NEWS: Russia Warns West Against Meddling in Chechnya

Russia's Foriegn Minister, Sergei Lavrov, has warned the West to stay out of Russia's war of terror. The West has offered asylum to terrorists linked directly to the tragedy. Russia views this as direct meddling in their internal affairs.



Since Bush has declared war on all terrorists, why would they be offering asylum to some? Makes me wonder!
Isn't a terrorist against Russia still a terrorist? This isn't heading to a very good place.

Something is going to blow. Hope WWIII isn't around the bend.

[edit on 9-9-2004 by Valhall]

Oh dear, this is not good news.

WWIII is on the way, wahhoooo!!!!

Something did not settle right yesterday when Russia made the announcement regarding the attack on terrorists around the world. The first thing I thought oddly enough was okay - WWIII - not in a panicky way, but just an instant thought you know?

I am definately feeling uneasy so to speak about this whole thing.


Actually was it yesterday when Russia made that announcement or a couple of days ago? Geesh. Anyway...

[edit on 9-9-2004 by Godsent]

Nothing is going to happen...

We live in an alarmist society this millenium, so to try and not play into that ..

Stay calm, cool, and collected...

Russia is just telling the administration to butt out. Thats it. If the administration doesn't want to listen well then I think diplomacy might be hurt abit but no www3 is going to happen. www3 hasn't been declared... When there are many countries grouped together over a cause to fight for, then ww3 will happen.

Terrorism is nothing but a catch phrase, they've overplayed it, and now for us people, we overuse the term when little # hits the fan.

When Europe invaded America in the war of 1812, by today's definition, they could of used the word terrorist.

A warning doesn't mean war, a warning could mean war, but I doubt it, even if it was to happen I wouldn't be worried, I wouldn't care...


Too much crap has been going on and frankly i'm sick of it, if a war was to break out it would be a big one, many countries are frustrated, ect, I think it would be more of a relief then anything...

Get it over and done with..

This is typical. It's one of the things that has so endeared us to the rest of the world. The US has had this twisted policy for years of backing anyone who can get in the face of our larger 'enemies'. I mean, look at some of the people we've backed/bankrolled. And it has always come back to bite us on the ass. Apparently we just don't learn. And we certainly don't evolve our position as world events change. How would we like it if Canada decided to offer asylum to OBL?

Originally posted by TrueLies


A warning doesn't mean war, a warning could mean war, but I doubt it, even if it was to happen I wouldn't be worried, I wouldn't care...


Too much crap has been going on and frankly i'm sick of it, if a war was to break out it would be a big one, many countries are frustrated, ect, I think it would be more of a relief then anything...

Get it over and done with..

It's not the warning that is unsettling - it's everything; it's the US envolvement with the terrorist group; it's the US fighting against terrorism, but yet; etc. etc. Plus it was the way the statement was put and also that it was backed by the UN; that is what is a little unsettling. You see, you really have to pay attention with the way things are stated and accepted because that is what determines in the short term and long term how things could be played out. Most people are not in a panic or assuming we are going to see WWIII, they are concerned because something isn't quite right with everything that is going on, with the way things are being stated in public, etc. Hopefully this makes sense If not, it's because I am trying to do too many things at once and I apologize. Yes, surprise, surprise my life has not stopped because of my concerns.

I am tired of all the crap too, but I don't agree with you about a war being a relief. The fact is there is a lot going on at the same time in different countries and with the US and what constitutes a WW is when there are several countries in war at the same time - am I right? We have always had unrest in the Mid-East and the US always has to have a hand or say so in everything, but we also have other countries that are not "at rest" so to speak.

> warned the West not to meddle with Russia's Chechnya policy

The chechnyans are 'terrorists' out of desperation. I guess most europeans have seen the documentaries smuggled out of Chechnya. What happens there is this;

1. russian soldiers are sent in.
2. russian gov. does not pay the soldiers.
3. russian soldiers must steal to get what they need (and as all rough soldiers they rape and kill (mostly men) at random).
4. the unarmed chechnyan population can do nothing, but as more and more friends and family members are affected they have no choise to fight back any way they can.
5. repeat 3 and 4 for years now.

