I Need a Muslim (or Somebody) to Make This News Understandable and Acceptable.

reply to post by ollncasino


We need to understand where all this conflict is coming from.. The Muslim people in the Middle East are not concerned about who worships where and how. It is the leaders who have taken it upon themselves to change the very foundations of Islam to suit the way they control and maintain control. With that, they have an all access (Do what you feel like) as long as you keep the Petrol rolling our way.

Our leaders will not care about these issues coming from Saudi Arabia or Kuwait but if the likes of Iran or Syria were to tell the world this, we would be on to it straight away simply because they don't comply with our foreign policy etc. Most of the Muslim countries are run by Western puppets yet they can continue to say and do things like this? It sounds as though there is a concentrated plan from the West and some Muslim leaders to destroy Christianity and then Islam also.

Originally posted by Kemal

@ SoEpic: You said you would post something on facebook, showing your outrage if your country would have banned mosques. But yet you ask for Muslim opinion (and not those of Saudis)...

So, I'm challanging you. Post on facebook how the Vatican would never allow a mosque to be built in that autonomous region. How Switzerland has banned the construction of minarettes.

edit on 6-4-2013 by Kemal because: (no reason given)

edit on 6-4-2013 by Kemal because: (no reason given)

We are talking about destruction of churches not construction............

reply to post by charles1952


A lot of people don't realize that in the mid nineteenth century about half of the Arabian penninsula was non-Muslim.
They were divided between Christians and Jews. Wahabi promoted a new doctrine that is the basis of modern Al Qaeda thinking. That is that anyone that doesn't believe the same conservative Islam, is Kafir and worthy of death. The house of Saud took advantage of this by taking over what is now Saudi Arabia. They drove out, killed or forced "conversion" of about 400,000 people. They were able to do this because the British supported them with assistance. The British thought that having a reactionary form of Islam in control of the Holy places would weaken it. They didn't count on oil though.

At one time, few scholars agreed with Wahabi. In many Islamic Universities, moderates have been driven out(just like convervatives in USA) In Al Azhar university, the top Islamic School, all the moderates were driven out.

This will all come to roost on the House of Saud though. They will pay for their sins. After Syria, they're next.

reply to post by charles1952


The title of this thread is wrong. I dont see what an average Muslim from Algeria or Turkey has to do with what a nutjob from Saudi Arabia is preaching. The title of your thread should really be " I Need a Saudi to make this news understandable and Acceptable".

Originally posted by ArtooDetoo
The title of this thread is wrong. I dont see what an average Muslim from Algeria or Turkey has to do with what a nutjob from Saudi Arabia is preaching. The title of your thread should really be " I Need a Saudi to make this news understandable and Acceptable".

I'd agree if it weren't for one thing. It rallies the people of islamic faith across the globe when an injustice is perceived to have been committed against them, and it doesn't matter the cultural differences, which at a fundamental level are not that different, the outrage is felt and heard.

Only when it is perceived as an injustice. And we are told it is the impoverished, easily led minority that do this, and yet it is global and unified.

But if something that, at a fundamental level, something that these people all agree with comes to pass, then it is a vast silence world wide that is heard, and criticism that it is an attempt to slander the entire religion by a few outspoken individuals, who claim to be the voice of many.

Is the religion so fractured that there is indeed distinct yet intermingled groups, so fundamentally different at the core?

Why no concerted effort to silence the charlatans at every chance, they who speak on your behalf with words that go against your core? they claim the same god as you. Yet any slanderous libel from a non muslim causes world wide calamity

I think this was in line with what the OP was asking.

And from an outside perspective, I see it too.

What I really don't understand is why, in Muslim countries, other religions are not tolerated or supported, women are subjugated, and class distinction is very much a part of life. And if anyone questions them, they get a " its our country/religion, if you dont like it, dont come here response." YET, when Muslims come to North America, they demand mosques, the right to practice sharia law, they still subjugate women, they demand special accommodations in schools and elsewhere, and if anyone questions it, "religious discrimination" is thrown in our faces. It is such a double standard.

When n Rome, my friend, when in Rome... It's time for people to get their heads out of the fifth century. Women should be free to marry who they choose, they should not be covered from head to toe in fabric prisons, they should be considered full persons, receive full inheritances, not be circumcised, be able to freely divorce their husbands and keep their children. They shouldn't be subject to rapes, acid attacks, honor killings, or living their lives in servitude and seclusion.

. It's not about being a believer or being an infidel. They look at the world too black and white. I wish the rest of the world would draw a line in the sand and not tolerate anything Muslim until women are treated fairly and as equals for no people can ever progress or even be considered valid when they invalidate others in so many cruel ways.

