umm...Bacon!

Now that your here, might I ask..

Is it possible (or worth it) to have a discussion about meat production's devastating impact on the environment?

C.C. is a hot topic around here; a lot of members here take climate change quite seriously. While I choose not to, I am all for cutting back on pollution and environmental destruction.

So why the black out? People always scream Big OIL, the evil one. But shouldn't we pick on the worst perpetrator?

I knew before that Agriculture isn't kind to the environment. But as you take a look beneath a tip of an iceberg, for ex:
Around 80% of Brazil's rainforest has been wiped out for grazing and planting GMO corn/soy that's all used to feed livestock..

Do people understand just how much energy and water it takes or the environmental toll it takes to put a juicy bacon cheeseburger on their plate?

Then there's poisonous run off, algae blooms, ethical issues...but.. crickets..

How can curbing Climate Change even be discussed without talking about Agriculture?

Now, I admittedly do eat factory meat (though, very little). Hypocrite you may yell. That's fine.

I'm willing to go down with ship if no one else cares....I'm just pointing out how silly this whole situation is. I guess it's more of a rant..

Thoughts? or ..bacon?

Well, Denmark (they love their bacon) are considering applying taxes to red meat, another member here also mentioned the Netherlands are considering it as well.

No doubt this is backed by an E.U Directive. Countries are not allowed to make fiscal decisions it appears, without the E.U ratifying a directive relating to such things.

First it was aerosols, then it was CO2, now it's Methane, what next? Vapour from e-cigarettes?

a reply to: Tucket

originally posted by: Cobaltic1978
Well, Denmark (they love their bacon) are considering applying taxes to red meat, another member here also mentioned the Netherlands are considering it as well.

No doubt this is backed by an E.U Directive. Countries are not allowed to make fiscal decisions it appears, without the E.U ratifying a directive relating to such things.

First it was aerosols, then it was CO2, now it's Methane, what next? Vapour from e-cigarettes?

I've heard Denmark is quite proactive with the "green" initiative...I guess higher prices are inevitable?

I wonder how the biggest meat eaters (North Americans), would take that?

I've heard Denmark is quite proactive with the "green" initiative...I guess higher prices are inevitable?
I wonder how the biggest meat eaters (North Americans), would take that?

um....are they taxing it as a 'sin tax"?
or are they taxing it to make sure it isn't horse meat?

Let me refresh your memory

en.wikipedia.org...

The 2013 meat adulteration scandal was a scandal in Europe; foods advertised as containing beef were found to contain undeclared or improperly declared horse meat, as much as 100% of the meat content in some cases,[1] and other undeclared meats, such as pork.

This was HUGE when it happened altho it's largely fading from memory. I wouldn't jump on the EU countries taxing something at face value because it's environmentally responsible. I'd follow the money and see who benefits first.

www.bbc.com...

I love my bacon, but would be completely in favor of anything that disincentivizes factory farming.

it's a totally insane business model that produces product inferior to traditional farming and depletes resources in massive quantities, as though clean water and nutrient-rich soil are just 'nice to have'.

How about this... a tax on factory-farmed goods, so that the producers pay more of the real cost of their business model? Yes, they would pass the cost on to consumers, but wouldn't that make farm products produced closer to home by smaller farms more attractive in price, relatively speaking?

I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THIS THREAD IS ABOUT!!!! BUT I LOVE BACON😊😊😊😊😊

I'M GOING TO BE COMPLETELY HONONEST...


EVERYONE IS SCREAMING! PLEASE TELL ME WHY I CARE?

originally posted by: Tucket

originally posted by: Cobaltic1978
Well, Denmark (they love their bacon) are considering applying taxes to red meat, another member here also mentioned the Netherlands are considering it as well.

No doubt this is backed by an E.U Directive. Countries are not allowed to make fiscal decisions it appears, without the E.U ratifying a directive relating to such things.

First it was aerosols, then it was CO2, now it's Methane, what next? Vapour from e-cigarettes?

I've heard Denmark is quite proactive with the "green" initiative...I guess higher prices are inevitable?

I wonder how the biggest meat e

aters (North Americans), would take that?

Luxembourg has us beat for meat consumption, but there's more of us so... I guess.

I can't speak for all Americans but I guess I'd tell them to take their sin tax and shove it up their...

Oh and their aerosol ban is slowly killing me, but you know, asthmatics have to take one for the team even though there are still cleaning agents out there that will put out more CFC's than I would in year just so someone can have a clean kitchen. Maybe they just figure asthmatics aren't productive enough to matter.

I think all environmentalists should have to live breathing through a straw, that would be fair. Let me have my red meat and bacon. I don't have that much longer anyway. Self-righteous, tree hugging jerks.

Factory farming is not only damaging to the planet, but to the health of humans, and of course, animals.

It has no place on this planet because it hurts everyone and everything.

Yes, humans did evolve to eat meat. I get that. But let's keep evolving and become herbivores. We are advanced enough now to give up our primitive vices.

I love my pets more that anything, and cows and pigs have the same feelings as they do. As we all do.

Giving up meat is not as hard as it seems. Saying to yourself "yea right, i can never give up meat!" is the same thing an addict says about giving up drugs.

There is no reason to eat meat other than pure enjoyment. Do you think harming yourself, animals, and the planet is worth a few minutes of pleasure? Isn't that kind of selfish?

