Atlantis the evidence: BBC documentary

reply to post by Kualros


Oh it's not my theory it belongs to these gents> Walter Pitman and Bill Ryan. Noah's flood, Gilgamesh's flood, the sinking of Atlantis is all the same flood. en.wikipedia.org...

PS
Plato's account

For it is related in our records how once upon a time your State stayed the course of a mighty host, which, starting from a distant point in the Atlantic ocean, was insolently advancing to attack the whole of Europe, and Asia to boot. For the ocean there was at that time navigable; for in front of the mouth which you Greeks call, as you say, 'the pillars of Heracles,' there lay an island which was larger than Libya and Asia together; and it was possible for the travelers of that time to cross from it to the other islands, and from the islands to the whole of the continent over against them which encompasses that veritable ocean. For all that we have here, lying within the mouth of which we speak, is evidently a haven having a narrow entrance; but that yonder is a real ocean, and the land surrounding it may most rightly be called, in the fullest and truest sense, a continent. Now in this island of Atlantis there existed a confederation of kings, of great and marvelous power, which held sway over all the island, and over many other islands also and parts of the continent

en.wikipedia.org...

What if Plato got it wrong on what he was recounting of something overheard as a young child?

What if what he thought he overheard as a child was really about the Black Sea and not the Atlantic? Maybe it was a land in the opposite direction, and the Atlantis account is about an offshore military fortification protecting some sort of narrow passage and also acted as a trade hub such as a freight breakdown and redistribution point in a convenient location. There would had been one such location when the Black Sea waters were much lower. Go to Google map and locate the city of Kerch in the Crimea. Then trace a straight line down to just off where the sea bed drops off. You will see there what looks like an underwater volcano. It at one time was a ring island with one way in and out of the center that could have served as a sheltered harbor matching Plato's convoluted account that he recited from memory that he head as a young child.

Read the following portion of Plato's account

That an island of such nature and size once existed is evident from what is said by certain authors who investigated the things around the outer sea. For according to them, there were seven islands in that sea in their time, sacred to Persephone, and also three others of enormous size, one of which was sacred to Hades, another to Ammon, and another one between them to Poseidon, the extent of which was a thousand stadia [200 km]; and the inhabitants of it—they add—preserved the remembrance from their ancestors of the immeasurably large island of Atlantis which had really existed there and which for many ages had reigned over all islands in the Atlantic sea and which itself had like-wise been sacred to Poseidon. Now these things Marcellus has written in his Aethiopica"

"seven islands in that sea." How about coastal cities around the Black Sea, and a few maybe were actual islands and peninsulas? "-from what is said by certain authors who investigated the things "around" the outer sea."

Btw whatever happened to the theory of the Azores being the seven islands mentioned in Plato's account? Lagoa Azul?

Atlantis was literally the Americas.

Even the Illuminati referred to the Americas as 'The New Atlantis' in the 1700s.

The old Atlantis (much like the new one) was an empire controlled by the fallen angel Lucifer, whose goal was( and still is) global control and the eventual conquest of 'heaven'. (All inhabited planets)

He's a lot closer to actually succeeding this time around...

Originally posted by DemonSpeedN
reply to post by trysts

 

I dont know where you got your information that Plato or Socrates sat on street corner telling their stories or preaching or whatever. Thats not the point, the point is the story of Atlantis originally came from the Egyptian priest, Plato didnt make it up he just re-told it. I think your confusing Plato with Aesop and his fables or maybe even Jesus with his followers listening to him preach the gospel.

In Athens, at the time of Plato and Socrates, standing on the street corner and offering your services an an educator, was what people did. Socrates would go around to these people, with their little groups of pupils hanging around them, and just embarrass them with his Socratic dialectic method, challenging their knowledge. Socrates would have his own group of followers(including Plato), who would hang out with him on the streets of Athens. It was because of this that he was brought to trial for corrupting the youth of Athens. He just walked about and embarrassed people.
I think Plato made up the story of Atlantis as a moral fable. You think he got it from an Egyptian priest. We will never know if his story was influenced from other stories, but I certainly don't take it literally.

You all present some interesting theories, both old & new, but I could have sworn the general consensus was that Atlantis, or the inspiration for it if nothing else, HAS been found?

Lost city of Atlantis believed found off Spain

To solve the age-old mystery, the team analyzed satellite imagery of a suspected submerged city just north of Cadiz, Spain. There, buried in the vast marshlands of the Dona Ana Park, they believe that they pinpointed the ancient, multiringed dominion known as Atlantis. The team of archaeologists and geologists in 2009 and 2010 used a combination of deep-ground radar, digital mapping and underwater technology to survey the site.
Freund's discovery in central Spain of a strange series of "memorial cities," built in Atlantis' image by its refugees after the city's likely destruction by a tsunami, gave researchers added proof and confidence, he said.
Atlantean residents who did not die in the tsunami fled inland and built new cities there, he added.

