Women choosing career over children are 'half-persons' – Erdogan

Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has rejected the idea of emancipation of women through greater financial independence by saying that women who trade the role of a mother and a housewife for a career, are “half-persons.”

“A woman who abstains from maternity by saying ‘I am working’ means that she is actually denying her femininity.

“A woman who refuses maternity and gives up housekeeping faces the threats of losing her freedom. She is lacking and is a half [a person]

"I would recommend having at least three children,"

In 2014 Erdogan sparked outrage when he told a women’s rights conference that men and women are not equals and that treating them as such was “against nature.”

Erdogan’s Justice and Development Party (AKP) based its political platform on conservative Islamic traditions and uses religious justifications to advocate values and policies.

Source

This guy is the president of a country. His beliefs are apparently based on Islamic teachings. So, Muslims of ATS - how do you feel about this Muslim president saying women are only half-people? Admittedly, I've never read the Quran, so I don't know 100% what it says about women... But every time I hear something relating Islam and women, it's never good.

He's the leader of the country that will step into the big, UK sized hole that will be in the EU on Jun 24th.

Still a moron though.

a reply to: trollz

Clearly, he doesn't have an IQ of 140+.

a reply to: trollz

Not enough sandwiches are being made, apparently.



His country, his religion, his right to say it.

I wonder what he has to say about a man who has no children?

Sal

a reply to: trollz

a reply to: trollz

Sounds like right wingers have a new hero.

Erdogan is an idiot.

That's how I feel.


Yes Muslims can be idiots as well.

a reply to: trollz

John Oliver takes a swing at him every season or so.



I think that was the latest one. The guy is completely off his rocker. It's not the most insane thing he's said over the years lol

~Tenth

a reply to: trollz

Really, who cares?
It's their country, he's the president, let'em live the way they want to.

I'm really surprised at the degree of cultural intolerance these days. Erdogan, Turkey, Muslims......its their culture to live as they please. They aren't hurting us and can't compel us to wear the hijab or have babies or whatever.

Get over it.

a reply to: trollz


Ataturk (b 1881 - death 1938) the founder of the modern Turkish republic is turning in his grave - he wanted a modern Turkey with the separation of church & state

en.wikipedia.org...ürk#Civic_independence_and_the_Caliphate.2C_1924.E2.80.931925

Two other Islamic conferences were held in Mecca (1926) and Jerusalem (1931), but failed to reach a consensus.[78]

Turkey did not accept the re-establishment of the caliphate and perceived it as an attack to its basic existence; while Mustafa Kemal and the reformists continued their own way.[80]

On 8 April 1924, sharia courts were abolished with the law "Mehakim-i Şer'iyenin İlgasına ve Mehakim Teşkilatına Ait Ahkamı Muaddil Kanun".[81][82] The removal of the caliphate was followed by an extensive effort to establish the separation of governmental and religious affairs.

a reply to: trollz

Sounds like someone doesn't want females showing and proving that they are equally capable as their male counterparts in the work place.

He needs to step out of his tent and join the 21st century...and let the women decide.

Misogyny is alive and well on planet earth. As long as people like this man exist, we have little hope making the world a better place. Neverthless, consider the source.

So basically the solution is for two women to get married then theyd equal a whole person huh? Im sure theyd be happy to adopt many of the homeless orphaned children hell one may even choose to stay in the home and make herself a whole person...

of course by such an equation then... the woman not staying in the home would be the half a person. Quite the conudrum as far as math goes. As that means every man with a woman in the home is already half a person.

So whats the problem again?

Oh yeah bias and inequality and the reasoning? Control

The excuse? None... unless make believe counts there are theoretically imaginary numbers I suppose that goes along with such make believe systems of belief so in such imaginary worlds of concepts being forced into reality? Sigh shame on them placing make believe as adults on adults like they are some sort of children to command around.

You know it makes absolutely no sense people in their own creative make believe get called crazy yet when people do it by groups? Kill, opress, hate for generation after generation? Totally sane... um yeah sounds legit.

originally posted by: TonyS
a reply to: trollz

Really, who cares?
It's their country, he's the president, let'em live the way they want to.

I'm really surprised at the degree of cultural intolerance these days. Erdogan, Turkey, Muslims......its their culture to live as they please. They aren't hurting us and can't compel us to wear the hijab or have babies or whatever.

