Muslim denouncing muslim extremists

A number of my fellow members have urged the creation of this thread, as anything else I say seems like it's not good enough.

Special thanks to Scoriada who seems to think I'll get beheaded for speaking the truth on this thread.

As a devout, and practicing muslim, in order to dispell the rumors, and seemingly common belief that islam is based off of radical practice such as murder, rape, and such, I am outwardly, and formally denouncing individuals who commit heinous acts of murder and/or violence under the guise of Islam, and under the false pretense of Jihad. These are people who can be easily described as "literalists" who seem to think everything can be taken on the surface. A true muslim, who understands the concept of tasawwuf, or cleansing of your inner self, knows that the only Jihad (defined: struggle) to be practiced, is the jihad against ones own ego and not against members of other faiths, or so called "infidels".

There is a saying of our Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) that "a good christian is a good muslim, and a good muslim is a good christian." Anybody with any basic skills of comprehension can deduce from this that the muder and oppression of christians (who some seem to thing muslims regard as "infidels") is wrong. There are many such examples from the life of the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) where the muslims, and jews lived together in harmony.

There are also many places in the Qur'an and in the sayings of the Prophet (pbuh) where the killing of innocents, is forbidden, always. And even during an actual wartime situation, the killing of children, women, and the elderly is strictly prohibited.

Anyone who claims to be muslim who commits a violent act, act of murder, or anything of the sort is not acting out the will of God, but the will and desire of his/her own ego/lower self which is what he/she should have been working to overcome. Some individuals also brainwash people but that's a whole different thread.

peace

Your really making the rounds today. You've seen my stance, GL with your thread.
2nd

Hello brother,

The unfortunate thing I see here is that there are people that use the guise of religion as a mask to commit all the nasty crimes that they can.

I feel sad when people say the Muslims did it. The JEWS did it! The Blacks! The Asians!

We are all PEOPLE.

Some people are extreme. They fall under all types of religions. They fall under all types of age categories, skin color, beliefs, understandings.

These people are either woe-fully mis/dis-informed, or scared so they have to lash out.

My brother, I commend you for trying to give face to your beliefs, but we must all try to understand that the .01% of the people that create these problems are not the entirety of that belief.

We are all love,

Lets forgive and move on from those people that have caused us heart ache.

We are all Earthlings here

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


I am not taking side of extremists. But I want to clear some thing.

There is a saying of our Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) that "a good christian is a good muslim, and a good muslim is a good christian."

I don't know where did you get these from. I am not saying that there is a big gap between ' a good muslim is a good christian ' . Islam is a religion of believe . It doesn't let us to ignore the facts .

According to Qur'an :

They have certainly disbelieved who say, " Allah is the third of three." And there is no god except one God. And if they do not desist from what they are saying, there will surely afflict the disbelievers among them a painful punishment.

Source

There are two concepts of Jihad .
1.Jihad with inner self ( and Satan )
2.Jihad with outside enemy

Islam laws is not about sitting around and doing nothing.

Fight in the way of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress. Indeed. Allah does not like transgressors.

source

Well said My.mind.is.mine, this is a good response for those constantly asking the whereabouts of Muslims condemning the outrageous acts of those who claim to be muslim.

This part in particular;

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine

Anyone who claims to be muslim who commits a violent act, act of murder, or anything of the sort is not acting out the will of God, but the will and desire of his/her own ego/lower self which is what he/she should have been working to overcome. Some individuals also brainwash people but that's a whole different thread.

peace

As I've been told before, anyone who commits suicide in the name of Islam isn't actually a Muslim. Sad to see many have been so misguided then.

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine

There are many such examples from the life of the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) where the muslims, and jews lived together in harmony

There are lots of examples that war happened between prophet Muhammad and other religion believers who betrayed him.

A true muslim, who understands the concept of tasawwuf, or cleansing of your inner self, knows that the only Jihad (defined: struggle) to be practiced, is the jihad against ones own ego and not against members of other faiths, or so called "infidels".

I really know what Tasawwuf is. It tries to make second concept of Jihad as weak as it can be. Islam doesn't let the Muslims to sit around and do nothing while they are being oppressed.

There are two concepts of Jihad . 1.Jihad with inner self ( and Satan ) 2.Jihad with outside enemy

This concept of Jihad is introduced to Muslim societies basically by Elites. Elites want lower level of people to be as silent as sheep.

