The Subconscious Is My Spirituality

In some ways, I have really just not felt like I know what I think about much of anything for a while now. It's funny, that itself can take on different meanings, positive, negative, and neutral, and it has for me over time. Yet if there is one thing that has really persisted, that I can say is a real belief of mine, it is the wisdom and spiritual nature of the subconscious. I also do not think that the subconscious is a 'singular entity,' but rather that it is a general term which refers to multiple layers of our Being beneath conscious awareness. Consider a sphere which consists of smaller spheres within itself approaching the center. This is a good way to visualize how I think of the Self. Your true, highest Self is the absolute center of this sphere. The closer you approach it, the 'higher' you go, the more spiritual.

Consider the outer boundary of the sphere to be where conscious awareness starts, and goes some depth in. Everything deeper than that is the 'subconscious.' There are various layers of this subconscious, various layers of our Self, and I think these go along with various levels of Reality. Thus the subconscious reality of dreams is not 'unreal,' but rather it is a different level of reality, more psychic/mental in nature. Yet the typical level of dreams is not the only level of the subconscious. I think these deeper levels of the subconscious can also be reached through dreams, perhaps among other ways, and when experienced are undeniably of a fundamentally higher nature, which can be characterized in part by extreme intensity. This corresponds to a deeper sphere in the multi-layered sphere described earlier.

Another thing to think of, is that these deeper levels of Self are in a way living their own lives, in their own realities. Yet it's all one Self, it's all within you, and so there's a sort of reflective give and take between the levels. Your physical self interacts and affects your physical environment, just as the various levels of your subconscious self interacts and affects with their respective environments. What is done on these deeper levels of the subconscious, and its effects on those levels of reality, are reflected among themselves and into the physical. Yet at the same time what we do in the physical reflects back 'up' to the layers towards the true Self. So it's a reciprocal process. I think perhaps the spiritual path consists, in part anyways of bringing those deeper levels of the subconscious into conscious awareness. And perhaps this can in part consist of giving your conscious mind up to the subconscious. And this is the meaning of losing the self/ego described in religions, not as an end in and of itself but rather as a means to opening up to the depth and wisdom of the subconscious.

originally posted by: TheJourney
In some ways, I have really just not felt like I know what I think about much of anything for a while now. It's funny, that itself can take on different meanings, positive, negative, and neutral, and it has for me over time. Yet if there is one thing that has really persisted, that I can say is a real belief of mine, it is the wisdom and spiritual nature of the subconscious. I also do not think that the subconscious is a 'singular entity,' but rather that it is a general term which refers to multiple layers of our Being beneath conscious awareness. Consider a sphere which consists of smaller spheres within itself approaching the center. This is a good way to visualize how I think of the Self. Your true, highest Self is the absolute center of this sphere. The closer you approach it, the 'higher' you go, the more spiritual.

Consider the outer boundary of the sphere to be where conscious awareness starts, and goes some depth in. Everything deeper than that is the 'subconscious.' There are various layers of this subconscious, various layers of our Self, and I think these go along with various levels of Reality. Thus the subconscious reality of dreams is not 'unreal,' but rather it is a different level of reality, more psychic/mental in nature. Yet the typical level of dreams is not the only level of the subconscious. I think these deeper levels of the subconscious can also be reached through dreams, perhaps among other ways, and when experienced are undeniably of a fundamentally higher nature. This corresponds to a deeper sphere in the multi-layered sphere described earlier.

Another thing to think of, is that these deeper levels of Self are in a way living their own lives, in their own realities. Yet it's all one Self, it's all within you, and so there's a sort of reflective give and take between the levels. Your physical self interacts and affects your physical environment, just as the various levels of your subconscious self interacts and affects with their respective environments. What is done on these deeper levels of the subconscious, and its effects on those levels of reality, are reflected among themselves and into the physical. Yet at the same time what we do in the physical reflects back 'up' to the layers towards the true Self. So it's a reciprocal process. I think perhaps the spiritual path consists, in part anyways of bringing those deeper levels of the subconscious into conscious awareness. And perhaps this can in part consist of giving your conscious mind up to the subconscious. And this is the meaning of losing the self/ego described in religions, not as an end in and of itself but rather as a means to opening up to the depth and wisdom of the subconscious.

Have you considered that your sense of confusion abides in the fact that you have accepted the subconscious/subtle mind as the pinnacle of consciousness? Seek that which abides beyond the subconscious mind, you are a step away from true understanding and self-realization.

Consider this, your perception of consciousness being a circle with a dot in the center, that dot being the pinnacle of singularity, is an absolutely great analogy, but, try going deeper as to understand what makes that very singularity, what nature gave rise to that dot, that center. When you come to realize the singularity/dot is merely another circle encompassing the Absolute Nature of reality you will truly understand your Self and it's true essence and therefore understand Creation and the Creator. You display great wisdom and understanding. Blessings to you my friend!

a reply to: TheJourney

I also do not think that the subconscious is a 'singular entity,' but rather that it is a general term which refers to multiple layers of our Being beneath conscious awareness. Consider a sphere which consists of smaller spheres within itself approaching the center.