Get over it.

from my view point you are right.

you see no one understands us these days , its not like Islam forbids women from working , you have to look at it from different sides , i personally believe that not all jobs are for women , im all for women who work or practice special rare and important jobs , like doctors, nurses, chemists, teachers in all kind of subjects, physics etc. lots of professions that you can hardly find who can handle in our part of the world at least.

but when it come to a normal job in a government or any other job who both genders can handle , i prefer that a man who should take that job , and my reason is that in this way we will reduce unemployment , this man who took the job will feed his house , women who will not work normal jobs will help other men to feed their families.

take me as an example, as a husband my wife didnt like the idea of working because i was the one who was working and helping financially , but she did the best part of my life , and that is raise my kids, the first girl graduated as an interior designer and she just got married ( i call her my special one ) my son went to police academy and just graduated and became a Lieutenant , my other daughter also graduated with business administration degree , my youngest son this year joined another police academy and hopefully will follow his brother after three years.

guess what , i give my wife 90% credit for this , why you ask ? because she was there 100% for them while i was working all those years , this is the mother that i hoped for and thats what got and i thank God for that.

mothers are important in the house , they create good reliable generations , they are there for their kids all the time.

What's the problem? He's a good Muslim. Women are second class and good for nothing.

Really sad that Turkey nearly entered civilisation, but is now lurching back to bigotry and silliness.

originally posted by: Dr UAE

originally posted by: TonyS
a reply to: trollz

Really, who cares?
It's their country, he's the president, let'em live the way they want to.

I'm really surprised at the degree of cultural intolerance these days. Erdogan, Turkey, Muslims......its their culture to live as they please. They aren't hurting us and can't compel us to wear the hijab or have babies or whatever.

Get over it.

from my view point you are right.

you see no one understands us these days , its not like Islam forbids women from working , you have to look at it from different sides , i personally believe that not all jobs are for women , im all for women who work or practice special rare and important jobs , like doctors, nurses, chemists, teachers in all kind of subjects, physics etc. lots of professions that you can hardly find who can handle in our part of the world at least.

but when it come to a normal job in a government or any other job who both genders can handle , i prefer that a man who should take that job , and my reason is that in this way we will reduce unemployment , this man who took the job will feed his house , women who will not work normal jobs will help other men to feed their families.

take me as an example, as a husband my wife didnt like the idea of working because i was the one who was working and helping financially , but she did the best part of my life , and that is raise my kids, the first girl graduated as an interior designer and she just got married ( i call her my special one ) my son went to police academy and just graduated and became a Lieutenant , my other daughter also graduated with business administration degree , my youngest son this year joined another police academy and hopefully will follow his brother after three years.

guess what , i give my wife 90% credit for this , why you ask ? because she was there 100% for them while i was working all those years , this is the mother that i hoped for and thats what got and i thank God for that.

mothers are important in the house , they create good reliable generations , they are there for their kids all the time.

Sounds like you and your family have made quite a nice life, and im sure its wasnt as easy as the broad idealistic brush strokes painted looking at it in review.

Ive had my house demolished a few times without consent... things just happen to grow and learn from. So I threw myself into my work, then the next thing I knew, everyone half my age started becoming my children looking for advice in their uncertainty... so a man birthing children through his work to benefit more than just a family he may have made but didnt... as a father figure to others out of the nest younger adults is a perspective not often seen... many single men in my position prey on them instead of guide them. I dont feel like half a man having so many children I cant even count them... but I love them just the same encourage just the same try to point to an easier way than they are living when looked to for guidience... a lot of fatherless children out there these days.. but im not really a role model, just someone thats been wrung through the ringer and still positive about life and passionate about my work that it inspires.

So I dont see how women do not or cannot feel the same when choosing some role of work that they are passionate about and become mothers to the world as well through the work that they do.

Sure it gets lonely but I have a lot of children to spend time speaking with and watching them play. Theres beauty to everything when theres a perspective or choice of what one can appreciate... to all the women that are repressed and plucked into roles that they dont have a choice in? Then how can they see any beauty in the world... its a role of an animal a house pet, staring out the window of life cloistered and closeted away from living it loving it and embracing it as they choose to bring more beauty and love to it.

Its like if someone bought every single Rembrant and never displayed them... robbing the world of an artist, controlling their brush strokes if even allowed to have a brush. That is slavery, that isnt life. Thats a beast of child bearing burden not a wife.

a reply to: Dr UAE

To stay home and be a homemaker/mother was her choice, correct? She wasn't shamed, brainwashed or otherwise coerced into her role like some women are?