Is it odd that they now go into Russia on suiside missions? (the last one at that school had many nationalities and not only chechnyans)

All the while Putin rules Russia media with an iron fist. What russians are shown is propaganda films exactly like WWII films of happy soldiers crusin' around in Chechnya meeting happy chechnyans... Its sic.
Its sad that Russia is going into yet a dark time. It had a chance for democracy years ago, but Putin do not want that. He is the worst that have happened since their 'october revolution'!

Sad fact;
6. Bush (and rest of US?) belive in Putin and his propaganda.
7. Europe hates terrorists. So we hate the bandit russian soldiers in Chechnya.
8. Bush need Putins so-called 'war on terror'.
9. wich leads to europeans thinking 'Bush is chicken and would rather the chechnyans die than trying to defend their right to choose their own future' for political gain with Putin.

Does anyone find it odd that so many europeans have flocked to protest actions against Bush the last years?
Despite the old saying, I do not belive people are stupid... in all things.

Originally posted by Ghaele

Is it odd that they now go into Russia on suiside missions? (the last one at that school had many nationalities and not only chechnyans)

Yes it is odd that they decided that killing small children of various nationalities was the right way of settling this.

What russians are shown is propaganda films exactly like WWII films of happy soldiers crusin' around in Chechnya meeting happy chechnyans... Its sic.

What propaganda films? Russians do know that Checnya is hell. If you know of a film about happy soldiers having beers with happy Chechens please send a link, otherwise you are making a fool of yourself.

He is the worst that have happened since their 'october revolution'!

No, the US-backed Eltsin was the absolute worst.

Yes it is odd that they decided that killing small children of various nationalities was the right way of settling this.

I were talking about the terrorists

What propaganda films? Russians do know that Checnya is hell. If you know of a film about happy soldiers having beers with happy Chechens please send a link, otherwise you are making a fool of yourself.

The films the russian population see is only what Putin let them see. There's no free TV stations (there are still some free newspapers, but for how long?). As to making a link to russian tv, try it yourself. Some time soon you'll discover its not on the net. We're talking about TV here not web-related stuff.

Originally posted by Ghaele

What propaganda films? Russians do know that Checnya is hell. If you know of a film about happy soldiers having beers with happy Chechens please send a link, otherwise you are making a fool of yourself.

The films the russian population see is only what Putin let them see. There's no free TV stations (there are still some free newspapers, but for how long?). As to making a link to russian tv, try it yourself. Some time soon you'll discover its not on the net. We're talking about TV here not web-related stuff.

I agree the media has become increasingly govt-controlled. However your innuendo of WWII-style movies depicting happy Russian soldiers fraternizing with even happier Chechen farmers is quite incorrect and you should take it back.

I do watch Russian TV on the web and every time I visit Moscow.

In the light of what happened in Russia last week and the worldwide revulsion it rightly caused it may be a little expedient of the west to back off and play down any involvement in the Chechen cause any way. I believe they'll have one eye on public opinion before they make any decisions about backing such causes.

The term terrorist is so subjective...Some people seem to believe there are rules to kiling other humans...

Chechens are fighting for independence... I wonder if people would have felt better if the chechen resistance had drop a bomb on that school from a fighter jet killing hundreds as oppose to hostage taking then killing...

go figure

[edit on 10-9-2004 by israelcd]

The one thing I'm worried about is if the terroists get there hands on a nuclear bomb, that could trigger WWIII. I once heard on the news that some big time drug dealers bought or tried to buy a nuclear submarine for 1 million dollars on the black market from when the soviet union collapsed ,they planned on shipping drugs in it.Could you imagine if al qaeda got there hands on something like that. Pretty scary stuff!

The West's, particularly the United States double standards on this issue sickens me. How would they like Russia to offer asylum to Osama Bin Laden? I am glad to see the Russian Bear awakening again hopefully it'll bring some sanity to this world since the end of the cold war. Those days seemed so simple and safe. YES Safe because there was a proper balance of power and not a rogue superpower running around.

thanks,
drfunk

I have no sympathy or empathy for a cause that deliberatly targets
small children as legitimate military or political targets; that's a group
of real heroic freedom fighters (sic)

Ok, i have been out of the loop here and not even listen to any news except about Ivan, and also helping out some friends and neighbors recover from some of the damage from Frances, so, where are the links and the information saying that Bush is siding with the terrorists, and yes, those Chechens that took children as hostages, wounding and killing many of them should be considered as terrorists.

