Who Stole Whose Design

Nobody needs a conspiracy to figure out the B-1 and the Tu-160 are nearly identical, save for the fact that Tu-160 was basically scaled up.

So the question is, who stole the other design, Did Rockwell steal Russia's, or vice versa?

Thoughts?

originally posted by: BigTrain
Nobody needs a conspiracy to figure out the B-1 and the Tu-160 are nearly identical, save for the fact that Tu-160 was basically scaled up.

So the question is, who stole the other design, Did Rockwell steal Russia's, or vice versa?

Thoughts?

Here's an old ATS thread.
ATS B1 VS TU-160

Russia has a history of copying American designs.
B-29
Space shuttle
I'm sure there are more.

a reply to: BigTrain

Both sides have a history of copying one another, as Bluetone22 rightly say's the Buran was a near identical copy of the US space shuttle, though it had more in common with the current military US shuttle in that it was envisages as a super high altitude nuclear bomber by the Soviet's.

The Russians also copyed as Bluetone22 also points out the B29 US bombers after the second world war but it was never a one sided exchange as both sides have copied one another extensively throughout the cold war period and even today there is so much shared technology that what you are looking at is basically both copy and convergance of design.

And let's not forget they both used Nazi science in there ultimately doomed race for supremacy, but a race that managed to keep the peace as each side stayed in close parity with there opposition preventing either side from gaining a clear tactical advantage right up to the fall of the soviet union, in the later period the soviets actually bought in bulk IC (micro chip's) on the black market as they could not produce what the silicon valley could though Chinese outsourcing proved a very handy back door for them and a way around international trade control and sanctions for the less than respectably profiteers of the cold war.

originally posted by: BigTrain
Nobody needs a conspiracy to figure out the B-1 and the Tu-160 are nearly identical, save for the fact that Tu-160 was basically scaled up.
So the question is, who stole the other design, Did Rockwell steal Russia's, or vice versa?
Thoughts?

That's an interesting question.

Former president, Jimmy Carter, announced the arrival of the B-1 long before he should have. He took hell for doing so. In retrospect, there are those who believe he did it to head-off the Tu-160, which was expected in the skies by the Pentagon long before it actually was. Had such occurred, it would have made the US and NATO look bad.

This was basically at a critical point in the Cold War. Richard Nixon, who was now long gone, had funded a whole host of advanced vehicles - ground, air and otherwise - but that were still years away.

In retrospect, the B-1 was nothing like what was announced by Carter. Not even close.
Rockwell Aerospace has now long since disappeared but... their B-1 still flies.

There is a B-1 right out in front of the US Air Force Museum at Warner-Robbins, Georgia.

...

a reply to: BigTrain

Well, the saying goes ... the US got their German scientists, Britain a few, France fewer and Russia almost as many as the US. The two V2 planners, Werner von Braun went to the US and was the "inspiration" for all US vehicles, and his counter part, who many think was the actual "genius" behind it all ... went to Russia.

So, basically it's all stolen from Germans ... just like the US treasury is made up of stolen German gold. Which the US has made a lot of Hollywood films, to say the Germans stole the gold in the first place, so nobody blames the US for stealing it from the thieves.

So ... the bottom line is, I would trust the Germans to do it properly, the Russians to calculate it properly and the Americans to steal it, and have the money to build it faster than the others.

The US is spying all over the world, even on individuals through proxy governments ... it's also providing education to radical population (Russia too, I would bet), and I'd "bet" my 2 cents ... that the reason for this, is the US's mental bankruptcy ... it's hoping to get another "wave" of foreign genius into the playing field.

originally posted by: bjarneorn
a reply to: BigTrain

Well, the saying goes ... the US got their German scientists, Britain a few, France fewer and Russia almost as many as the US. The two V2 planners, Werner von Braun went to the US and was the "inspiration" for all US vehicles, and his counter part, who many think was the actual "genius" behind it all ... went to Russia.

So, basically it's all stolen from Germans ... just like the US treasury is made up of stolen German gold. Which the US has made a lot of Hollywood films, to say the Germans stole the gold in the first place, so nobody blames the US for stealing it from the thieves.

So ... the bottom line is, I would trust the Germans to do it properly, the Russians to calculate it properly and the Americans to steal it, and have the money to build it faster than the others.

The US is spying all over the world, even on individuals through proxy governments ... it's also providing education to radical population (Russia too, I would bet), and I'd "bet" my 2 cents ... that the reason for this, is the US's mental bankruptcy ... it's hoping to get another "wave" of foreign genius into the playing field.

I think your "grumpy old man" moniker might be doing you some justice here. While a lot of the technology was "stolen" from the Germans, rocket technology is/was be no means new, but as with any industry you certainly want your most experienced and mature engineers on any given project. But to go on further and say that the rockets and missiles of today are still "stolen German technology" is a bit ludicrous. Similarly, I wouldn't say that Firestone is simply stolen Caveman technology. They helped lay a strong foundation, then the U.S. built on it.

Furthermore, to say the U.S. treasury is nothing but German gold is also absurd. So one nation has somehow mysteriously amassed enough gold for a vastly larger nation to exist on solely for the past near-century? Nothing to do with the rest of the U.S. economic apparatus - it's inventions, its corporations, its people, etc?

And somehow Russians get credit for "calculating properly" when they have one of the shoddiest performance records for modern military technology, barring a certain venerable assault rifle?

Essentially your post whittles down to "U.S. is the rotted remains of the Nazi Empire, full of morally decrepit leaders and hundreds of millions of people which are stupid for no other reason than being U.S. citizens, while the rest of the world is on a pedestal simply because it is not the U.S."

Your views do not make sense logically, and seem to convey a number of logical fallacies and bias.

Take that as criticism, or a comforting reminder that the world simply isn't as bad as you may think it is.