Should the U.S. House Pass the Resolution to Condemn Hezbollah and Hamas?

Then, the question I have always wanted to know concerning the U.S. policy in this matter is this:

Whose life is worth more? A Lebanese life? Or a Israeli life?

Does this determine the U.S. policy toward this horrible battle in the Middle East?

Originally quoted by psyopswatcher
Ceci, I edited my last post (while you were posting) to add a quote and link to this article from yesterday's ContraCosta Times:

Thank you for the article. I read it and can only shake my head at American foreign policy in the Middle East. I think it certainly answers the question that I asked above. And their actions can only escalate an already drastic situation into something worse with their "push for democratization".

This shift in policy can only be described as an act of "colonialism" with a string of puppet governments to boot.

No wonder the House and the Senate passed that resolution.

[edit on 21-7-2006 by ceci2006]

Like your quote from Ben Franklin... The virtuous, being capable of freedom.

Israelis see virtue by defending their nation. They will never give way to what they have fought for and established in that land. But actually they did, by the recent withdrawals from Gaza and the West Bank. Making room for a Palestinian state.

A suicide bomber is both a coward and a killer, hardly virtuous or deserving of freedom. But you can't make an oppressed people see that when they have been raised in generations as 2nd class citizens in their own homeland. Any act to free them from their oppression is virtuous in their eyes.

By becoming politically organized, a militia takes it a step further and begins to speak for the 'people' that brought them to power, not just one lone bomber hoping to see the glory of the heavens in a malicious act perpetrated against a religious enemy.

Now that, psyopswatcher, is very profound. That gives me something to think about when considering your reasoning about this situation. Yes, this situation is very messy. But, somehow, I think that there are too many cooks in the kitchen for this one.

It is also important to note, however, virtue is in the eye of the beholder. And it is rather dangerous when both sides see the virtue in what they are doing in terms of battle. To defend that virtue, people are willing to do what they have to make their side more "virtuous" than the other.

That is why the U.S. policy toward this matter is rather crooked to say the least. Depending upon how one sees this entire thing, America also thinks of itself as being virtuous by its support of Israel.

The question then becomes, who is truly morally right in this conflict? And who becomes the actual winner as a result of this?

And who, out of any governing body, has the wisdom to see the higher issues in this entire stance of warfare?

Originally posted by psyopswatcher

Condeming Hamas is truly ironic in that they were elected DEMOCRATICALLY, and that's what the big push in the ME by the US State Dept is all about, bringing democracy to the Arab street.

i think that's where the rub is at,
the US spin is to ignore the fact that Hamas was freely elected as leadership

also the Hizbollah, it too has a 'political wing', and was chosen as a minority representation in the legitimate Lebanon government lawmaking body.

i see the US as lumping the political wings of Hamas & Hizbollah
together with the military wings of both Hamas & Hizbollah
and painting them as being exclusively terrorist orgs
~and by inference; that Hamas & Hizbollah were not ethically elected in free elections,
& therefore have no standing in the democratically elected community.

in-other-words, Hamas & Hizbollah used threats & force (as is the nature of terrorist orgs according to this administration) to get elected in the first place.

? you then ask what would Condi do/say?
She would jump at the latest statement by a Saudi Wahhibist who issued a comdenation of Hizbollah actions & Iranian support of the Hizbollah war like actions that are not in accordance with Islamic law....
(find that report at ynetnews out of Israel today- fri, 21 jul 06)

Keep in mind; Hamas and Hezbolah have both made it very clear that their main goal is the total destruction of Israel. They have both publicly stated as much.

You think Israel should sit down and talk with Hezbolah? Do you think Israel could work out some sort of Peaceful arraignment with a group that publicly states that it will accept nothing short of the total destruction of Israel? Do you think Israel could work out some sort of Peaceful arraignment with a group that has demonstrated time and again that they have no interest in peace with Israel?

Is it not written, “…they have eyes, but they see not…” ?

How can ANYBODY today believe that Hezbolah or Hamas will talk peace with Israel?

And, if Hezbolah or Hamas were to talk peace with Israel, why would ANYBODY today believe that Hezbolah or Hamas would honor their own agreements. They NEVER have in the past. What is different today that would make ANYBODY believe any different.

Look, if Israel and the Palestinian people were to make peace, what would happen to Hamas? They would have no reason to exist. Why would they want peace? THEY DON”T, they have said their goal is the total destruction of Israel.

When Israel and the Palestinians were talking peace a couple years ago, Hamas and Islamic Jihad both publicly stated that they WILL NOT honor ANY peace agreements with Israel.

And what about Hezbolah. They existed to drive Israel out of Lebanon. Fine, then why did Hezbolah continue attacking Israel AFRTER Israel left Lebanon?

Do you REALLY believe Hamas or Hezbolah have ANY interest in Peace?

Pa-leeeeeeez.

If we were to force Israel into stopping their attack on Hezbolah right now. What would happen in four or five years, after Hezbolah is re-armed by Syria and Iran? They would attack Israel and this cycle would just repeat itself.

