Have you ever seen a picture of The Emancipation Proclamation ?

Notice the hemp leafs
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/9c0fb1809801.jpg[/atsimg]

I won't say any more about it because this thread is just going to it moved to the drug forum anyways...

denying ignorance alright...

www.jackherer.com...

Chapter 1 – OVERVIEW OF THE HISTORY OF CANNABIS HEMP

Chapter 2 – BRIEF SUMMARY OF THE USES OF HEMP

Chapter 3 – NEW BILLION DOLLAR CROP

Chapter 4 – THE LAST DAYS OF LEGAL CANNABIS

Chapter 5 – MARIJUANA PROHIBITION

Chapter 6 – MEDICAL LITERATURE ON CANNABIS MEDICINE

Chapter 7 – THERAPEUTIC USE OF CANNABIS

Chapter 8 – HEMPSEED AS THE BASIC WORLD FOOD

Chapter 9 – ECONOMICS ENERGY & ENVIRONMENT

Chapter 10 – MYTH, MAGIC & MEDICINE

Chapter 11 – THE (HEMP) WAR OF 1812, NAPOLEON & RUSSIA

Chapter 12 – CANNABIS DRUG USE IN 19TH CENTURY AMERICA

Chapter 13 – PREJUDICE: MARIJUANA AND JIM CROW LAWS

Chapter 14 – MORE THAN SIXTY YEARS OF SUPPRESSION

Chapter 15 – THE OFFICIAL STORY: DEBUNKING “GUTTER SCIENCE”

Chapter 16 – THE EMPEROR’S NEW CLOTHES

I don't think it will get moved.

I don't think those are (removed) leaves.

I think they are slightly stylized heads of wheat. They are found on various US state seals and Provincial seals of Canada.

oh nvm. ignore.

reply to post by alaskan
Now that I see your second post....

It very well may be moved.

the first declaration was on hemp paper and its still in great condition today, those look like oak leaves and careful about that word (removed), i was banned years ago for talking about it.

Originally posted by butcherguy
I think they are slightly stylized heads of wheat. They are found on various US state seals and Provincial seals of Canada.

It's a historical fact that Lincoln used hemp oil lamps, and was most likely using one as he drafted the proclamation. It can be argued that hemp was a more/equally important plant than wheat in those times, and they definitely look more like cannabis leafs.

Why would you call them (removed) leafs? You're like the moderators, I'm talking about something a complete 180 degrees from the smokable, drug variety of the plant, and you come in here and use drug lingo...

reply to post by butcherguy


Please don't take this wrong, but Hemp and (removed) are not the same. Never has been never will be, no matter how many times the uneducated on the subject say it's so. I really never understood why you would make Hemp illegal, however MJ is debatable.

Myth: Smoking industrial hemp gets a person high.

Reality: The THC levels in industrial hemp are so low that no one could get high from smoking it. Moreover, hemp contains a relatively high percentage of another cannabinoid, CBD, that actually blocks the marijuana high. Hemp, it turns out, is not only not marijuana; it could be called "antimarijuana."

Hemp and Marijuana: Myths & Realities

I talk about the legalization of Hemp a lot with the people I know and interact with, and without fail they automatically think I'm either a pot head or I'm arguing for medical MJ. Both of which really shouldn't have anything to do with Industrial Hemp. Legalizing Hemp just may be the next big economic boom if it were allowed to be grown my American farmers. But hey I'm sure it will be argued that all that will do is make all the farmers high.

All I really want is separate the Medical MJ debate from the Industrial Hemp debate.

After looking at the picture a little closer, I think they look like Holly leaves. But that opens up a whole other discussion.

reply to post by alaskan

Why would you call them pot leafs? You're like the moderators, I'm talking about something a complete 180 degrees from the smokable, drug variety of the plant, and you come in here and use drug lingo...

I think you should read some of my post history before you jump to any conclusions.

I am a libertarian, as such I do not support laws and statutes that criminalize behavior that is not harmful to others.

I think if you were to wear a shirt that had a 'hemp' leaf emblazoned on the front of it, you would find a lot of people asking if you smoked 'pot'.

My point, which has not been addressed BTW, is that those leaves in question are not hemp leaves, but fruiting heads of grain (like the amber waves of grain...) as a symbol of our country's productivity and fruitfulness. The same symbol is to be found on many state seals in the US and provincial seals of Canada, for the same reason.

