A Serious Solution To All Of Our Problems

I'd say it's not impossible.

I've thought about it before and as far as the people want luxuries stance, it would be kinda close to what we have now. What you put in is what you get. You want the nice cars, gadgets and houses, you work more hours OR get more skilled (schooling, trade and or educational) and get a better job with hours worth more.. Kinda a currency but not. The harder the job the higher worth the hour.

Go to school if you want to, or don't it's up to you, but if you want to better yourself, earn more, and better society you'll get educated for a better job.

With tech. where it is now we could all have debit cards with our hours on them. Maybe only use the debit cards for luxuries (vacations, cars, tv's, computers, etc..) .

Barter goods between countries, that way it's like back in the day when it was cool to have something made in another country. (quality goods) Things like we used to make that lasted.

Our food would be better, more localized, corporations out of the picture. Mass production no more, we eat whats in season, in your area first, trade for things that aren't.

It would eliminate a lot of space taking jobs too. Working toward a new goal, less work and more living and spending time with family and friends. Evolve, no pollution, we give as much as we take, no waste. We're all comfortable. There's got to be a way, just gotta break some paradigms.

I also think a currency CAN work but we need a system and operators with integrity.

It's quite possible because money has literally no value other than what they tell us it is valued at.

If we did not have money we might still be using gold but they made money to get the majority of the gold. Gold was being used as currency and now it is being all locked away.

look up zeitgeist... there are two. i'm not sure if i follow it all but i am talking about the one that says we need to start learning how to trade on a local level again and forget money even exists. whichever zeitgeist that is, i found very interesting... i think the other zeitgeist is totally and completely different so don't let me get them confused. i'm not sure if i watched it all because I got the gist of it... but if you are new to this concept, dive in- it might give you some ideas.

It is QUITE possible as we grow the food, cook the food, package the food, sell the food... not to mention everything else. We do the work, we run the world... they just benefit from it by, like you said, the pyramid some greedy a-holes built long long time ago.

Start at the individual level...spread the word.

i am doing the same. i am trying to make others understand and they often just don't seem to get it.

look at the economy, look at what is happening in the world. Because of this I am already trying to do this on an individual level... to see how much of a need for money I can eliminate. It's not easy but you'd be surprised. I am living very frugally yet still have all sorts of things i always had... such as a computer obviously. I know that if i had to get rid of it i could certainly live without it but while we are still in the grip of money and the elites, I feel i should stay connected and talk to people...tell others of this and many other things happening to me.

Even though we see things falling apart right before our eyes, some still think that they will just patch it up and everything will be ok and continue to be a part of a corrupt system... and money itself is a corrupt system...and it runs yet another corrupt system... and maybe they simply couldn't survive without it. China has already stated we should have a new currency... so you see, things are getting very interesting... yet people will place all their bets on their bank accounts that might not even be there in a week. things should stay calm and they will just keep patching until things get so tense with them... the shooting starts because I believe we are on the brink of massive war and I'm not even sure where it's going to start because there are multiple places it COULD start... It's bad when you wonder when they'll start war with a specific country, but it's really bad when you wake up knowing they may likely start massive war but have multiple places for a world war to start at. they are already warring... when the larger conflicts start, things will get bad and services might go down and banks might close and then people will be wishing they forced themselves into trying to live without money.

just start with yourself as best as you can... spread the word.

If we take the system down to bare bones...yes. it will buckle and this puts more pressure on THEM to get over their greed. I do believe it might get so bad that they will try to get militaries to attack civilians... but if the earth holds together despite all the end times claims and doesn't go into liquifaction.. it WILL fizzle out.

BELIEVE that... because that belief is what is going to make it happen.

there are so many people way ahead of you.

welcome to the club.

