted by allenidaho
All the good stuff taken out. And they wonder why I'm an atheist.

God does NOT wonder why you are an atheist.

All of your excuses will mean NOTHING on the day that you stand before Him.

He gave you HIS Word BUT He will never force it upon anyone.

So MANY here are deceived concerning the importance of taking God at His word.

Below is an interview with someone who had a face to face encounter with Jesus.

Jesus explained to her that we MUST believe God and trust HIM to protect His written word.

Nathan Leal interviews "CJ"

A Testimony of a Face to Face Encounter with the Lord Jesus Christ

This quote is the key point: "You don't believe my word the Bible."

"It's My responsibility as God to protect My word for you."

A powerful testimony from a woman being interviewed by Nathan Leal. She tells of how she continued living her life in religious and self deception until she had a face to face encounter with the risen Lord, Jesus, who rebuked her and made it clear to her in no uncertain terms that it's either she was going to surrender all or nothing at all. On his terms, and not on hers. Her testimony will really challenge you to want to make sure your heart is in the right place and that you're not detracted by idols.

Isn't god an Idol? So he just doesn't want your worshiping Idols other than him? Kind of sounds like a tyrannical king doesn't it? Praise me or Ill throw you in hell just doesn't sound like something an omnipotent being would iterate.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000

I think what you have gotten, is everything wrong, because those 10 commandments aren't in my bible. No chapters, no verses and i can pull up 10 different jewish rabbis who do not even believe in Jesus to dispute your 10 commandments.

Exodus 34. The second tablets of stone. Why would he change them the second time around? Surely, had he given the second set of commandments the first time, his omniscient nature would have been clear to all. Furthermore, the "tablets" were not actually tablets.

The stones or pavement of sapphire described in Exodus 24:10 relates the effect Elohim had on the earth of Mount Sinai, when He stepped off His throne. Thus the stone that was prepared for the Ten Commandments had to have been sapphire. To think that YHWH etched His chief eternal commands of the Torah on anything else other than this material, denies basic deductive reasoning espoused directly from the text. Exodus 24:12; “Elohim said to Moshe, ‘Come up to me on the mountain and stay here, and I will give you the cubes of stone, with the law and commands I have written for their instruction."

Sapphire carries a natural and beautiful blue hue. This colour symbolises wisdom and heavenly stability. It is the colour of the sky, the sea, and the colour of the throne room of heaven. Midrash Lekakh Tov describes the sapphire on which the Ten Commandments were etched as being literally cut from YHWH’s very own throne.

The word “sapphire” appears in the TaNaK as “sapir” and is actually borrowed from a Sanskrit word. Though it is a foreign term, it does have a Semitic root that relates to the Hebrew words: sefer, meaning “book,” sipur, meaning “story” and safar, meaning “recount.”

Although the stones on which the Ten Commandments are written are almost universally perceived as two rectangular slabs with rounded off tops, the Ten Commandments, according to the Talmud, were engraved on two cubes of blue sapphire stone.

Question: But why were they cubed and why don't believers generally know about this?

Answer: In Hebrew they are called Luchot ha-Berit, which literally means,” Cubes of the Covenant.” Whilst the word “tablet” is not necessarily an incorrect transliteration, it is less accurate, because a “cube” describes dimension and volume whereas the term “tablet” does not. Orthodox Judaism has always known the Ten Commandments were inscribed onto cubes. However, the rest of the world, especially Christianity, does not normally look to the Jews for Scriptural advice. The truth is that most western people unconsciously draw this aspect of Bible history from Cecil B. Demille's Film The Ten Commandments.

www.flyingchariotministries.com...

As shown above, the tablets were actually sapphires. The Hebrew word generally translated as "tablet" actually means "sapphire". As related by ATS member , there is actually a legend:

If we now examine the Egyptian legend of Thoth we learn of a great jewel which is artificially made, a priceless object described as being either an emerald or a sapphire on which is inscribed the wisdom of the ancients. Again we are told that the purpose of this stone was to record the wisdom of a civilisation destroyed by a flood.

But wait! There's more!

Immediately I made the connection between the shemsu-hor and the “shem stone” of Sumer. The Sumerian text talk about a shem stone. A conical shaped stone that they venerated. This stone was also called a fire stone!

Aaannnnddd our little Christian myth hops all the way back to Sumerian times, in spite of every devout protest. Gee golly darn, whadaya know? When you do your research, there appears to be an astonishing number of overlaps between cultures and their faiths.

Further text:

Andrew Collins examined the ancient Egyptian Edfu text which talks about the gods coming into Egypt from a foreign land. Their home island is destroyed by a flood but it goes into greater detail as to what caused the flood.