Just personally I believe these other "spheres" or barriers to be placed their in our mind and psyche by the conditioning we all received from the world around us in our formative years. They are designed to block you from your true self. Nested propaganda from the state through education, media such as TV and yes, even the Pulpit.

Like peeling back lathers of an onion we wrestle with these foreign notions most of our lives, misled and stymied from further development by their "roadblock" nature.

When they are shattered it is with awareness from somewhere that that notion we have always held to be sancta mount is false. Like breaking glass they fall away that quick as we become more aware.

a reply to: TheJourney

My Subconscious is me and my Spirituality. The me part is just a mouth piece for it.

For the most part I would say that we are in total agreeance with your proposition(s). Nice thread and well composed S&F.

Kind Regards
Myselfaswell

originally posted by: EviLCHiMP

originally posted by: TheJourney
In some ways, I have really just not felt like I know what I think about much of anything for a while now. It's funny, that itself can take on different meanings, positive, negative, and neutral, and it has for me over time. Yet if there is one thing that has really persisted, that I can say is a real belief of mine, it is the wisdom and spiritual nature of the subconscious. I also do not think that the subconscious is a 'singular entity,' but rather that it is a general term which refers to multiple layers of our Being beneath conscious awareness. Consider a sphere which consists of smaller spheres within itself approaching the center. This is a good way to visualize how I think of the Self. Your true, highest Self is the absolute center of this sphere. The closer you approach it, the 'higher' you go, the more spiritual.

Consider the outer boundary of the sphere to be where conscious awareness starts, and goes some depth in. Everything deeper than that is the 'subconscious.' There are various layers of this subconscious, various layers of our Self, and I think these go along with various levels of Reality. Thus the subconscious reality of dreams is not 'unreal,' but rather it is a different level of reality, more psychic/mental in nature. Yet the typical level of dreams is not the only level of the subconscious. I think these deeper levels of the subconscious can also be reached through dreams, perhaps among other ways, and when experienced are undeniably of a fundamentally higher nature. This corresponds to a deeper sphere in the multi-layered sphere described earlier.

Another thing to think of, is that these deeper levels of Self are in a way living their own lives, in their own realities. Yet it's all one Self, it's all within you, and so there's a sort of reflective give and take between the levels. Your physical self interacts and affects your physical environment, just as the various levels of your subconscious self interacts and affects with their respective environments. What is done on these deeper levels of the subconscious, and its effects on those levels of reality, are reflected among themselves and into the physical. Yet at the same time what we do in the physical reflects back 'up' to the layers towards the true Self. So it's a reciprocal process. I think perhaps the spiritual path consists, in part anyways of bringing those deeper levels of the subconscious into conscious awareness. And perhaps this can in part consist of giving your conscious mind up to the subconscious. And this is the meaning of losing the self/ego described in religions, not as an end in and of itself but rather as a means to opening up to the depth and wisdom of the subconscious.

Have you considered that your sense of confusion abides in the fact that you have accepted the subconscious/subtle mind as the pinnacle of consciousness? Seek that which abides beyond the subconscious mind, you are a step away from true understanding and self-realization.

Consider this, your perception of consciousness being a circle with a dot in the center, that dot being the pinnacle of singularity, is an absolutely great analogy, but, try going deeper as to understand what makes that very singularity, what nature gave rise to that dot, that center. When you come to realize the singularity/dot is merely another circle encompassing the Absolute Nature of reality you will truly understand your Self and it's true essence and therefore understand Creation and the Creator. You display great wisdom and understanding. Blessings to you my friend!

Your words were very useful and interesting. Thank you!

a reply to: TheJourney

One other thing to ponder upon, by your words it can be assumed that you are completely aware of your subconscious mind, you have witnessed it through introspection. Now with that understood, since you were able to perceive the subconscious mind you then can correctly presume that "you" are not the subconscious mind but an even deeper separate entity all together. What nature is that entity? Here's a hint to meditate upon; abide in that emptiness beyond the subconscious mind, that emptiness that is always there prior to subtle thoughts giving rise and between their arising. Something miraculous can be discovered in that emptiness.

When my being experienced the nature of that emptiness it was brought to tears of joy, tears of relief, tears of understanding as to what we really are. It's so beautiful, truly so so beautiful. Blessings to you and your seeking! My being is ecstatic with joy for you!

Some people seem to think that reducing the spiritual to the unconscious mind invalidates it. But those of us in this thread seem to know better - it liberates it. Putting the conscious mind and the unconscious mind into accord is the sacred marriage. It is like putting a ship and the sea into accord, to chart a course to Love.

If the vast collective unconscious is a sea, then the ego-self would be an island. At the bottom, all islands are connected. At the surface, they are separated by time and space.

Or a forest, where the roots of trees mingle under the surface.