Originally posted by Muaddib
Ok, i have been out of the loop here and not even listen to any news except about Ivan, and also helping out some friends and neighbors recover from some of the damage from Frances, so, where are the links and the information saying that Bush is siding with the terrorists, and yes, those Chechens that took children as hostages, wounding and killing many of them should be considered as terrorists.

The US and Britain granted asylum to members of the Chechen separatists.
Moscow Times

One of the Separatists who was granted Asylum was given employment by the National Endowment for Democracy:
ChechnyaAdvocacy.org
Invited by the National Endowment for Democracy to participate in its the Reagan-Fascell Democracy Fellows Program, Ilyas Akhmadov will spend the coming months in Washington, D.C., conducting research and receiving training in advocacy and democracy-building techniques.

When Russia tried to act against terrorists in Georgia and Chechnya, they were condemned by John McCain and probably other in the Bush administration. This was in spite of the fact that they admitted there were Al-Qaeda members and Chechen militants in both countries.
mccain.senate.gov
"Some in Moscow do not understand that unilateral and pre-emptive Russian military operations in Georgia make the situation
worse, not better. These operations threaten to turn Russia's desire to root out a small group of terrorists into an international
crisis that threatens what President Putin cherishes � a robust partnership with the West that he has defined as Russia's future.

What people are complaining about Muaddib, is the double standard.

Originally posted by AceOfBase
What people are complaining about Muaddib, is the double standard.

Looking at one of the articles you posted, i can see that Russian authorities are mad because of the US giving asylum to one man, Ilyas Akhmadov, who was the foreign minister of Chechnya. Now I did a search on his name and this are some of the things that came up. I am not 100% sure, but reading some of the things written about this man he does not sound to be a terrorist. These are some of the things he has said.

On February 24 the Russian news media first reported the discovery of a mass grave outside a Russian military base containing the bodies of between 60 and 200 Chechen civilians who had been brutally tortured then mercilessly executed. This revelation is nothing new in Chechnya, and yet, the international community has acted with indifference.

Conservative estimates from Western and Russian NGO's place the number of dead at between 30,000 and 40,000 since 1999. A Russian parliamentarian who did extensive investigation in Chechnya estimates
the dead at 100,000. In addition, over 400,000 Chechen civilians have been displaced to Ingushetia, Georgia, Azerbaijan, and other countries. The Interior Minister of Russia proudly claimed a year ago that Russian forces had detained 10,000 Chechens for processing through filtration camps. How many of them never returned no one can say.

I will meet Assistant Secretary of State John Beyrle this afternoon at 3pm. For two years now I have requested such a meeting and for two years I was turned down. This meeting represents the first real
opportunity for the U.S. government to discuss the humanitarian situation and prospects for peace with a representative of the Chechen government. Of course, the State Department does not recognize Chechnya as an independent state and I do not expect them to do so at any time. Still, this meeting is the first ray of hope for the Chechen people that their plight is finally gaining the attention of the world's most powerful nation.

Excerpted from.
www.civilsoc.org...

The following is the most important part imo of this speech made by Akhmadov.

Today I ask the media to explore these accounts of gross human rights violations and I will ask the U.S. government to take realistic steps to help end the violence in Chechnya.

Excerpted from above link.

To me that doesn't sound like a man that is looking for any excuse to commit violent acts.

Now the following is a link with press releases made by the Chechen government.

www.chechnya-mfa.info...

This is another Chechen link in which this man, who has been accused by Russia of being a terrorist, has tried to do...

ilyas akhmadov urges bush to tell putin to start a genuine political dialog with the chechen president

After reading some of the reports about this man, i have to agree with the US giving him asylum.

The following is a link to Ilyas Akhmadov's "The way to end the conflict" written statement.

www.chechnya-mfa.info...


I would say there is a fine line between terrorists and people like Ilyas who seem to really want to achieve peace with Russia, but of course Russia would say he is a terrorist.....

[edit on 12-9-2004 by Muaddib]