Saddam did NOT GAS HIS OWN PEOPLE

Hey, thanks for the heads up on Iran. We'll get right on that. They weren't too far down the list anyway.

Maybe this little tidbit can move them ahead of Syria?

We shall see.

My point exactly...but here in lies the problem. You said the kurds were basically shiznit...

Do you understand that many Germans in WWII, especially Hitler (read Mein Kampf) felt the same way about jews. The jews were same as or worse then terrorists to Germans who felt that way and therefore many felt that the extermination of the jews was justified...

..as you have attempted to justify the killing of these Kurdish terrorists...

I guess it is all in how you look at it...

Unfortunetly innocents more often then the guilty end up caught in the crossfire...as on 9/11, as did the innocent kurds, as did the innocent jews....as did innocent Iraqi children by American bullets and bombs.

So what I'm saying I guess is that no matter what, until we all learn how to be more tolerable of each other on this planet, it will never stop. And unfortunetly, this entire thread clearly demonstrates the human unwillingness for tolerance.



[Edited on 29-9-2003 by DeepShiznit]

Originally posted by Bandit
John Nada,

Thanks for the support, and for 'understanding' my views..

('understanding' for that you see that these have at least some facts in their support..)

(and you are also right in that i should be 'little bit' less extreme.. that only happens because i sometimes take things personally.. when JUMPED by GG and Springer.. :dn

But lets leave GG and Spriger here.. alone..

As i for one dont want or have the energy to listen their insults.

Btw, guys.. if you hate OBL as you do, you shuold also hate the Kurd PKK, and alike Kurd groups..

Let's get something straight, I am not on your side and some of your comments I find disgusting, but I just can't stand assholes and the usual suspects that do it in their gang up style act like it again.

So, then you must be on GG:s..

No?

Where are you?

There is no middle ground here..



One is in or out, friend or foe.



One cant be a ATS member just spectating as GG and Springer do their worst.

Gang up, insult, lie and spread propanganda.

Um, can someone find a nice tight little white jacket that ties around the back for Bandit/Uninem and mercifully close this sad thread.

It's like a car accident. The victim is good taste. The killer is... well, you know.

j

I think Bandit is just having a Bush day.

The kind where Bush says things like

"You are either with us or against us",

or

"Bring 'em on!"


When the shells are whizzing past your ears from both sides and you find yourself in no man's land, that is the time to compose yourself and think to your survival.

As far as the topic of this thread goes, there has been evidence mounted from many sides about the fate of the Kurdish people.

I have learned some things. The historical records are not accurate enough, and in a few short years the genocide could well be regarded with the same disdain and disinterest as what happened to the Armenians early last century. And there will be deniers.

Also, people have tended to inflate the numbers to suit their purposes. Any civilian deaths are wrongful. Including the 7,000 to 9,000 already dead at the hands of the invading forces in 2003.

Anyone who continues to promote that the Bush admin has unilaterally invaded Iraq to be rid of an evil dictator, in vengeance for innocent Kurdish people, is on notice from me that they are still lying and defending the indefensible.

Lies, fabrication, post-hoc rationalization, and changing course on the world stage while continuing in the attempt to secure illegal profits and benefits, are all just part of the corrupt neo-con PNAC agenda.

Originally posted by MaskedAvatar

Anyone who continues to promote that the Bush admin has unilaterally invaded Iraq to be rid of an evil dictator, in vengeance for innocent Kurdish people, is on notice from me that they are still lying and defending the indefensible.

Right on M.A. It wasn't at all unilateral and I , like you really wish people would pick up a dictionary and look up that word before they toss it around. There were 30 some different countries under the sanction of 14 U.N. resolutions. Because there were a few countries that refused to uphold the resolutions to which they originally pledged support, doesn't mean they can back off and label those who uphold it as unilateralist. Put em' on notice big guy. Let em' have it!

Right ON my BROTHER! I hope they have dictionaries down in NZ. I KNOW they DO because alien is very literate!

Alas, some will never see what is before them and others will continue to see that which they WISH was there...

PEACE...
m...