Originally posted by Nyiah
You all present some interesting theories, both old & new, but I could have sworn the general consensus was that Atlantis, or the inspiration for it if nothing else, HAS been found?

The general consensus in the archaeological community is that there was no Atlantis and that it was a story - perhaps based on real event, locations, the general consensus in the wider community appears to be, 'maybe yes, I think so'.

The site you noted is one of the places that may have inspired Plato's account.

i apreciate everyones theories and input
many thanks
looks like Atlantis is turning out to be another name for..........Earth
seeing as it is everywhere

Originally posted by WalterRatlos

Originally posted by Funk bunyip
reply to post by Hanslune

 

Cocaine, hash and nicotine (only grown in the Americas) found with Egyptian mummies, countless cultural parallels between societies which are assumed to have had no contact, countless parallel myths of a sea-faring white skinned people who brought civilization with them. White skinned caucasian mummies found in Chinese pyramids..)

Well, coc aine, hash and nicotine could have gotten to the mummies through contamination. For a long time all those substances were legal and many of the scientists handling the mummies might have contaminated them. White skinned explorers? Sure, I can buy that: every now and then an Egyptian papyrus boat or a Greek or Phoenician ship might have lost it's way and hopped over to the New Continent, the Americas. It might have happened occasionally, but the evidence is very flimsy. Apart from myths and stories there is not much there.

It probably should be mentioned that only a handful of Egyptian mummies show any of the daughter compounds of coc aine (none have been found that actually contain coc aine itself.)

And, of the handful that do contain these compounds, ALL have been displayed for decades at one of two European Museums, and were previously in private collections.

Not to mention the following problem:

“In the study, samples were taken from nine mummies that were dated from between 1070 B.C. to 395 A.D. The samples including hair, skin and muscle were taken from the head and abdomen.

If this world-wide ancient sailing civilization distributed coc aine to Egypt, why'd the Egyptians sit around for 10,000 years before using it?

Also, I find it laughable that people can bring themselves to believe that the so-called "myth" of Atlantis languished for 10,000 years before finally popping up around 350 BC with Plato.

After all, there was obviously a huge oral tradition of storytelling among the Greeks (not to mention basically every other ancient civ.) Note the traditional tale of Troy as an example. There are literally thousands of references to Troy in the mythos, artwork and other traditions of ancient Greece. Yet not a single reference to anything even remotely resembling this tale from Plato.

If this story predates writing (and it would, if it were true,) then why is there absolutely no myth whatsoever concerning Atlantis, and how on Earth was knowledge of this devastation passed on to eventually arrive at Plato?

Harte

Originally posted by Harte

If this story predates writing (and it would, if it were true,) then why is there absolutely no myth whatsoever concerning Atlantis, and how on Earth was knowledge of this devastation passed on to eventually arrive at Plato?

Harte

Hello my Friend.

You are onto something here Harte.

My question would be altered to some extent, and revolve around the Languages (family's) of Ancient Times.

Would we see some Origin Context bringing the three root languages together at some point?

And if so, would we be able to reflect on those similarities find they shared a common origin?

Now I know Donnelly's Atlantis, isn't a text that is 100% accurate in all matters, but the premise laid out in Chapter 8, does seem to point to that fact, the Aryan, Semetic and Asian, (Mongol-Chinese) Languages do have some uniqueness, yet share a common background which points to a common, or better said, commoner background.

I know you are quite adept at the Language side of things, and I am just wondering OUT LOUD, so to speak, to see what you think.

Would this even be plausible?

Chapter 8 for you review.

Looking forward to your insight on this my friend.

Ciao

Shane

Originally posted by Nyiah
You all present some interesting theories, both old & new, but I could have sworn the general consensus was that Atlantis, or the inspiration for it if nothing else, HAS been found?

Lost city of Atlantis believed found off Spain

To solve the age-old mystery, the team analyzed satellite imagery of a suspected submerged city just north of Cadiz, Spain. There, buried in the vast marshlands of the Dona Ana Park, they believe that they pinpointed the ancient, multiringed dominion known as Atlantis. The team of archaeologists and geologists in 2009 and 2010 used a combination of deep-ground radar, digital mapping and underwater technology to survey the site.
Freund's discovery in central Spain of a strange series of "memorial cities," built in Atlantis' image by its refugees after the city's likely destruction by a tsunami, gave researchers added proof and confidence, he said.
Atlantean residents who did not die in the tsunami fled inland and built new cities there, he added.

edit on 6/24/2012 by Nyiah because: (no reason given)

It's not in any possible strategic trade location to act as a hub for goods being shipped between organized settlements. Also their personal evaluations of their own so called evidence is highly suspect anyway.

