Obama blocks list of visitors to White House

Originally posted by Matthew Dark
That is just your opinion.
If you were president, and you wanted to invite some friends and/or hookers over for beer pong, you wouldn't want everyone up on your junk getting in your face.
Now, I'm not saying that's what he's doing, but you also have to take into consideration that perhaps he's meeting with operatives who have to maintain a cover.
You remember how outraged you were when the former administration publicly released the name of an undercover CIA agent?
Just take into consideration that no matter how much we pay in taxes, there are some things that the higher ups don't have to tell us.
I can't say I'm thrilled about that prospect one bit, but I understand the need to keep certain things under your hat.
Just because you want to know, doesn't mean you need to know.

You're right, I wouldn't want everyone up in my junk if I was having some hookers over for beer pong. Such actions are inappropriate for the office, and the public would demand an impeachment. Now I know you're exaggerating, but the principle is the same. We have a right to know if our elected officials are out of line.

And I agree that some things rightfully need to be kept secret. But this scenario doesn't fall under that classification. Nobody is asking for sensitive information; only names. If you read the article, they didn't ask what business was being conducted or any other information that could be considered an invasion of privacy.

Many people here on ATS would agree that the president is little more than a puppet, and refusing to release these public documents simply provides a cover for the puppeteers.

Edit to fix quote

[edit on 16-6-2009 by killuminati2012]

[edit on 16-6-2009 by killuminati2012]

I have a relative who works with the Secret Service and was able to obtain a 'typical' 'daily' visitors list to the Oval Office...

9:00 AM: George H.W. Bush Sr.
10:00 AM: Carl Rove
11:00 AM: Dick Cheney
12:00 PM: Lunch
1:00 PM: George W. Bush Jr.
2:00 PM: Rush Limbaugh
3:00 PM: Joseph Goebbels
4:00 PM: Heinrick Himmler
5:00 PM: Schlitz Malt Liqour
6:00 PM: Jack Daniels
7:00 PM: Johnny Walker
8:00 PM: 50 Cents
9:00 PM: Hey I already worked 12 hours what do I look like a slave?

See nothing untoward in that list of visitors

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Ok, so we know he has lousy taste in booze and friends........
and the Oprah is his guru? Time to find a new cult....

This is a prime example of what I was afraid was going to happen with Bush running roughshod over the executive privilege rules for the past 8 years. And when I say that, understand that at this point, it's not even an attack on Bush. It's merely to point out that once one president sets a precedent, the doors are open for the future executives to walk through.

Obama's just a politician, like every other president before him. The only difference is that he has the distinction of following the most secretive administration in US history. When your predecessor lowers the bar to that level, I guess it's not surprising that, as a politician, he takes advantage of it.

But is this the change he promised before, during and after the election? I think that answer is pretty self-evident. And let me just say, that as a devout liberal, I didn't like it when Bush did it and I don't like it now that Obama's doing it. This flies directly in the face of the change he so eloquently advocated for.

Originally posted by jam321
Did Obama ever describe what he meant by transparency?

Transparency of Bush documents-OK

Transparency of Obama's documents- NO NO

Obama is a fast speaker and people buy into what he says. What surprises me is that even when he fails to deliver, people continue to buy what he is selling.

Yes I've noticed this also. It's a bit wierd, he gets caught in a mix of words and meaning, but people seem to ignore that. They support him anyway.
Man, he would make a great pimp.

This is lame, and a dead giveaway he is hiding something. I dont think he knows what to do, so he is allowing ex or current BUSH members into positions. A few weeks ago, i watched obamas speech on meidcare on CNN.he was asking anyone at all, what to dowtih ideas, that he has an open mind. Get my drift? He is going through this prediency blind, and i suspect he is placing the bad guys into kkey postions of power cause he cant come up with any answer or idea at all...
And for the white house to censor a list of pople. the white house is the PEOPLES house mr.president..you rememeber, we the people?

There is such a thing as national security.

Example. High level envoys may be coming in from places that are not regular visitors. No one wants to tip off, say, the Russians, that backroom deals are being made with people they think are on their side.

The guest list may have been a gap that wasn't recognized and is now being closed.

If Obama really wanted to be secretive he could be whisked away to unrevealed safe houses unknown to the public.


Records of his Presidency will eventually be made to the public.

People will just have to live with some things being under wraps for a while.

Mike

Originally posted by mmiichael


There is such a thing as national security.

Example. High level envoys may be coming in from places that are not regular visitors. No one wants to tip off, say, the Russians, that backroom deals are being made with people they think are on their side.

