Seeking knowledge and understanding for a CSE antigravity project!

So I was looking over some threads and was learning about ORMUS and how to make traps and all that goodness when i came across some information at www.subtleenergies.com... or more specifically, www.subtleenergies.com... on a principal called the Cavity Structure Effect (CSE). It mentions the work of a one Viktor S. Grebennikov, an entomologist who in short discovered that bee hives produce standing waves due simply to the structure of the combs or in the original case tunnels. At the time he realized these waves helped the bees find their hme and that flowers also produce a similar effect and proved that any person could find a flower in the dark without any special powers. His initial understanding led him to believe that this effect was simply a beacon that helped the bees navigate and avoid tunneling into existing hive structures.

He later discovered a more true nature of the effect when studying the carapace of a certain beetle that seemed to have gravity repelling effects. The first link below explains all this in much more detail but among other things his research produced a flying machine which is unknown to general science. This device used his CSE to create an anode around himself and the device producing the ability to lift off the ground and travel at great speeds and heights.

Although he lived to be 74 he experienced many health issues related to overexposure to magnetic fields but it is theorized that a more powerful device than the one he first built could potentially carry the pilot outside of the anodes and thus eliminate the negative effect.

I have spent several days looking into this matter and I can just about get my mind around the concepts and the formulas, although not quite well enough to reproduce the experiment or to build such a vehicle by my own design. I am hoping that ATS readers may be able to lend me some assistance and insight having read the below articles, or simply fom a previous knowledge of physics. I would be more than happy to involve anyone in this project as I seek no monetary gain from it, I believe as he did that CSE is an invention of nature and thus no credit or royalties are due to us who have stumbled across this principal.

Very interested to hear back from anyone so feel free to share any information and I'll be sure to do likewise!

A summary of the work
www.scribd.com...

A breakdown of the flying device
www.scribd.com...

While I've heard of this I think it's more of an urban legend than a real technology. After all bees and beetles still have wings for a reason if they had antigravity insides don't you think they'd stop evolving wings?

Originally posted by roguetechie
While I've heard of this I think it's more of an urban legend than a real technology. After all bees and beetles still have wings for a reason if they had antigravity insides don't you think they'd stop evolving wings?

That was part of what led to the discovery actually, he was trying to figure out how these bugs got off the ground because their physical structure alone wouldnt produce enough lift or so it seemed. What I read suggested that the motion of thw wings actually enhanced the effect, thus his device had moving parts that worked in a similar fasion.

reply to post by BaronAlbatross


Here is my thing when it comes to anything involving the words "Antigravity" "Perpetual" "Free", etc: I do not discourage someone from experimenting... but I do caution them to do so wisely and with critical thinking applied to their endeavors.

There are many people out there who will feed you an entire library of bull#. Why? It's anyone's guess - perhaps they just like to feel like they are doing a service... perhaps they don't really understand the consequences of their story telling hobby... whatever - but people will tell you all kinds of crazy stuff even if there is nothing "in it" for them. That goes for anything - but the 'dream topics' tend to attract people who like to over-use their creative licenses.

Further - be very careful on how you spend money on any project. I'll be blunt - I highly doubt you're going to be able to create antigravity or some other physics-shattering discovery with bailing twine and ply-wood. At the same time - don't be led into buying all kinds of voodoo supplies to try and get a project to work. Have a clear understanding of how anything you buy is to fit into your project, and ensure it is of the caliber necessary to test your theories (so you aren't left going: "If only I'd bought the better equipment... I would know my results aren't due to noise in the line").

And, finally - you're essentially trying to be a pioneer, here. Take everyone's word with a grain of salt when they come to offer you advice and 'expertise' on the subject of antigravity (in this case). If they are telling you how to build it... where is theirs?

On that point - it also means you have your work cut out for you. You're in uncharted waters - so you have to exercise good penmanship and book-keeping (or be prepared to turn a tinker project into something that can stand up to peer review and is documented well enough that someone could attempt to replicate your experiments/results). You're also going to have to do a lot of thought and planning on your own.

If this was well understood science and phenomena - then we'd have antigravity already. Keep that in mind.