If it was encouraged for people to raise chickens and rabbits for meat at home then a constant and robust supply of meat would be easy, cheap, and sustainable. On a slightly larger level raising pigs is also very easy, cheap, and sustainable. Not really something most people can do at their homes, but something that could definitely be done on a local co-op style basis in a fully sustainable way.

These animals provide good meat, don't require much (or a special type of) land, and eat food that either we don't eat, or that we throw away.

I'm not sure who is pushing this false idea that meat isn't sustainable, maybe the people trying to sell bug protein?

Try #2

I love animals and I love fur & a well tanned hide, I love a good rare chunk of beef.

Little factoid for folks...Homo Sapiens brain size increased once we began consuming meat. This is Anthropology 101.
You wouldn't be here to bitch about this without meat. You'd still be 1/2 in tree's scratching your ass and picking fleas.

www.livescience.com...

"I know this will sound awful to vegetarians, but meat made us human," said researcher Manuel Domínguez-Rodrigo, an archaeologist at Complutense University in Madrid.

Past research suggested prehuman hominids such as australopithecines may have eaten some meat. However, it is the regular consumption of meat that often is thought to have triggered major changes in the human lineage, the genus Homo, with this high-energy food supporting large human brains.

Yes factory-farms are awful and pig farms here in the US are a travesty of run-off pollution. Chicken farms come in second place in gruesome. However...without them only the rich would be able to afford meat. The cost of food in Norway and Sweden is astronomical. Taxing something already over priced due to economics makes no sense. It's not like the EU countries floating this idea are swamped with a protein being farmed in mass as an alternative.

So you have to ask, who's behind this?
What do they gain?

The last brilliant idea they has was accepting all refugees. That's working out well for them, don't you think?

BTW there are a ton of articles supporting increased meat consumption with brain size, if you didn't like mine go find another.
Cheers!

originally posted by: primespickle
I love my pets more that anything, and cows and pigs have the same feelings as they do. As we all do.

Having grown up on a farm...I have to say I completely agree on this point..

a reply to: Caver78
I wonder how much brain size matters..

We only use 10% of it.. probably less considering...

originally posted by: James1982
If it was encouraged for people to raise chickens and rabbits for meat at home then a constant and robust supply of meat would be easy, cheap, and sustainable. On a slightly larger level raising pigs is also very easy, cheap, and sustainable. Not really something most people can do at their homes, but something that could definitely be done on a local co-op style basis in a fully sustainable way.

These animals provide good meat, don't require much (or a special type of) land, and eat food that either we don't eat, or that we throw away.

I'm not sure who is pushing this false idea that meat isn't sustainable, maybe the people trying to sell bug protein?

The average cow consumes 30lbs of food a day and 150 liters of water give or take...

Raising your own livestock would be best...but you would need quite a bit of suitable land..

Still, much better idea than factory farming.

originally posted by: Caver78

Little factoid for folks...Homo Sapiens brain size increased once we began consuming meat. This is Anthropology 101.
You wouldn't be here to bitch about this without meat. You'd still be 1/2 in tree's scratching your ass and picking fleas.

I accept the fact that eating meat helped us evolve to where we are now. It was good that it happened. It served its purpose.

What I am saying is that we can now use our intelligence to continue to evolve in a way that isn't harmful to everyone and everything. We currently have access to an abundance of food that we didn't have 100 years ago. If we took all the food we feed to the animals we slaughter, we'd have even more food to eat.

Sure, we have intelligence, but we aren't really using it are we? How intelligent are we if we destroy our home planet with no backup plan, JUST because we are selfish and want something that tastes "yummy"?

Also, "scratching your ass and picking fleas" might seem like a meaningless existence to you, but is it any worse than the way we as humans live now? What are humans working towards exactly? Extinction! So how smart are humans really?

People live just fine without eating meat. There are plenty of foods that have protein in it (not just crickets ). If you want protein, there are other ways to get it too like in protein shakes.

Editing to add:

More and more people are becoming vegetarian/vegan. I believe that in the future there will be commercials selling "meat patches" and "meat gum", similar to nicotine patches/gum, to help ween those addicted to meat off it. In the future, children will be horrified to learn that humans once took satisfaction off eating the flesh of other sentient beings. It'll be something we look back on with disgust.

a reply to: primespickle

An extremely distant future if McDonald's & the Fast Food Industrial Complex have anything to say about it. I think modern humans will eradicate themselves before willingly giving up meat in order to save the planet & rainforests.

a reply to: Tucket

It is important to realise that the blanket term MEAT PRODUCTION being associated with climate change, is designed to make the foolish (more than eighty percent of human beings) believe that ALL meat production causes global harm. It is a lie.

Large scale industrial meat production does, but if you got rid of all the battery farms and big agriculture businesses, this crap simply would not happen. Smaller businesses running livestock do NOT cause the same devastation, especially when they source the feed for their animals either locally, or better yet, from their very own land.

I personally only eat meat reared here in the UK. MY eating habits do nothing to the environment that was not being done five hundred years ago or more, and we did not have a problem back then. Buy local meat, from local butchers, and you get the best of all worlds. You get thriving local businesses, good quality meat in your guts, and you do not have to take up granola munching.

Anyone stands between me and a pile of edible dead animal in my diet, and I will eat THEM instead. There are some things that one should never consider taking away from people. Tasty, tasty dead animals is one of them.

a reply to: Bigburgh

I'M GOING TO BE COMPLETELY HONONEST... EVERYONE IS SCREAMING! PLEASE TELL ME WHY I CARE?

You're Bacon Blinded...or its been 3 hours since your last bacon fix?