I think the root problem is education, not money. People should get taught how to become an authority on their own minds instead of learning to accept external authorities such as teachers, bosses, presidents, psychiatrists and popes. The more authority one has over their own brain the more they are able to exert control over it, this would help in many ways such as being able to resist the many temptations in life which may have negative consequences, or to be able to learn a particular subject without being distracted by the things these authorities say is important. The key to a healthy society is selfconfidence, the kind not based on results from the educational system because it's quite screwed up.

Such as "I can never get an A and pass this test, it's because of my DNA, no one in my family ever amounted to something in education". A child might not be able to fully understand something like this but will get the impressions and feelings nonetheless. Everyone should be brave and defiant and make themselves believe any scientist who claims it is truth DNA determines intelligence are full of BS and how it's all part of a system meant to keep those at the top at the top and those at the bottom at the bottom just by the power of make believe and self fullfilling prophecies, but that is usually discovered later in life, if at all.

If the educational system would change, so would society and for those in power that's not a desireable future, suddenly their main source of power to convince others they are right isn't viable any more. There are already signs of a coming change, I for one hope my grandchildren will have an AI as a teacher and don't have to go to a school where they have to deal with all the children from families who conform to the many negative truths (and seek others to do the same). While it's inevitable they have to deal with negative people, at least I hope they get a fighting chance instead of never knowing how things could be different having lost while trying to learn how to fight and never becoming good (enough) at it.

I agree. However in order to have such a society we would have to reengineer modern man. A utopia like state would require total control and total compliance. There was a time however in mans history where culture had not been such a henderance. Terrance Mckenna a philosopher and teacher of human consciousness argues that evolving species of man took ego diminshing supstances that created what most of us would call the "golden age" of man. Where these groups of people would take these substances and lose a sense of self. with a loss of self the individuals became a part of the group. Children no longer became "my children" they were just the groups offspring. most of which was because with taking these substances they had wild orgys and there was no way to distiguish who had "ownership".

Its a dumb plan not just because it would require realistically the changing of human nature to work perfectly or that to even attempt it would require one of the most totalitarian states in human history to get people to do whatever jobs.

Its a failure because it doesn't have a good mechanism for dealing with fact that are limited resources and time of people other then some central planning agency which doesn't have the benefit of the Soviet style to figure out how much something cost because you got rid of a one of the most useful ideas humanity created an way to determine value of something. Though realistically your system would generate a black market which had something to be used to get around the insanity.

The only way your system would work if you had something like star trek replicators or something else post scarcity in terms of technology in which money would be moot you just magically zap yourself up a new house.

reply to post by Bone75


Please note OP that I understand just what you are saying, when our life, our sweat, our blood, our tears, our skills, etc become the currency, then one will always be rich.

Some people are too wired into the mentality that a piece of paper is the final ruling on any transfer of value. In fact its truly the opposite, the fact we are alive allows this paper to become something of value, as it is printed against our future taxed income aka gov revenue.

When we stop working for money and begin working for free, are we not still working to an outcome, who cares if you pulled those weeds for $20 or a place to sleep that night. See the point people. Do away with our lives having a numerical value and understand that things like people being smarter or better is reason they can do more for mankind as opposed to TPTB.

Think people. What the OP is saying is that the hard work's pay off just funnels up to a few instead of staying to the masses.

I totally agree with you aout the money. For years I've been talking about the Federal Reserve and money. It's a big scam! Even on this website, people refuse to realize the truth for what it is. MONEY is at the root of every terrible thing that happens in this world. Someone always wants more and will steal and kill to get it. If that was not the case, how come whenever you want to strangle a country you START with economic sanctions? Because they know that once the money is cut off, all hell will break loose and people get desperate and angry. With all the talk of bankers abandoning ship, I wouldn't be surprised if they suddenly come down off the hill and tell us that the money we have in our accounts is worthless. Or worth less than what it was...

Think about it which costs less?

Commute to work and pay for living expenses in the mean time between pay. Pay as you live.

Grow food, build structures, raise family, learn, etc.

I just have the biggest issue with those who just can't fathom a life that we we're just living 100-200 years ago, I mean damn, for real...?