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


There is a story about prophet Muhammad :

As Muslims put an end to a war and they won it they were so happy.

prophet Muhammad : why are you happy ?
others : because we won the war.
prophet Muhammad : You mustn't be happy because the greater war has already begun.
others : then what is it ?
prophet Muhammad : the war between you and your inner self ( ego ) .

As you can see there are two concepts of Jihad in Islam.

Originally posted by hmdphantom
reply to post by My.mind.is.mine

 

There is a story about prophet Muhammad :

As Muslims put an end to a war and they won it they were so happy.

prophet Muhammad : why are you happy ?
others : because we won the war.
prophet Muhammad : You mustn't be happy because the greater war has already begun.
others : then what is it ?
prophet Muhammad : the war between you and your inner self ( ego ) .

As you can see there are two concepts of Jihad in Islam.

Nice data presented and it makes sense. the war between your inner self.... DEEP

I also feel bad for the many islamic brotheren subjected to the ignorance of a few with power amongst them. If they really loved they would find alternatives for cause and effects that wouldnt include the death of many and discomfort of the very people they claim to defend.

This isnt just an Islamic issue as it a Sapiens Sapiens issue..

Muslim denouncing muslim extremists

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine
Anyone who claims to be muslim who commits a violent act, act of murder, or anything of the sort is not acting out the will of God, but the will and desire of his/her own ego/lower self which is what he/she should have been working to overcome. Some individuals also brainwash people but that's a whole different thread.

Well if "that's a whole different thread" then whats the point of this thread?


I mean. I've said it before and I'll say it again that I believe that a few individuals have hijacked Islam with their twisted and extremists views and brainwash weak minded individuals to go blow themselves up or worse blow up a bunch of school girls who simply want a better life through education in the name of Allah and in the process giving Good Muslims and Islam on the whole a bad wrap.

Those individuals who twist and pervert the teachings of Islam and Mohamed while brainwashing others should be the thrust of this thread.

Not end with a cop out of "that's whole different thread" IMHO.

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


These are people who can be easily described as "literalists" who seem to think everything can be taken on the surface.





Awesome...and just to clarify - now you're only partially superstitious, correct..?

reply to post by SLAYER69

Those individuals who twist and pervert the teachings of Islam and Mohamed while brainwashing others should be the thrust of this thread.

There is no certain filter to detect such people . How should we define them as a group ?

reply to post by SLAYER69

I mean. I've said it before and I'll say it again that I believe that a few individuals have hijacked Islam with their twisted and extremists views and brainwash weak minded individuals to go blow themselves up or worse blow up a bunch of school girls who simply want a better life through education in the name of Allah and in the process giving Good Muslims and Islam on the whole a bad wrap.

I understand what you say . What is the solution ?

Originally posted by hmdphantom
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

Those individuals who twist and pervert the teachings of Islam and Mohamed while brainwashing others should be the thrust of this thread.

There is no certain filter to detect such people . How should we define them as a group ?

Originally posted by SLAYER69
I believe that a few individuals have hijacked Islam with their twisted and extremists views and brainwash weak minded individuals to go blow themselves up or worse blow up a bunch of school girls who simply want a better life through education in the name of Allah and in the process giving Good Muslims and Islam on the whole a bad wrap.

Originally posted by hmdphantom

I understand what you say . What is the solution ?

When a certain "Supposedly" Christian preacher came out and burnt the Koran there was a massive outcry not just from Muslims but from Christians as well. How about Muslim Self policing in their own communities? Start there. Reject those who teach hatred and are actively recruiting for extremist groups.

Start from within.
If it flies in the face of Mohumeds teaching then it should be easy to spot....

RIGHT?

OP, will the people in your mosque speak out as you have? I hope so. It's about damn time.

reply to post by SLAYER69


I am trying to get the messages as correct as I can.

so please , what do you exactly mean of hatred ?

Reject those who teach hatred and are actively recruiting for extremist groups.

We should discuss in two parts. 1.teaching hatred 2.recruiting for extremist groups

1.teaching hatred :

My country has not been invaded but suppose that

Some foreign country invades your country.
Takes out the resources of your country.
Occupies the cities.
Soldiers disrespect your religion and what are of a great value.
They established the new government in the country , so you hope no drastic change.
Soldiers treat your people like an animal.

honestly ,
What would you do ? Aren't you capable of doing such things as what you call extremists do ?

