WAR: Despite Pressing Need Military Has Discharged 26 Gay Linguists

Despite a glaring need for Arabic and Farsi speakers, an analysis of the records show that the U.S. Army has discharged as many as 26 linguists between 1998 and 2004 for violations of the Pentagons don't ask, don't tell policy. The data was attained by the Center for the Study of Sexual Minorities in the Military under a Freedom of Information Act request.




On of the clear weakness identified by the attacks on 9/11 was the complete lack of understanding of the Arab world. Relegated to the backwaters of the NSA and the CIA by the cold war, the Army has embarked on a crash course of training Arabic speakers at its language institute on the Monterey peninsula. The initial course takes 63 weeks and is very intense. While the numbers seem slow, I have to wonder why they would discharge them? Better to reassign them to say the NSA or CIA until their service time is up rather than loosing their skills.

What's the logic here?

Let's see-

Being gay in some cultures is frowned upon (Arabic cultures)

this by itself lessens the effective use of any interpreter that is considered a lesser person

Being gay may subject the interpreter to conflicting loyalties

don't even pretend this is not a military worry

Rules are rules

for whatever its reasons the military has deemed these people risky enough to get rid of them

I don't imagine the military just popped up and acted. The US military has long years of experience in dealing with people that have diverse life styles and based upon experience has decided what is best for its mission.

This is like discovering someone has close family living in Gaza- you sure wouldn't want them guarding a visit by a ranking Israeli now would you?

Thats to bad...they shouldn't of gotton rid of em', They should put them in the front lines of the worst cities like Baghdad.

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This is what happens when adherence to bigotry outweighs the safety of the nation.

Sort of like Nazi Germans ousting Jewish scientists in WWII.
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It really is amazing the biggotry that rules life in this country. These guys don't walk around saying "hi im gay... can I translate for you". Some lowlife homophobe can't stand someone not like him doing a better job. Its this kind of hate that created this war to begin with. If this war is truly about national security which most of know it is not I think it would be a shame if biggotry would be more important than national security. Then again the way we treated the indians this comes as no shock to me.

I'm curious how many Arabic and Farsi speakers and/or interpreters the DOD still has even if a report was incorrect on the original number of interpreters discharged due to the "don't ask don't tell" policy. This is an issue of an individuals right to be who they are as a person, not one of specifics towards what their job was in the military. Though I don't know exactly how many of these interpreters we still have in active duty positions doing that task, I know there's too much happening in the world in regards to countries of perdominant Arab population for us not to have the personell to get the job done. And to give a time frame of 6 years for 25 people to be discharged of this reason is likely an average number now that "heterosexuals" in the military have an option of complaint towards gays and lesbians similar to sexual harassment. And though any complaint has the possibility of being a valid complaint or stipulation; it is just as possible that accusation is a false one. Unless a problem complained about in the military causes someones job to be completely impossible because they go crazy or because of physical harm, complaints dealing with issues like that should be dealt with the same way anything else is; punishment in its various forms. Discharging someone because somebody found out they're gay or lesbian is a sign of a weaker person. Nobody tells you you have to condone a persons sexual preference to do your job right. Someone who has that much of a problem with sexual preference that is not their own has a problem with themselves, not the other person. They don't live in the body and mind of the other person, so it is the same thing as turning someone down if they make a pass at you and your not attracted to them. Sexual preference is part of life, not a job. Sexual harassment can be a reason for someones job to end, not being gay or lesbian. I was in the military for a time. Not that many people had a problem with someone being gay or lesbian around them and them working on the same task. The problem is a PR one; and not even that makes being gay or lesbian wrong in the military. If you aren't attracted to someone of the same sex then that is the only thing that seperates you from possibly being just like someone who is.

[edit on 14-1-2005 by existence]

[edit on 14-1-2005 by existence]

If they want to kick people out of the military how about start with people who are a**holes, liars, lazy, cheats? Those just get promoted. You get some ignorant flat foot hiding safely behind a desk and dismissing people who are willing to put their lives in jeopardy to serve this country. Maybe these pieces of crap can pick up a gun and get out there with everyone else instead of whining about who someone likes.

I witnessed first hand the "flatfoot" at work in the military. Comically the biggest problem with clerical personell being out on the front lines is that nobody else has the patience to wait 7 months for a small ammount of paperwork to get through the system. The paperwork doesn't take that long to complete, its usually a "hurry up and wait" mentality causing stalls. The point is no, besides being a desk jocky most officers who make decisions like the ones that lead to the PR crap of "don't ask don't tell" wouldn't last long in a firefight. Just because I still have respect to this day doesn't mean I'm going to lie about reality.

26 wow, My question would be overall how many linguist are enlisted anyways and what ratio to what are straights to gay?

that are some stats there that I can't agree to be true, simply some hog wash cover up to fire them people.

How did they the military even assume they were gay?

Because seriously 26 is a big number, thats like saying 4/5th of our military is gay....

The military has always maintained that persons with unusual sexual mores are more open to blackmail. This is the same reason why married persons can be turned out of the military for having affairs. Like the Marine guards at the Moscow embassy, they become targets for espionage.

Having dealt with Islamic cultures for most of my adult life, I can tell you that there is unbelieveable bias against homosexuals in most Arabic culture. It would be an issue, particularly in the midst of sensitive negotiations.

More open to blackmail? You know what... a greedy person is open to blackmail. So is a weak person. That is serious stereotyping. What would anyone go to war for a country that thinks so little of its people?

Originally posted by dr_strangecraft
Having dealt with Islamic cultures for most of my adult life, I can tell you that there is unbelieveable bias against homosexuals in most Arabic culture. It would be an issue, particularly in the midst of sensitive negotiations.

I can see this point as would having a female translator. Then why not put them behind a desk analyzing signals? Thats where the real need is anyway. Sure we need field translators but other areas need them too.

how come there are Arabs speaking gays, I thought there are officially no gays in the Arab world ? Must really suck being born gay overthere and in the mandatory mosque sessions you hear that people like you should be thrown from tall buildings head down first....

Originally posted by Indy
More open to blackmail? You know what... a greedy person is open to blackmail. So is a weak person. That is serious stereotyping. What would anyone go to war for a country that thinks so little of its people?

You are exactly right. Which is why DOD reviews your credit rating before clearing you for sensitive materials. Desperate people, of all types, are open to blackmail and being suborned into espionage.

The USSR had a special department that tried to use homosexuals to get westerners into compromising positions, for photo opportunities. The mark was then offered a choice: cooperate, or have the negatives sent to your hometown newspaper.

I had a friend who was in Moscow in the 1980's on diplomatic business. His 'guides' were always the most incredible-looking women you ever saw, who always offered to come back to his hotel. After he repeatedly declined the offers, the girls were replaced with very handsome young men, who made the same offers . . .

I cannot remember the KGB term for them, but I think it meant "swans."

So yes, the military/intel bosses are operating from past experience.

what good would gay linguistics be anythow.... Theyd cry with every nail they broke on those big sharp pencils

2ndSEED
How did they the military even assume they were gay?

Probably from other soldiers who knew.

2ndSEED
Because seriously 26 is a big number, thats like saying 4/5th of our military is gay....

- What? Either I am missing something or your math is incredibly bad.

If I was a grunt stuck in the middle of a dark streed in Fallujah, I'd be more than happy to have a gay linguist with me, than Oliver North.

The soliders in question violated the don't ask don't tell law. From my understanding, they cannot be asked so they must have let thier orientation be known and thus were dismissed.