Originally posted by Hanslune

Originally posted by Nyiah
You all present some interesting theories, both old & new, but I could have sworn the general consensus was that Atlantis, or the inspiration for it if nothing else, HAS been found?

The general consensus in the archaeological community is that there was no Atlantis and that it was a story - perhaps based on real event, locations, the general consensus in the wider community appears to be, 'maybe yes, I think so'.

The site you noted is one of the places that may have inspired Plato's account.

"the general consensus in the wider community"

As being about a known world during a certain time period.

I think that's it.

Originally posted by Shane
Now I know Donnelly's Atlantis, isn't a text that is 100% accurate in all matters, but the premise laid out in Chapter 8, does seem to point to that fact, the Aryan, Semetic and Asian, (Mongol-Chinese) Languages do have some uniqueness, yet share a common background which points to a common, or better said, commoner background.

I know you are quite adept at the Language side of things, and I am just wondering OUT LOUD, so to speak, to see what you think.

Would this even be plausible?

Donnelly suffers from what one would expect from a long-dead author.

He's completely out of date, using terms that aren't even recognized these days concerning laguiages that were classified together based on incorrect information and dotty reasoning.

However, it's obvious that ALL languages should have some common root, right?

I mean, when Homo whoever started speaking, a mutitude of languages didn't simply appear on that day, right?

Harte

Originally posted by GezinhoKiko
the island of Thira
as you can see there is a volcano right smack bang in the middle, which turned out to be the demise of the civilisation that once graced the island

so yea i hope you find the time to watch as it truly is fascinating and now im convinced that this is/was the Atlantis but not as magical as the Atlantis we here about!

I had been meaning to get back to this topic for a couple of weeks now.

I think I saw part of this documentary on another channel, like Discovery Channel (or THC or Nat Geo or something), rather than BBC. But I didn't see the full show, only part of it.

Thira isn't Atlantis for a number of reasons though. First, wrong timeframe. The sunken island was supposed to occur 9000 years before Plato's time. The Santorini volcano explosion was in the late Bronze Age. So wrong time period.

Second, Thira didn't sink. The myth about Thira is that allegedly the inside of the island sunk which never happened. The center of the island called the Minoan Basin has been there for millions of years and the volcanoes on Kameni islands rose up out of the deep basin. No section of inner island Thira sunk even if the outer banks of Thira sunk.

Third, there are countless sunken islands all over the world. But in order to QUALIFY as the island to which Plato is referring:
#1. It must be ONE island at the Mesolithic to Younger Dryas (9600-8000 B.C.E.) coastlines, which is about minus -90 meters to minus -80 meters below present sea level.
#2. It must be SEVEN islands during Plato's time in Ancient Greece, which would be coastlines at roughly minus -18 meters to -15 meters below present sea level.

The 7 daughter islands of the larger island are the "Atlantides". (google it) That when the island sank, it had seven daughter islands.

Thira just doesn't have any daughter islands. Thira didn't split into the seven Atlantide daughter islands from the larger island sinking.

Although there are sunken islands all over the world, especially all over the Aegean Sea, it must fit the seven daughter island Criteria to be the specific island that Plato is referring to.

Anyhow, I just finished redoing all of Thira's sunken coastline maps from the Last Glacial Maximum to present, with full animations of sea levels (bathymetric and nautical measurments) and zoom-ins of sections of the coast.

If you want to know what Thira - Santorini really looked like at all coastlines from the LGM to present....


Detailed maps of Thira's past sunken coastlines

Originally posted by MapMistress
#2. It must be SEVEN islands during Plato's time in Ancient Greece, which would be coastlines at roughly minus -18 meters to -15 meters below present sea level.

The 7 daughter islands of the larger island are the "Atlantides". (google it) That when the island sank, it had seven daughter islands.

Please quote Plato from Timaeus or Critias (the only ancient sources mentioning Atlantis) concerning the seven islands you claim.

In Plato's time, the Atlantides (AKA the Hesperides) were the stars of the Pleiades. They were so named because they supposedly represent the seven daughters of Atlas.

IIRC, Herodotus also used the term, referring to the peoples who lived in the shadow of Mt. Atlas, in the Atlas mountain range in North Africa.

In both cases, the etymology of the term refers to the "offspring of Atlas." That is the literal translation of "Atlantides."

The "ides" is a patronymic suffix, used exactly the same as "Mac" in Scotland or "son" in English (i.e. MacDonald - Son of Donald, or Stephenson - Son of Stephen.)