The gods island was attacked and they tried to defend themselves using a conical shaped crystal housed in a temple at the centre of their island. Unfortunately this crystal released an energy which resulted in a flood. The gods took this crystal with them into Egypt and it was called a ben-ben stone or a fire crystal because it emitted a fiery energy. The stone was in the possession of a priesthood called the shemsu-hor who guarded it. It was placed in an underground vault/temple.

This is interesting because the Greek representation of YHWH is Tetragrammaton, otherwise translated as "four sides force of gravity". The Bible tells us of the Ark of the Covenant, which was said to contain the power of the LORD, which the Bible specifically notes is representative of Tetragrammaton, being used to part both the Red Sea and the Jordan River. Further research shows that the Egypitans possessed a relic able to part a lake in order to recover a lost piece of jewelry, which suggests that Exodus is actually the story of how Moses took the source of power from the pyramids, whose chambers contain a box precisely fitted to the dimensions of the Ark, and was subsequently chased out of Egypt.

Talk about mistakes in Christianity!

So Mr. Amateur, go do more research before you come here to troll about things you don't know anything about, because right now, you just made yourself look foolish to every one of us who are believers.

Wow. Is this what we can expect from orthodox Christians? I can see why the atheism movement is swiftly picking up speed...especially considering what objective scientific research tells us, as demonstrated above.

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reply to post by AfterInfinity

Exodus 34. The second tablets of stone. Why would he change them the second time around? Surely, had he given the second set of commandments the first time, his omniscient nature would have been clear to all. Furthermore, the "tablets" were not actually tablets.

Apparently, they, the first commandments, were too hard, and God had to reconsider them.

Here's what God said about his commandments.

Surely, this commandment that I am commanding you today is not too hard for you, nor is it too far away…

See, I have set before you today life and prosperity, death and adversity. If you obey the commandments of the Lord your God that I am commanding you today, by loving the Lord your God, walking in his ways, and observing his commandments, decrees, and ordinances, then you shall live and become numerous, and the Lord your God will bless you in the land that you are entering to possess.

But if your heart turns away and you do not hear, but are led astray to bow down to other gods and serve them, I declare to you today that you shall perish…I have set before you life and death, blessings and curses. Choose life so that you and your descendants may live…. (Deut. 30:11–19)

Here's what modern day Essenes claim were the first commandments.
The Book of Moses

They claim this text was found with the Dead Sea Scrolls. There is no public translation of this text, but many of the scrolls' text are withheld from the public and/or are in private libraries. So, who knows!

reply to post by windword


Yeah, I heard about that. Even more so, how they claimed the Copper Scrolls were fakes. And then the scrolls were proven right! Yet they still won't release all the scrolls to the public...makes you wonder what truth they are hiding.

reply to post by BriGuyTM90

Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree... yeah, makes perfect sense.

Can quote you on that?

reply to post by christina-66


You can't really argue with it, because all you've got are technicalities.

reply to post by allenidaho

1. The Ten Commandments. I'm sure everybody knows them, right? Wrong. Thou Shalt Not Kill. Thou Shalt Not Steal. Yeah? Only problem is that those are NOT the ten commandments. Don't believe me? Read your bible.

You see, in the Bible, Moses was given two stone tablets on which were inscribed the real ten commandments. But when he came down Mount Sinai in Exodus 32:19, he found many of his followers worshipping a golden calf idol. So he smashed the tablets. So he was sent back up the mountain with two fresh tablets to get the ten commandments again. In Exodus 34:13 the real ten commandments are listed which go something like this:
1. Don't worship any other Gods. For I am a jealous God.
2. Don't make treaties with those who live in the land.
3. Don't make any idols. (like, say a dead guy hanging on a cross)
4. Celebrate the Festival of Unleavened Bread
5. The first born of every womb belongs to God. And you must redeem them by sacrificing a lamb.
6. Rest on the 7th Day.
7. Celebrate the Festival of Weeks and Festival of Ingathering.
8. Do not offer God a blood sacrifice with Leavened Bread.
9. Bring the best of your first crops to the house of the Lord.
10. Do not cook a young goat in it's mother's milk.

The Ten Commandments are in Exodus 20. Exodus 34 is a renewal of the covenant, with some exposition of it.

2. Jesus is not named Jesus.

Yes, he was. Jesus, through the course of time, became the anglicized form of Yeshua.

ישוע was transliterated to Ἰησοῦς in Greek, which became Iesous in Latin, which became Iesus, then Jesus, in English. Why do I stress transliterated? Because a foreign name was brought into the languages with the sounds that that language had available. For example, there was no "sh" sound in Greek, so they could only use a sharp s sound.

At the end of the day it's the same name. It's only really been in modern times that names are left as they are when brought into other languages. In English there is the name Henry. There have been several kings with this name. When a German refers to these kings they name him Heinrich. You wouldn't wage to say that they're referring to the wrong person, or naming the person the wrong name would you?