Seems like TPTB have been long craving for the Saudi government to collapse.Even the royal family of al Saud appear to be exhusted and tiered of ruling for so long....Americans and the british inteligences decived the Saudis to interfere in Syria's affaires so they will carry on with the bad reputation among the arab nations for the rest of their existence...They even tried to get Iran involved with the Saudis in hope of that perhaps a conflict between the two would eventualy get rid of the Saudis and weaken Iran's infrustructure at the same time,,two birds one stone,, but that plan never worked out....On the other hand the people of Saudi Arabia have been protesting and criticising their government for a couple of years now....Considering all of those facts the Saudi regime seems to be expiered and perished in the near future.

"Mohammed is God's apostle. Those who follow him are harsh to the unbelievers but merciful to one another" Quran 48:29

www.mohabatnews.com...:saudi-arabia-declares-destruction-of-all-churches-in-region&catid=81:regi ons&Itemid=278

All citizens must adhere to Islam, and conversion to another religion is punishable by death. Public Christian worship is forbidden; worshipers risk imprisonment, lashing, deportation, and torture. Evangelizing Muslims and distributing non-Islamic materials is illegal. Muslims who convert to Christianity risk honor killings and foreign Christian workers have been exposed to abuse from employers.

Sheikh Abdul Aziz bin Abdullah, the Grand Mufti of Saudi Arabia, created an implication with his assertion. Nettleton explains, "This was in a meeting with Kuwaiti officials who came to Saudi Arabia. They were asking this Islamic official ‘What should we do about the churches?' His statement was, ‘There should be no Christian churches on the Arabian peninsula.'"

This proclamation could affect churches in Kuwait, Oman, Yemen, Bahrain, Qatar, and the United Arab Emirates. Nettleton observes that "in most of these countries, we're not talking about a lot of churches; we're talking about a few that are allowed to exist primarily to serve foreigners that are living in that country."

www.bosnewslife.com...

Muslims in Pakistan's Punjab province have threatened to kill a young woman as well as her husband, child and in-laws because she abandoned Islam and converted to Christianity, BosNewsLife learned Monday, April 1.

Originally posted by Zack241
reply to post by swan001

 

Hmm true but in your case however, it only affects the people in your country whereas these leaders in the Middle East are affecting all the Muslims in the world sadly :/

You're probably right... But I saw evidences that the level above POTUS are just one, big happy family which spreads from out here to Middle East and even China.

Oh how I wish there will be a leader in the near future who actually cares for the people and not for him/herself..

So do I... But I think it is quite unlikely... Hope for the best, prepare for the worst, as they say.

In Shariah Synagogues and Churches are not allowed to be destroyed and built on top of it Mosques. The people must live with each other in peace and harmony. RT has probably miss-quoted the sheikh or has taken the speech totally out of context. It's not possible that a Sheikh with so much knowledge would not know for fact that it isn't allowed to destroy churches. It's impossible and must be a lie against the him. After all, Rt is pro-Russian and anti-American and I think that's gotta do with some of it. And Russia has been anti-Islam for a long time now.

Originally posted by Misbah
In Shariah Synagogues and Churches are not allowed to be destroyed and built on top of it Mosques. The people must live with each other in peace and harmony. RT has probably miss-quoted the sheikh or has taken the speech totally out of context. It's not possible that a Sheikh with so much knowledge would not know for fact that it isn't allowed to destroy churches. It's impossible and must be a lie against the him. After all, Rt is pro-Russian and anti-American and I think that's gotta do with some of it. And Russia has been anti-Islam for a long time now.

Check two post up and there are other sources beside R.T.

reply to post by Misbah


I find it strange that you claim it is against Islam yet the very practice has been done since the time of Muhammad and continues to today.

Link

The Conversion of non-Muslim places of worship into mosques occurred primarily during the life of Muhammad and continued during subsequent Islamic conquests and under historical Muslim rule. As a result, numerous Hindu temples, churches, synagogues, the Parthenon and Zoroastrian temples were converted into mosques.

The conversion of non-Islamic places of worship into mosques has abated since no major territorial acquisitions have been made by Muslim majority populations in recent times. However, some of the Greek Orthodox churches in Turkey that were left behind by expelled Greeks in 1923 were converted into mosques.

A relatively significant surge in church-mosque conversion followed the 1974 Turkish Invasion of Cyprus. Many of the Orthodox churches in Northern Cyprus have been converted, and many are still in the process of becoming mosques.

It's not the same thing converting former Churches into mosques. That happens everywhere, but it doesn't mean that the church was forced to be turned into a mosque and it doesn't mean that the Christians were forced to flee and abandon their belief because Muslims were threatening them. You're getting it totally wrong, I highly doubt it was converted into a mosque by forcing the Christians out or forcing them to convert.