The U.N. passed a resolution calling for Israel to vacate Lebanon, and called for Lebanon to disarm and disband Hezbolah. What happened with that resolution? Israel vacated Lebanon. Lebanon worked out an agreement with Hezbolah that allowed Hezbolah to remain in southern Lebanon and allowed Hezbolah to remain armed to the teeth.

If Lebanon and/or the UN are unable or unwilling to enforce Lebanon’s requirements of UNSC Resolution 1559, maybe it’s time to let Israel take care of business.

So, to answer your question, who cares what resolution the House passes?

What’s important is stopping the cycle of violence that Hezbolah and Hamas wants to keep going.


[edit on 21-7-2006 by hlesterjerome]

Well what ever they decide, does it really make a differences to what israel says or does. And if as some people have suggest that they also condem syria, iran, and N korea.

Are you all Mad, you can condem these countries all you like, they do really care what the US says, as the US is the Big Best nasty capitalist , nation thats support and back the zionest state and current aggreser in the middle east irsael.

Yes Hamas and hazbollah started this little war and are to blame for the current problems, and technically speaking they both have been freely elected to goverment in a fair vote of the people. who decided that they belived that might have a better life under these goverments.

Does this give irsael the right to destory an ecomoy and infastrutuce of lebanon under the pretext of getting their soilders back, why do you need a full miltiary attack with artillery and air attacks , when a special force snacth and grab raid is easier. Irsael now has the perfect excuse to do what it always wanted to do, take out both parties and the US is dragging its feet on telling irsael to cool down.

As it suit the current adminstrartion to have conflict in the middle east, so if they decide to invade iran than they can use there support of hazbollah as a perfect excuse

-------------------------
...Yes Hamas and hazbollah started this little war and are to blame for the current problems, and technically speaking they both have been freely elected to goverment in a fair vote of the people. who decided that they belived that might have a better life under these goverments...
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Everybody in the world HAS to know by now that if you attack Israel they WILL counter-attack.

So, why would the Palestinians think they would have a better live if they elect people into their government that they KNOW has every intention of continuing their attacks on Israel?

And the same goes for Lebanon and Hezbolah!

Maybe I’m the Stoooopid one here, but, where in Hell is the logic in that kind of thinking?

Originally posted by Xeros
The Israeli soldiers were captured inside Lebanon therefore I think it was the Israelis who started the war,

That is totally bogus and has been debunked in this thread:
politics.abovetopsecret.com...

Plus Hezbollah has not got the capability in terms of the range of its missiles to reach Haifa.

Hezbollah Rockets Wound 5 in Haifa

Rocket barrage hits Tiberias

Plus Israel is clearly acting illegaly here, why can they suddenly get away with not adhereing to the terms of war? It makes my blood boil

Is kidnapping and executing civilians illegal? Is kidnapping soldiers an act of war? Is firing rockets into a sovereign country an act of war?

Yes, yes, and yes. That's what Hezbollah did to provoke and start this conflict.

Originally posted by snakebite
Does this give irsael the right to destory an ecomoy and infastrutuce of lebanon under the pretext of getting their soilders back, why do you need a full miltiary attack with artillery and air attacks , when a special force snacth and grab raid is easier. Irsael now has the perfect excuse to do what it always wanted to do, take out both parties and the US is dragging its feet on telling irsael to cool down.

I'm sure that if they knew where the soldiers were, they would do a "snatch and grab". Rumor has them in Iran by now.

You also assume that Israel would do whatever the US told them to do. History has shown us this is not always so. Besides, Israel has the right to defend itself from the aggression of Hezbollah.

Lebanon has not followed 1559. If they cannot do it alone, they should have asked the world for help. They never did.

Therefore, they give tacit approval to Hezbollah to operate among them.

As it suit the current adminstrartion to have conflict in the middle east, so if they decide to invade iran than they can use there support of hazbollah as a perfect excuse

Iran and Syria have the ability to rein in Hezbollah at any time. Hezbollah is merely a pawn of Iran and Syria.

But Iran and Syria have instigated this, and are now perpetuating this. Why is that?

Because it suits them to have conflict in the middle east?

Because Ahmadinijead anxiously awaits the arrival of the Twelfth Imam?

Why don't they stop Hezbollah?

So, if Lebanon violated 1559, then shouldn't it be left to the world court to preside in this matter instead of leaving it to Israel to bomb the country to the stone age?

[edit on 21-7-2006 by ceci2006]

Israel isn't enforcing 1559 per se. They are defending their citizens from terrorist attacks coming for Hezbollah who happen to be based in southern Lebanon. Israel would be doing the same thing if there were no Resolution 1559.

But yes, you are right. It is up to the world court to enforce the resolution. The problem is, they are ineffective at doing so.

I don't like what Israel is doing, which was initially for two soldiers, but now that they are in there, why not let them fight this front on the War on Terrorism for us ("The Long War"). So, I say pass it, condemn the terrorist as well as Syria and Iran for supporting these terrorists, but also condemn Israel at the United Nations (won't happen).