Just live

reply to post by DivineFem


They have pretty much already told us this in not so many words.

The money in your pocket will be worthless once the world stops using it for oil trade.

Originally posted by sykonot
reply to post by DivineFem

 

They have pretty much already told us this in not so many words.

The money in your pocket will be worthless once the world stops using it for oil trade.

No it won't, it might be devalued but there will still be a value to dollar, there enough of a foundation and tangible assets and worth in the country that would see to that.

Originally posted by BlackSatinDancer

i am doing the same. i am trying to make others understand and they often just don't seem to get it.

With the exception of a handful of people, most of the folks I pitch this idea to think its the stupidest thing they've ever heard lol. Fortunately my niece is a very popular high school student that actually "gets it", and her enthusiasm is starting to spread.

Even though we see things falling apart right before our eyes, some still think that they will just patch it up and everything will be ok and continue to be a part of a corrupt system... and money itself is a corrupt system...and it runs yet another corrupt system... and maybe they simply couldn't survive without it.

Exactly! Everyone is pushing for temporary relief for permanent problems, when the ultimate solution has been staring us in the face the whole time.

Originally posted by Bone75

Originally posted by BlackSatinDancer

i am doing the same. i am trying to make others understand and they often just don't seem to get it.

With the exception of a handful of people, most of the folks I pitch this idea to think its the stupidest thing they've ever heard lol. Fortunately my niece is a very popular high school student that actually "gets it", and her enthusiasm is starting to spread.

Even though we see things falling apart right before our eyes, some still think that they will just patch it up and everything will be ok and continue to be a part of a corrupt system... and money itself is a corrupt system...and it runs yet another corrupt system... and maybe they simply couldn't survive without it.

Exactly! Everyone is pushing for temporary relief for permanent problems, when the ultimate solution has been staring us in the face the whole time.

Isn't it very surprising that people don't see that money is just a note with no value and only meant to replace gold currency so that it would not be circulating and they could get the majority of it.

no matter what happens to the dollar, or the euro, or the freaking peso for that matter... gold will always have value... and now, they have the vast majority of it all.

even if we still used gold as currency, they would just taint it worse and worse with other metals over time. these things could still be extracted if necessary.

People do not understand that what truly has value, what is truly necessary for living... God provided all around them. Money and control of it brings NOTHING new to this world. it's not like they created a new element. it's not like they made money and now all the plants grow much faster. we are still living in the same natural world we started with... just managing it badly, still.

Why do people think they need the middle men?
Why do people think they need the inefficient, unwarranted processes of pushing pencils and paper writing notes that mean nothing and have no value in itself. It is morality that should be taught and concentrated on.. not company policy. In a world of more morality and better raised children by parents who are PRESENT in their lives and not at the office doing a whole bunch of nothing... we would not be seeing a lot of the problems we see today, yet people think it is still the lack of money in their lives that creates the problem. The dollar is the new golden calf. People who claim to be christian, or ANY religion for that matter... actually worship the dollar more than anything in a lot of cases. The beast is already present in our lives. Think about it (i know you already have) When is the last time you walked into a store hungry and with a nugget of gold... or ANYTHING of value that you might have and said "I will trade you this for that food over there"...and hell, for good measure let's say the cashier is like "wow!... I NEED that. I could go for that deal... but you know, my boss won' let me" So you go talk to the boss and even the boss agrees, not a bad deal but he has to balance the drawer, he has to file his taxes, he has to put a price tag on anything and that is what you are expected to hand him... the so called payment for the purchase.

the BEAST is already here... and it is controlling just about everyone of us.

in so many ways they exact this control and will not allow change to the system.

people are afraid that the next turn of events is going to be microchips in the hands. ITS ALREADY HERE IN MANY WAYS OF CONTROL.

what can you buy without money?

Go to a store and try to buy something without money.

YOU CAN'T!

Coincidence? I don't THINK SO!