You can easily buy a Church and convert it into a Mosque because buildings are buildings. If I tear down a building to renovate it does it mean that I hate the people that live there?

Read the history of the Prophets battles and what his companions did whenever they conquered a place. They never erased a church to build in its place a mosque. I advise you to read about the Khalifa Umar's life and what he did for Islam.

Obviously it's easy to claim that Muslims erase Churches and build mosques in its place, but is it what Islam wants? There are many people that do wrong, It doesn't mean that Islam has told them to do wrong.

reply to post by Misbah

The destruction of Hindu temples in India during the Islamic conquest of India occurred from the beginning of Muslim conquest until the end the Mughal Empire throughout the Indian subcontinent.

In AD 1025, Mahmud destroyed and looted the temple, killing over 50,000 people who tried to defend it.[18] The defenders included the 90-year-old clan leader Ghogha Rana. Mahmud personally broke the gilded lingam to pieces and took them back to his homeland and placed them in the steps leading to the newly built Jamiah Masjid, so that they would be stepped upon by those going to the mosque to pray.

The temple was demolished several times by Muslim invaders, and was reconstructed again and again by Hindu kings.[20] After destruction of the original temple on the orders of Mughal emperor Aurangzeb's orders, a mosque was built which still stands.

I could go on and on but I think you get the point.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
Islam has resisted the ideas that have corrupted (former) Christian societies. Blasphemy is still severely punishable and homosexuals can't parade around like they do in Christian societies, in the west.

corrected ... Islam has resisted evolving and still severely punishes people who speak the truth or who worship differently (which they call blasphemy), and Islam is still severely bigoted against homosexuals and women having equal rights. There .. I corrected your statement for ya'. You're welcome.

The Grand Mufti should wear formal clothes for once.

reply to post by charles1952


Surah 109.001-006

"Say: O unbelievers! I do not serve that which you serve, Nor do you serve Him Whom I serve: Nor am I going to serve that which you serve, Nor are you going to serve Him Whom I serve: You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion."

In other words, the Quran, on the subject of religious freedom, supports it.

The words of this fraud who claims to be an Islamic holy man only goes to show that many of the leading decision makers in Islamic countries don't actually read their own book.

Here is my interpretation.

So, member will come and bash Islam with this idea of one Saudi-whahhabi mufti.

But they don't attack Islam because they have some thing against it.

Many of them don't believe in anything , but they are against believing.

So , they assume that Islam is going to dictate it's way of life.

But it doesn't.

The truth is that these Saudi muftis are the same old Saudi wahhabis which UK helped and they are now backing al-qaida.

So , you choose to listen Islam from your very puppets in the middle east ?

Do you think that Muslims are really stupid or you are very smart ?

www.presstv.ir...

Saudi family

This Saudi family is like the same old dictators which bited your hands one day. Such as OBL , Saddam and Qaddafi.

This news is more than a year old .

An old saudi "mufti" who've seen/heard nothing of the west but what they show on tv and hollywood (they mock religion and god all the time) giving his opinion . ''Not Muslims' opinion or Islam's opinion'' to protect the "islamic traditions". Even if this guy had authority I doubt he will take any action.

I don't think there is much to add of what muslims before already said.

But You cannot tie this to Mosques in the west. See , Saudi Arabia is an islamic monarchy. GB, USA, where you live is not a Christian monarchy . If it was, Muslims wouldn't be going there to live in the first place . Building churches in islamic monarchies (like saudi arabia) DOES NOT equal building mosques in Western countries like usa/GB/France or Germany.

And no His opinion Does NOT represent muslims in the west or east. I and all my siblings and my muslim friends here and back where I was born Don't have ANY problem living next to a Jew,Christian, or sun worshiper. As long as You respect and don't offend my religion. And I rather have churches built around me rather than night clubs or bars.

Originally posted by FlyersFan

corrected ... Islam has resisted evolving and still severely punishes people who speak the truth or who worship differently (which they call blasphemy), and Islam is still severely bigoted against homosexuals and women having equal rights. There .. I corrected your statement for ya'. You're welcome.

This is a really good example. Look how this person sees islam out of ignorance and narrow mind. This person FAILS to see the difference between Religion and Culture. If this person had authority with no consequences, words like the ones that came out of the Saudi mufti mouth, would come out of his.

the fact is

there is not much difference between the three religions, in ther pure form


as for your question
the amount of mosque and churches is down to the population needs.

the problem is, is disporportianate representation
ie...
1 million muslims get 3 mosques
1000 christians get 3 churches

also putting large intrusive structures in non-represented population areas
which is their biggest concern

but as i said...its all BS and an individuals perception... who cares