2.A little info on Al-Qaida
Al-Qaida members are Wahhabi . It is a new branch of Islam which is not more than 300 years old . They are not accepted by other branches of Islam . They are such close minded people who don't let themselves read a history books and learn about themselves. They don't intend to explore the world outside.

The origin of this branch is Saudi Arabia , A country of little population and much selling crude oil. So , generally they are wealthy people who don't mind learning history or and they don't try to make the life better.

They just support some Wahhabi schools in Pakistan . It is Pakistan where the real terrorism is born.

My experience , I have not ever seen recruiting for extremist groups.As I know they do It is secretly.I have heard that mostly it is about money and it is not about religion , when some body enter these groups.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I really want to get a conclusion.
regards.

Originally posted by hmdphantom
My country has not been invaded but suppose that

Some foreign country invades your country.
Takes out the resources of your country.
Occupies the cities.
Soldiers disrespect your religion and what are of a great value.
They established the new government in the country , so you hope no drastic change.
Soldiers treat your people like an animal.

honestly ,
What would you do ?

Well for starters....

Maybe this should be a discussion among and between Shiites and Sunnis?
You don't blow up a few dozen Women, Children and elderly at a market place or mosque for one.


Iraq Mosque Bombing Leaves 8 Dead

A suicide bomber disguised as a worshipper blew himself up inside a Shiite mosque north of Baghdad Thursday and killed eight people, a police spokesman said, shattering a period of relative calm across the country.

Eighteen people were injured in the blast in the city of Balad Ruz, 45 miles (70 kilometers) north of Baghdad, said the police spokesman, Maj. Ghalib al-Karkhi. There was no immediate claim of responsibility, but Sunni militants have often targeted Shiite mosques as a way to incite sectarian violence.

Most of the dead were worshippers at the mosque.

Source

BAGHDAD, Feb. 22 -- Bombers blasted the gilded dome of one of Shiite Islam's holiest shrines into naked steel and gaping blue sky Wednesday in a provocative assault that roused tens of thousands of Iraqi Shiites into angry protests and deadly clashes.

The highest spiritual leaders of Iraq's Shiite majority simultaneously rallied and restrained the outrage of their followers after the attack on the Askariya shrine in Samarra, about 65 miles north of Baghdad. Though no casualties were reported, the bombing was the most destructive attack on a major shrine since the U.S. invasion, and Iraqi leaders said it was meant to draw Shiites and Sunnis into war.

Start there.....

reply to post by SLAYER69


Thank you for replies.

Now , I can understand what aspect of terrorism you are looking at.

I believe that there are fools in every society.
fool : A person who doesn't knot what he wants , doesn't care to know , thinks about living today.

In Muslim countries governments don't have any program for fools ,
1.They don't know anything about religion or they are misunderstood or brain washed : think that god loves this action
2.They just want to live a good life : They prefer an easy money

It is concluded that : ' I will be blessed by god and my family will live better '.

Some people who intend to get more powerful usually cause the first motivation ( they brainwash , keep people ignorant , make people misunderstand ). You want us to stop them . We like to , but most of the times we don't know who is responsible for these attacks.

IMHO : most of the times what is pursue by these actions is : the old divide and conquer tactic.
they want to create civil wars between Shiites and Sunnis.

I really liked reading what you said about ego.
An old saying by their Fruits you will know them.
Anyone ca say they are a tour guide and take your money but those who really know their way around will become evident to the discerning.
I think one of mankinds biggest challenges is the ego.
I often look at the actions of those who proclaim a faith and see the pointy fangs under the wool.

I've said it before and will do so again.

Religion is no excuse for violence.

I have been to Muslim services, Catholic and many Christian denominations services as well. I've spoke with those of the Jewish faith, and with clear and open eyes can not logically see why these religions of the Book, can agree to disagree and move on as a part of the same Triune.

With over three decades under my belt, and in junior High was reading college level theology for world religions as an interest, it is safe to say one such as myself would be open minded and well versed in those studies.

I keep both a Koran and Bible by my night stand, and read both still. Even though I have read both cover to cover.

True people of their faith, no matter what it is, are not going to be violently extreme. It is the zealots and misguided who do so. Literally the religiously blind, leading the blind...

I agree with the OP, many Muslims who I have met, both in the USA and especially in Iraq, are not supporters of violence.

They are victims of it, and unrecognized victims at that.


That is my $.02