As far as this particular phenomena... no - I know very little/nothing of it. From what I've read in this little bit - I'm highly skeptical of the claims... but it would be a bigger problem for me to be accepting it as truth for no reason other than it is there.

reply to post by roguetechie


Bees have actually been an object of avid research, considering that their wings are actually too small to be able to sustain the flight of such large bodies. It is said that the movement of the wings creates a cushion of air beneath the bee, allowing it to stay aloft while its wings propel it through the air.

Fascinating stuff.

reply to post by BaronAlbatross

Don't want to sound discouraging but it reads like complete fiction.

Grebennikov built his gravity plane and started flying by a noiseless aircraft, which reached a speed of 1,500-2,400 km/hour. The aircraft was inertia-less and almost invisible from below.People, who observed it from ground, saw,instead of it, a light sphere or a disc or a cloud with sharply outlined edges.

Invisible antgravity machines... Beam me up, Scotty.

I appreciate all your concern but until i am able to test this myself I dont think its very scientific to assume it will or will not work, heck if this leads to any discovery I will be more than satisfied. I admit that I myself am skeptical of the wilder claims, perhaps the levitational effect is a farce, but until such a time as I am able to test this through due scientific process such opinions including my own are irrelevant.

With all due respect I created this thread to seek assistance in testing this theory regardless of the results. I would be happy to inform the forum that it is all true but it would also be equally important to report total failure. This is more than the usual information gathering and assessment that we usually do here on the forum, this is hard science.

I can already prove, although not quantifiably without further study, that CSE is a very real property of physics. I have carried out tentative tests with flowers and books and yes they are completely detectable in utter darkness without any meditative conditioning or extra sensory perception, suggesting that these are waves that can be detected by the nervous system.

So to bring this study to a realistic basis you all might me more inclined to be helpful over, my studies must continue in testing the formulas I found for accuracy and then seeking an application for this principal.

Also to note this is a widely unexplored subject so although it is the knee-jerk reaction to assume that such things as invisible flight etc are unobtainable, nor you or I know that for a fact.

This might help, more recent study on the subject of CSE, not flight but the principal itself. This is about where I want to get started, where these people have left off. If I can quantify and verify their research then I can move foreword immediately.

villesresearch.com...

reply to post by BaronAlbatross

Experiments with humans are difficult due to placebo effect, observer and experimenter's bias. There are a lot of things that can go wrong. Do you have an experiment protocol? Is it possible to set up a single-blind or even a double-blind experiment? How large is your test group?

Ideally one would try to remove the human factor, look for measurable effects. But this won't be possible in this case I guess.

reply to post by moebius


Well due to the lack of support in any network i may suspend this study, not that people arent interested but so little is known that its hard to muster ambition from others in this research... I am currently going to be delving into the more widely studied field of ORMUS research, with hopes of clearing away the fluff and developing hard facts since most information on the subject is so subjective and filled with radical and some ridiculous claims I think this as well bears more information producing study.

CSE however can be quantified by measuring the magnetic fields but to do so I would need to have an understanding of magnetism and other physics that I do not currently possess and as I said earlier I am seeing a difficulty in rallying people with such knowledge to assist me.

Measuring the fields would be extremely difficult because according to the theory all cavity structures including houses, caves, rocks with wear on them etc produce this effect in some way and it would therefore be impossible to measure a "background" or control level of standing waves with my current understanding.

I certainly do not wish to abandon this altogether but it seems that it simply is not the right time in my life to do this research. Science calls to me from every direction so I must be discerning in my ability to answer.

If I had the support of even one person with significant knowledge on the subject of measuring standing waves I could at least verify or disprove the formulas but until such a day I will not be able to carry out any significant studies, at least none that could be quantified and truly scientific. I may post a thread seeking help for my ORMUS research but i have already made contact with a strong network so I will most likely just publish my findings here.

If anyone is interested in ORMUS/ORMEs I recommend visiting www.subtleenergies.com... to get started

Thank you to everyone who showed interest and gave advice in this thread, i will most likely be closing it within the week unless drastic developments occur.

Again thank you all and may you have better luck in your own studies!