Springer, thats the ideology of "say it enough and it becomes fact." Its popular on here but I'm glad that a couple of ya agree anyways. We are interested in being correct and not propaghanda peddling but then again we aren't fighting a losing holy war so who knows what we'd try if we were?

Astro:

You NAILED IT... Imagine you WERE fighting a "Holy War" (mutually EXCLUSIVE terms in my book to begin with) and you BEST offense was indeviduals BLOWING themselves up?!

Not only is that a NON-renewable resource but #(!) it's GOING to become a less reliable resource as time goes on!

Imagine the Youthe of that sect, being drilled about how good it is to get the 72 Virgins when you die, sounds good so far, but then they STOP, THINK about Achmed's family's house that got BLOWN UP 15 minutes after Achmed blew up the bus.... I beleive THAT will be a thorn in the recruiter's side to be sure...

I know exactly what you mean about "espousing # often enough and it becomes STEAK to some... Right up until they have to take a BITE out of it that is...

SAD really...

PEACE...
m...

There is no middle ground here..

Uni, are you channeling G.W. Bush right now? has he taken over your mind?

Yes, there is plenty of middle ground here, as MA pointed out. John Nada has made that clear. I will make it clear.

Theres some of us on niether side, neutral, and some ofr us, like me, violently oppose BOTH sides because Both sides are completely insane and irrational.

Thus, the rather lonely middle ground, but I find it is populated by a couple of others, so I shall be content by that.

Springer and Astro,

I'm with you guys call me up when you need me. I'm a reservist for the truth.

astro

Sorry, but by definition, the invasion WAS unilateral in foreign affairs terms. That has nothing to do with the number of countries that pledged forces at all. I have no problem with your misinterpretation though. It is entertaining to see other less literate members jump on your bandwagon.

To back up your case, and to educate other ATS readers, I would like to see you list the "about 30" countries which have participated in the 2003 invasion of Iraq.

US, UK, Spain, Australia, Poland. You complete the list, I will be much obliged for your effort.

Originally posted by MaskedAvatar
I would like to see you list the "about 30" countries which have participated in the 2003 invasion of Iraq.

US, UK, Spain, Australia, Poland. You complete the list, I will be much obliged for your effort.

I can't wait to see this. "err...the UK, err...Spain...errr...that little island just off the equator, they hold some sway you know? errr....Tesco International". Should be fun, I'll probably hear countries I've never heard of before.

Originally posted by Bandit
So, then you must be on GG:s..

No?

Where are you?

There is no middle ground here..

well me defending you was nothing to do with politics, it was to do with the usual gang of assholes getting together to bully and wind up people until they react and get banned. Meanwhile they come away as clean as a preachers sheets by saying "We were just entering into a debate". If debating is just generally insulting someone without using bad language so you can't be nailed for it then the meaning needs to be redefined for me. I am just glad to see that you remain calm enough from the assholes baiting not to react and get banned, that's all these sad people want. Don't give them the satisfaction.

This is why I defended you, not because I in anyway agree with you politics (we sometimes agree although you have some bizarre views my friend), so actually there IS a middle ground.

Some of you gays me me really sad..



The truht is out there, yet you cant see it.

Originally posted by FULCRUM
Some of you gays me me really sad..

I haven't seen any reference to sexual orientation on this topic before now, Fulcrum.



People see things different ways.

But there are also facts - measurable things. Like exactly which forces are now in Iraq as we speak, and exactly what evidence has been used to attribute the gassing of Kurds to Iraqi fighter planes.

Originally posted by FULCRUM
Some of you gays me me really sad..

The truht is out there, yet you cant see it.

man that's an insult to gay people to compare them to these bitter bastards, there is no comparison.

Gays are the same as everyone, there is good and bad everywhere, but as far as Bush Apologists go they are just all plain bad.



[Edited on 30-9-2003 by John Nada]

John Nada,

I see that now..

And i thank you for it.

And of course there is the middle ground, as the world isnt black and white.. there is also the shades of grey.. and many more 'colors'.

When i posted that 'post to you' i was still quite work up and under attack.

Sorry.

Keep it real man.

Sorry GUYS..

That was some typo..

Misplaced A in the place of U..