The advantage of promoting private space industry.

I'll be the first guy to admit. I had a damn crying fit when Obama cancelled the Orion moon mission project to put us back on the moon by 2018. We must get back and now that we know the moon has water in polar craters!? No better reason is to go first with automated facilities to set up shop and have the astronauts land and turn on the lights. They can use the water for drinking air and fuel. Thats a huge bonus.

But before that happens we have to get back into space and not counting the separate American access to space which has existed since establishment of the NRO. Logical, we need to launch satellites and who knows what else, I have feeling we do and can launch much more. Vandenberg for "conventional looking"rockets who knows if the payloads are manned or not...

But Obama gave one hell of a boost to that group, private companies that are proving to move much faster in getting the Orion (Apollo capsule on steroids, and much much safer) spacecraft built and many private companies now building very good and advanced rockets. Very good Mr President,

I didn't agree with your reasons for canceling Orion at first, that we had already been there. Please give me a break, but did agree with your promoting American private launch capability in all areas. I'm no longer crying...

I wouldn't get all carried away with that announcement of water 'at particular areas' on the moon. Maybe I'll look up the reference later but that water has to be processed out of the surface its found, at an estimate rate of no more than one liter of water per ton of rock, or as little as 10 parts per million. The easy method (easy here on earth) is like basically microwaving the dirt/rock, and assembling a collection apparatus.

Here's the microwave guy.

At the very mention of water on the moon I knew the type of folks that would flock to the finding to confirm NASA lies, scientists don't know, Einstein was wrong, its an electric Universe, and so on. In fact it is probably impossible for there NOT to be water anywhere in the Universe. After all Hydrogen is by far the most abundant element in the Universe, and Oxygen is third most abundant. Both atoms like to bond almost as readily as carbon does. The issue is how sparse is the water, and how usable is it. Its out there, but its a long way to go for a glass of water.

Desalination plants struggle to get a gallon of water for under 3 bucks, and they are starting from water!

reply to post by Illustronic


The fact that its there is something that makes "processing" just a matter of hardware. Thats easy to send to the moon and getting smaller every day... But sending H2O? THATS EXPENSIVE!! Today it costs about $18,000.00 a pond to send anything into space and this is something machines can turn into so much more.

If they have water they can make air drinking water and rocket fuel and perhaps materials (I'm working on that). And it would seem the evidence is no we don't have oceans or even, (chuckle "even") the great lakes supply of fresh water but its there. Lets go get it.

reply to post by Illustronic


PS, I love your Avatar. Good luck...

I think we need private space industry but I would like to see something like a Star Fleet Academy.

A place where all the brightest minds in the world can go and we can all be united when it comes to space exploration.

reply to post by neoholographic


That would be great but good luck for now. In what country would it be located? Nationalism once again rears its ugly head. Ideally I would love to build a large off world colony along the lines of an L-5 type facility. At least a mile in diameter and one to three miles long. THAT would allow normal Earth gravity, a totally controlled even segmented environment (You want the tropics or rocky mountains like Aspen for skiing? No problem!) and no corriolus effect in the inner ear at all. You spin a spacecraft thats to small it creates sea sickness, make it big enough it won't happen. Ever been sea sick? I have. Only time I wish someone would please shoot me.

In addition I would make that colony an independent city-state. Love that idea of " hey, were very open to share and manufacture stuff you cant possibly do because we have access to zero-G and a very good vacuum". But as far as the countries of Earth are concerned? Lets begin we have no enemies. Lets keep it that way and keep your hands off. Play nice, please? It will pay you vast sums of money... Hows that for an incentive?

reply to post by arbiture


I have to mention the inevitable, something the Jews found out the hard way. without the power be-knighted to you by having a government and a military, your screwed. Any independent city state or nation state and I'm talking in this case about a large (by todays standards) colony in space, must have all the necessary trappings of a nation state in the early to mid 21st century at least. Sorry. but I didn't invent human nature. I was just born as one of us. Regarding " Nation States" I think the exception is the Vatican located with in the confines of Italy, and take them on you take on NATO. A very bad idea. Wow, what a deal...

Is that all a lot of extraneous crap, oh yeah I think so but necessary crap none the less at least for now. That requires all the bull s*** required for a " real" country, on Earth or wherever humans go. A diplomatic service, customs (important really to prevent some nightmare from getting into your closed environment). Don't believe me? Ask Australia.

And sorry to say a military. But perhaps we could do it a little differently. It would in effect be our " Coast Guard" and be more concerned with safety and systems and colony integrity and repair the same then making war. But like the US Coast Guard they might not look to scary but trust me, piss them off and you'll get one hell of a bloody nose. Our capacity to "be violent" should be clearly defined as defensive. And besides we want to make money and contrary to popular opinion war is not a long term money maker. Ever. It just drains treasuries, kills and maims and in effect creates actualized hell, so screw that. But any society off Earth started by humans must be able to protect itself, in case the lunatics win.

Oh, and by the way regarding the establishment of a " Star Fleet"? The colony would have its own " Coast Guard" but I would welcome all nations on Earth to set up shop with us. The only allegiance would be to the human race. Not us the colony, or any nation of Earth. We would acknowledge your history and heritage, fine. But the greater heritage is human. Focus on that, your in. If you can pass the entry exams which are going to be a bitch.

reply to post by arbiture


Part of the whole " Star Fleet" concept is that its "human centric" not nationalistic. The interesting truth is that real power world wide no longer just exists with nation states. They are becoming a dying breed. The true nature of the world is no longer dictated by geographical boundaries. But by special interests and what I have called " The Chimera" The corporate super interests that rule the world.

At an earlier time people were identified strictly by where they lived. A little later people were defined by who they didn't actually, necessarily live with but who they associated with. That was a possible beginning of prejudice. Among many other possibilities. What ever...

The interesting aspect of the " Star Fleet" is the use of "aliens" as the so-called other. The truth I honestly believe are any aliens are going to be so radically different from us, that a true alien-human interpreted Star Fleet Is not likely, at least for a long time. but a human integrated Star Fleet that is not nationalistic is possible. And rational.

And when we do meet the aliens as a united species we can say " we come in peace" " and by the way we would love to know how you do that really cool technological s*** that you do, so if I can be blunt at least can we talk?

Nice to see the first great steps for all mankind (to get to space with less the a several billion dollar invest ) are now history. Fandamtastic baby, I want more!