That's alot the hullabaloo is about... women should be able to have free choice as to what she is suited for. I think most women KNOW what they're suited to do. I personally was a homemaker by choice, but worked during lean times.

How would you feel if the men your daughters married INSISTED they stay home and forgo what they achieved with higher education? Somehow I doubt they would bow to that kind of pressure though.

There are MANY, MANY women who make it ALL work for them, including good parenting, especially when they have a husband who bears his portion of responsibility in raising a family. And I don't mean just the financial side when they both work and strive to provide the best for their family...that means giving BOTH of themselves to the endeavor. Needless to say it's alot tougher for a single parent though. You were very lucky/blessed to have what you and many others consider the "perfect" life in which your vision was realized.

Some men need to have chattel in their lives in order to feel like men.

The weaknesses of the inner self and the need to pass those weaknesses onto others because the weaker person does not have the strength to carry their own burdens.... has and always will be the bane of society.



Short version:

Sucks to be him.

My good friend and drinking buddy right here, who has an MBA from one of the world's top schools and works in international biz, says that this has nothing to do with superficial sex roles, what it is is: They are gearing up for war.

It's all over too, I see it, I get it. The Western sphere is propagandizing the same thing. More manly men and more breeding women.

To replace those who will be lost.

Why else would you need this? Hard working men to do what job? There are no jobs. And breeding women - for what? There are too many people. Same goes for most areas.

So why are they pushing all this?

They have a war planned. ISIS is their concocted enemy, which they very likely created.

And men will be needed to fight and women will be needed to breed more - to supplant the consumers who will be lost.

It has nothing to do with sex roles at all. Well except for how such things will benefit them.

My take on this - if the int'l biz community is watching this all, yeah they know what's up, they watch it all, for the money involved.

Somebody with an MBA from a top school who works in int'l biz? Yeah, Ima listen to this. And it does make sense - which is the scary part.

a reply to: FalseMove

Well an independent single person is more apt to protect their rights and interests... and those with some responsibility other than themself to lose are more apt to protect it in the human species and fight for the ideologies tooth and nail under whatever land rules their den.

Of course its base psychology.

Affluent independent single people typically see the world as the entire den and those perpetuating dichord in our entire family at large not an attack on the individual but on the entire population of humanity and the ecosystem itself.

Such people do not wish to draw lines of demarcation such as county, state, nor country but remove them... its no different than the same wish all children have until trained different... world peace and harmony, we have the technology but also have the greed and hate to prevent it by belief and unceasing war of ideology and separation... such ignorance on a golbal scale of leaders that only lead the entire world into hate pain loss and suffering.

The pander is there of course, and indeed its a tough situation... but if every single person made one choice to just stop and do something else? The murder would end the fear disappear and life would become what the world of umanity wants to make it and not to protect a brood or some belief or selfish gain simply because someone else points and says hey those people want to destroy it. Well some do... but the majority doesnt, and the majority knows its unsustainable to think such systems are sustainable.

But anyway high minded is often kicked aside for low level ideas of control to keep non beneficial systems in place instead of moving towards growth using current tech to allow it in favor of dragging heels that poison for maximum profit withhout any concern for loss of life in doing so... without really any progress forward.

Such as 45 different pain killing drugs ignoring science for other ones when one or two types of pain killing drugs suffice even the natural ones ignored for these systems that have become a detriment instead of a benefit to not only society but to life itself...

Self created problems in the whole by groups that are easily fixed but instead they are ignored... but oh wait and see says every person 'elected' or appointed to office... but what changes? Same place we were 60 years ago... war and inequality and human rights abuses world wide, into now micromanaging every single persons life to remove choice after choice into totalitarian ideal... some givernments totaliartian in total with an idea that consumerism and greed will build enough capital to push rights and freedoms to other countries... but at the other end? the ones called free are anything but that to where no one owns their bodies in the name of health organizations etc. sure health is important but forced this and forced that doesnt allow the body to evolve defenses in the organism...

Of course being on the cusp of science transitioning and transforming all life as we know it? Its a conundrum... much of the world stuck 1000s of years in the past choosing adult style make believe called god as all they claim to live and fight for... yet see sponge bob that a kid might live and fight for to watch as unimportant make believe.

Well, concepts are make believe until we put some force behind it... but with very poor fore sight other than how can we make X amount of dollars as the deciding factor.

Well thats the world...