There was mention made of hemp oil being used for lamps, even that old honest Abe was writing by the light of one when he penned the Emancipation Proclamation, maybe. Whale oil was used for lighting. Why would men go out with ships to spear whales to get that oil, which had to be rendered out of the blubber at substantial added cost, when there is a 'better' product that just needs to be pressed out of the seeds?

reply to post by JohnnyR

I think they look like Holly leaves.

We are looking at two different parts of the picture. I believe that you are referring to the leaves that surround A. Lincolns head. I think the OP means the gray leaves found behind the words 'Emancipation Proclamation'.

Take a look, if they are hemp leaves, they have been stripped from the base and re-arranged, IMO.

*******Alert************
The OP seems to have made an earnest attempt at discussing the history of how Hemp products have been used. Please keep the discussion on this topic and avoid any slang terms or discussion of illicit or illegal substances. If the discussion drifts into that territory the thread will be moved and/or closed.

Thank you for everyone's cooperation on this subject.

*best moderator response to one of my threads ever*

Originally posted by butcherguy
Take a look, if they are hemp leaves, they have been stripped from the base and re-arranged, IMO.

And if they're heads of grain/wheat they've been stripped of their characteristic wisps and bunched together, and given the sharp, serrated points of a cannabis leaf. Just because all of the images we see are of a well-defined five or seven-tipped leaf, doesn't mean they're all like that. 3-bladed leafs, all the way up to 14-bladed are common. Shape and size varies greatly as well.

Also, there's other imagery between each leaf blade. I don't think they're there to represent a single leaf on either side of the crest, so much as to represent it's use as a soil-helper between other crops. Read at least chapter nine of the book I posted above. Here's part of it...

Land & Soil Reclamation


Land reclamation is another compelling economic and ecological argument for hemp cultivation.

Until this century, our pioneers and ordinary American farmers used cannabis to clear fields for planting, as a fallow year crop, and after forest fires to prevent mud slides and loss of watershed.

Hemp seeds put down a 10 to 12 inch root in only 30 days, compared to the one inch root put down by the rye or barley grass presently used by the U.S. Government.

Southern California, Utah and other states used cannabis routinely in this manner until about 1915. It also breaks up compacted, overworked soil.

In the formerly lush Himalayan regions of Bangladesh, Nepal and Tibet there is now only a light moss covering left, as flash floods wash thousands of tons of topsoil away.

Bangladesh literally means “canna-bis-land-people” (it was formerly called East Bengal province, a name derived from “bhang” (cannabis) and “la” (land). In the 1970s, Independent Bangladesh signed an “anti-drug” agreement with the U.S., promising not to grow hemp. Since that time, they have suffered disease, starvation and decimation due to unrestrained flooding.

World War II: The Most Recent Time America Asked Our Farmers to Grow Cannabis Hemp M--------.

Our energy needs are an undeniable national security priority. But first, let’s see what Uncle Sam can do when pushed into action:

In early 1942, Japan cut off our supplies of vital hemp and coarse fibers. M--------, which had been outlawed in the United States as the “Assassin of Youth” just five years earlier, was suddenly safe enough for our government to ask the kids in the Kentucky 4-H clubs to grow the nation’s 1943 seed supply. Each youth was urged to grow at least half an acre, but preferably two acres of hemp for seed.

(University of Kentucky Agricultural Extension, Leaflet 25, March 1943)

In 1942-43 all American farmers were required to attend showings of the USDA film Hemp for Victory, sign that they had seen the film and read a hemp cultivation booklet. Hemp harvesting machinery was made available at low or no cost. Five-dollar tax stamps were available and 350,000 acres of cultivated hemp was the goal by 1943. (See transcript p. 64.)

“Patriotic” American farmers, from 1942 through 1945, who agreed to grow hemp were waived from serving in the military, along with their sons; that’s how vitally important hemp was to America during World War II.

Meanwhile, from the late 1930s through 1945, “patriotic” German farmers were given a comic book-like instruction manual by the Nazi government, urging them to grow hemp for the war. (See a complete reproduction of this 1943 Nazi “hanf” (hemp) manual in the Appendix.)

Hemp seeds broadcast over eroding soil could reclaim land the world over. The farmed out desert regions can be brought back year after year, not only slowing the genocide of starvation but easing threats of war and violent revolution.

I know I've read a lot more about that subject, and how it's even been used alongside/mixed up with other crops and they all benefit from each other, and I'm pretty sure it's all in that book (annotated and cited) but I don't have time to read through the whole thing again right now...