Originally posted by DestroyDestroyDestroy
We can't kill the money and expect the same luxuries that we have today.

First of all, money as it exists today, brings no luxuries or even benefits to anyone except the bankers and the rest of the 'elite'.

Second of all, we can always use some other kind of 'money', which is in limited supply, so there can never be inflation. That would really boost things up, as experiments have shown (can't remember the name of the place, or exact details how they did it, but a village somewhere in Europe tried something like this, and it really made everything plentiful).

Third of all, there ARE no luxuries! Look around! What do you see that are actual luxuries? Bare necessities is all I see, and even they are of very poor quality, compared to what they could be if those evil people didn't run the world and if people didn't let them.

Money is not the ROOT problem, it's just the TOOL and METHOD for the problem to exist and worsen every day.

Look at where most people of this planet live - there are millions upon millions of people living in a really awful place, with cockroaches, constant hunger, disease, pollution, overpopulation.. you call that luxury?

Besides, why even use the word "kill", when "money" is clearly not a living entity. Are you antropomorphizing, or are you proud to be a corporation? (Research the 'meet your strawman' thing to know what I mean)

We don't really need money, but we can't really abandon all forms of exchange suddenly - in my opinion, with actual humans, and the evil psychopaths out of the way, we could gradually change the whole system from this into a real Utopia, where no money is ever needed by anyone, ever again. It's possible.. can you imagine such a world? I can, easily. It feels way more natural than everything being tied to coins and bureaucracy.

Money, ID's, bureaucracy - that's not a human system, that's not a life for creative, thinking, spiritually evolving humans. That's an existence and system for robots, machines and other things that are supposed to HELP humanity, not enslave it.

Your sentiment is short-sighted as it is false. Do you really think people 'enjoy luxuries'?

Do you really think this planet couldn't offer us PLENTIFUL life in all possible ways, if the "producing poverty" system and "creating misery" system were abandoned for something much better?

I dare say we would have -way- more ACTUAL LUXURIES, if there was no money. But we wouldn't even need "luxuries" - it's enough that we have "all we need", that everyone has food, shelter, all the equipment they need to fulfill their needs and even some ambitions and desires. Why would anyone really even need luxuries?

The only people who HAVE luxuries are the bankers, the elite, the 'rich' .. the ones with the agenda. Are you really that desperate to become one of them that you refuse to let go of your shackles? Money is a tool for enslavement, although it COULD be something more neutral in a proper world. But in my opinion, it's not needed. At least not the way everything is tied to it artificially. Things could be done without everything always being measured in coins, for heaven's sakes!

Besides, as a Zen-master once said: "Poverty is your greatest treasure. Never exchange it for an easy life."

Meaning that those who HAVE 'luxuries', are not necessarily very happy, and their life might be very unsatisfactory. I am not saying we should keep everyone forcefully poor, I am saying that everyone should have all the basic necessities, and if they then want 'luxuries', they could earn it separately. Or something. Luxuries are not a road to happiness anyway.

In any case, wake up and smell the Utopia, that's right on our fingertips, if we simply have the will and comprehension to manifest it.

While your OP is a rough outline, I completely agree. The flamers expect the OP to provide a flawless form of currency and type up an entire way of living into a few short paragraphs on ATS. Well that isn't gonna happen.

What he's saying though, is completely true; monetary reform is the only "peaceful" way to take back our planet. I use quotations around peaceful because with the killing power of our military as well as private security, people won't stand a chance. I pray that our military's would have the intelligence to realize that their citizens, their families, are not the enemy - but private security is a completely different and much more serious threat to human development.

There is no reason for our governments to be borrowing money created out of nothing and having to pay it back at interest. Interest that was not created with the money that was borrowed.

The time window for change is open now. But when it is closed, I doubt it will ever be opened again, simply because of the incredible (possibly unworldly) increased development of technology, surveillance equipment, as well as civilian crowd control and killing tools.