The guest list may have been a gap that wasn't recognized and is now being closed.

If Obama really wanted to be secretive he could be whisked away to unrevealed safe houses unknown to the public.


Records of his Presidency will eventually be made to the public.

People will just have to live with some things being under wraps for a while.

Mike

The people are the nation, the man is not the nation.

The unacountability in government is not in the people who are the nation's interest.

Ignorance does not keep people secure.

You Sir are advocating embracing ignorance for ignorance's sake.

For some that might be blissful, they tell me freezing to death is a pleasant experience to though.

The people are the nation, the people always have a right to know, and not just fictitious versions of events long after they have transpired and the damage is done.

A dictator is a dictator and a despot is a despot and there is no reason what so ever for an intelligent person to pretend otherwise.

The government must be accountable at all levels and it can not be accountable at any level, when any portion of it operates in secrecy and foolishy promotes acceptance of that through the politics of fear.

The site says deny ignorance not encourage it.

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler


The people are the nation, the man is not the nation.

The unacountability in government is not in the people who are the nation's interest.

Ignorance does not keep people secure.

You Sir are advocating embracing ignorance for ignorance's sake.

For some that might be blissful, they tell me freezing to death is a pleasant experience to though.

The people are the nation, the people always have a right to know, and not just fictitious versions of events long after they have transpired and the damage is done.

A dictator is a dictator and a despot is a despot and there is no reason what so ever for an intelligent person to pretend otherwise.

The government must be accountable at all levels and it can not be accountable at any level, when any portion of it operates in secrecy and foolishy promotes acceptance of that through the politics of fear.

The site says deny ignorance not encourage it.

You missed the point entirely. It was about the White House guest list and sometimes it may be considered in the best interest of the nation that some things are not revealed immediately that might jeopardize ongoing dealings with perceived enemies, their agents, etc.

The US Presidency records are maintained and released at an appropriate time, That has not changed.

Your objections just sounds like a histrionic tirade to me.


Mike



[edit on 17-6-2009 by mmiichael]

would you like other parents in your neighborhood to know who comes tro your house because you are a PTA representative? That's a comparison. Even if Obama defends the free world and blablabla, that doesn't have to deprive him from the right to privacy/secrecy that everyone can pretend to.
We live in a free world. He's free NOT to comply with those hardcore neocon groups. Let 'em write stuff on that mtter, instead of debating where is the stimulus money going...

Expanding the wars overseas......check
Continuing the theft of our liberties......check
Creating a government just as secretive as the last......check
Continuing the corporate collusion and bailouts......check


Well I guess this is change you can believe in.....

This is a bunch of BS. The American people have the RIGHT to know who is entering OUR white house!

Transparency indeed!

Its this kind of corrupt bullcrap in our government that We the People should not put up with.

reply to post by MattMulder


Does the president of the PTA reside in a publicly owned building? The White House is not owned by the President, it is Owned by the people. So do you not have the right to know who is entering YOUR OWN HOME?

reply to post by killuminati2012


I see your point, and it was well said.
Now keep in mind, I'm not sticking up for, or trying to go against him, I'm just some guy.
I pine for the old Kennedy days when it was cool for our president to party.
*sigh*
Anywho, I honestly think that there are more important things to consider here.
I understand that there are a lot of Obama detractors, and that's all well and good, because honestly, as Americans, we should be able to speak out against our politicians.
But I keep hearing all this wackadoodle stuff being said and most of it just sounds so unfounded and paranoid.
And someone earlier took a shot at him being Muslim, which I believe was totally uncalled for (no wonder so many other countries hate Americans).
But I personally would think that it would make no difference in any of our lives to know who he met with.
So many other presidents have done the exact same thing, but because the general publics' eye is focused solely on him, everything he does is under a microscope.
All this talk about him being the AntiChrist (of which I'm a big fan of his work by the way...not Obama, but the AntiChrist), or an alien or a clone or whatever...it's just so out of control.
If he goes for a walk and steps on the grass instead of the sidewalk...AntiChrist!
If he doesn't tip enough at the coffee shop...Muslim AntiChrist!
If he doesn't pick up after his dog...Alien Puppet Illuminati Muslim Foreigner Alien AntiChrist!!!
Seriously people, y'all sound like a bunch of loons.
Just stick to the facts...not truths.
Facts are provable, truth is what you believe at the time.

It seems that government will always be the necessary "evil"...secrets will always be kept, and the majority will never run it for good.

Even think about you and your friends playing jokes on each other...if there is a secret that a certain person thinks best is kept that way, they will do it.

Doesn't mean its right.