Harte

reply to post by MapMistress


many thanks for your reply
and for your blog!
but im still convinced Platos tale is a fable "based" on an event that realy happened and has been hashed, misquoted, retold, added too etc.

heres Platos account for anyone interested

Many great and wonderful deeds are recorded of your state in our histories. But one of them exceeds all the rest in greatness and valour. For these histories tell of a mighty power which unprovoked made an expedition against the whole of Europe and Asia, and to which your city put an end. This power came forth out of the Atlantic Ocean, for in those days the Atlantic was navigable; and there was an island situated in front of the straits which are by you called the Pillars of Heracles; the island was larger than Libya and Asia put together, and was the way to other islands, and from these you might pass to the whole of the opposite continent which surrounded the true ocean; for this sea which is within the Straits of Heracles is only a harbour, having a narrow entrance, but that other is a real sea, and the surrounding land may be most truly called a boundless continent. Now in this island of Atlantis there was a great and wonderful empire which had rule over the whole island and several others, and over parts of the continent, and, furthermore, the men of Atlantis had subjected the parts of Libya within the columns of Heracles as far as Egypt, and of Europe as far as Tyrrhenia. This vast power, gathered into one, endeavoured to subdue at a blow our country and yours and the whole of the region within the straits; and then, Solon, your country shone forth, in the excellence of her virtue and strength, among all mankind. She was pre-eminent in courage and military skill, and was the leader of the Hellenes. And when the rest fell off from her, being compelled to stand alone, after having undergone the very extremity of danger, she defeated and triumphed over the invaders, and preserved from slavery those who were not yet subjugated, and generously liberated all the rest of us who dwell within the pillars. But afterwards there occurred violent earthquakes and floods; and in a single day and night of misfortune all your warlike men in a body sank into the earth, and the island of Atlantis in like manner disappeared in the depths of the sea. For which reason the sea in those parts is impassable and impenetrable, because there is a shoal of mud in the way; and this was caused by the subsidence of the island.

from HERE

He mentions "island" not islands

So with that posted, I wish some to consider this.

Originally posted by GezinhoKiko
heres Platos account for anyone interested

Many great and wonderful deeds are recorded of your state in our histories.................................

situated in front of the straits which are by you called the Pillars of Heracles; the island was larger than Libya and Asia put together, and was the way to other islands,.......................................

the men of Atlantis had subjected the parts of Libya within the columns of Heracles as far as Egypt, and of Europe as far as Tyrrhenia. ....................................................

But afterwards there occurred violent earthquakes and floods; and in a single day and night of misfortune all your warlike men in a body sank into the earth, and the island of Atlantis in like manner disappeared in the depths of the sea.

For which reason the sea in those parts is impassable and impenetrable, because there is a shoal of mud in the way; and this was caused by the subsidence of the island.

from HERE

He mentions "island" not islands

We have the Priest, indicating they harbored Histories of which many where of Solon's State in Specific.

How big is Libya and Asia? All under the sway or control of "Atlantis" and the "rulers" of that day. The lessor gods and goddesses. This is inclusive of Egypt, which is for unclear reasons, claimed by THE GOD, (aka the lessor gods FATHER) as being his People ( Isaiah 19:25 ). Since there is some contention amoungst Egyptologists as to who built the Great Pyramid, but I Digress.


They held the whole Med Basin, (Pre Flood Med). That's the Area where Asia comes back into view. A Pre Flood Med Basin.

Just a few things to remember.

Now here's MY Point.

WHO INDICATES ATLANTIS SANK?

I my humble opinion, we are discussing a clear removal, since sinking isn't going to be my first guess, based on several matters.

A: Who ruled Atlantis? There was Ten Kingdoms. Those that left there home, to come to Earth and take the Daughters of Mankind, became those 10 Kings.

B: What number of witnesses SAW this event occur? I have been led to believe that was none.

C: What is being "left behind"?

For which reason the sea in those parts is impassable and impenetrable, because there is a shoal of mud in the way; and this was caused by the subsidence of the island.

All of the wonders of Atlantis, The Buildings, the Mountians and on and on......... Just turning into what? " Mud"

Based on assumptions alone, the common belief is that Atlantis Sank. I suggest it never did. I suggest the evidence does show the residence of the Beings which had no right to be here was removed from Earth. Taking it away, would leave a more realistic application of the narrative offered to Solon. The Description would be much as expressed. All that would remain would be an impassable mud bog, so to speak.

Just throwing that out there for consideration. It just an assumption alone, that indicates how something (Atlantis) that nobody saw/witnessed disappearing, would sink. I find it much more practical that it was returned to it's natural home. With GOD.

Ciao

Shane

I really think the main site that Atlantis is base upon is the one recently identified on the Atlantic coast of Spain near Cadiz. The evidence of that is pretty interesting and compelling.

I do also think that other events, such as Santorini's explosion and the destruction it caused to Minoan civilization could well have been rolled into the story of Atlantis. Coastal cities being destroyed by inundation of waters (tsunamis and such) happens time and time again. It just happened a year ago in Japan and about a decade ago in the Indian Ocean. Any such events, being passed down in legend from times of pre-history or early history when such records weren't as rigorous or easily lost, could easily have been mashed together in the public consciousness and become one story.