“Out of my experience, such as it is (and it is limited enough) one fixed conclusion dogmatically emerges, and that is this, that we with our lives are like islands in the sea, or like trees in the forest. The maple and the pine may whisper to each other with their leaves. . . .But the trees also commingle their roots in the darkness underground, and the islands also hang together through the ocean’s bottom. Just so there is a continuum of cosmic consciousness, against which our individuality builds but accidental fences, and into which our several minds plunge as into a mother-sea or reservoir.” -William James

Our true self lies in the physical, that is what rises up through the unconscious. It is through the physical that connections are made.
Life is what spirituality is all about. You would deny all that is beautiful and somehow fail to see that you need to escape into reality not from it.

a reply to: TheJourney

Wow! I couldn't have said it better myself. Been meditating for about a year and half now and have come to the same conclusion. Of course, using analogies like the onion is only a way to try and express what it is.

You mentioned a circle with a dot in the middle... Which goes along with my idea (and others) that our electromagnetic field we generate, is in the shape of a torus. Check out THRIVE...interesting stuff there...also there's some really interesting stuff on the Spirit Science channel if you wanna just sniff around there. I realize everyone has their opinions about things, but in my mind, when it comes to topics like this there is hardly any concrete proof that one can stand on as to how it all fits together. IMO.

So, I search, take a little here, a little there...It has lead me down some really cool and enlightening paths...for me.

Great post! There is so much more to us than we realize, at least for now, but it looks like things are changing...awareness is growing for scores of people around the world.

a reply to: TheJourney

"Consider a sphere which consists of smaller spheres within itself approaching the center."

a reply to: BlueMule

Consider this beautiful life that surrounds you.
It is all you need...but it is never enough.
This is a sad thread...a life denying thread.
Spirituality is all around you but you are blind.

a reply to: midicon

Actually, you have it backwards. This is a life-affirming thread.

This is how a human being can change:

there’s a worm addicted to eating
grape leaves.

Suddenly he wakes up,
call it grace, whatever, something
wakes him, and he’s no longer
a worm.

He’s the entire vineyard,
and the orchard too, the fruit, the trunks,
a growing wisdom and joy
that doesn’t need
to devour.

-Rumi

a reply to: BlueMule

I will take your Rumi...and raise you a Nietzsche...


" We are made of flesh, and not spirit, and our physical needs dictate our values and desires. A sick or dissatisfied person will claim to be essentially spirit, and will create a God and an afterlife as distractions from the pains of this life."

" What we call "self" is nothing more than the body, and it underlies all reason, spirit, and sense, directing our passions and our thoughts. Those who assert that the self is really spirit are "despisers of the body" who have a sick body that hates life and wants to die."

" Those who preach about an eternal life preach that life is suffering, but that it must be endured in preparation for the afterlife. As such, they are preaching a renunciation of this life, and so are preachers of death "


Just having fun here. I couldn't care less about Nietzshe or Rumi.

You have nothing for me really...you are a closed mind. It's very strange how everything has been turned upside down. The opposite of what it should be. Or maybe not so strange.
In a way I was once where you are although to be honest, I was never as disingenuous as you. But it's no big deal.

a reply to: midicon

Wow. You certainly are casual with your insults and judgments. If that's your idea of fun, I would hate to see your idea of work.

Nietzsche respected the honesty of the mystic more than the philosopher. This is a thread about mysticism, and most (if not all) of us here, with the possible exception of you, have had profound mystical experiences which give us insight into what we are talking about here. Our experiences as mystics entitles us to talk about this. What entitles you? No one here is being disingenuous, with possible exception of, again, you.

Unless you would care to share with us your profound mystical experiences which inform your perspective on mysticism, I will consider you the uninitiated non-mystic trying to tell a room full of initiated mystics what's what. So please, do share.

I'm sorry but I don't understand how this thread is 'life-denying' at all...you're obviously projecting some notion you heard elsewhere and didn't like onto my words...

a reply to: BlueMule

Wow. You certainly are casual with your insults and judgments. If that's your idea of fun, I would hate to see your idea of work.

I liked that reply. Sometimes I forget myself and say what I think but I do apologise for my lack of tact.

I have never denied or decried anothers experience...it is what it is. I don't care who Nietzsche respected, my fun was really about the idea of sending back a quote. If you want to quote, quote thyself.

There have been times in my life when I wore those labels...alchemist, shaman, mystic...and how I loved Jung. Even now it is difficult to shake him off.

There has been no insight in this thread really.

Our experiences as mystics entitles us to talk about this. What entitles you? No one here is being disingenuous, with possible exception of, again, you.

Self styled mystics wear loosely sprinkled faery dust on psychic sleeves.

Unless you would care to share with us your mystical experiences which inform your perspective.

I don't know about that...mystical. So casual with those words. I want to give you something but I don't know how to.


Lastly...

That quote from Tolkien about Legolas was strangely relevant. I have used that seabird call in poetry...although I am not a poet. But more than that...it is an expression of what it is for me. That is, I understand the metaphor but the sound of a gull on the shore also stirs a feeling in me, a memory from my childhood. I think I should try and write poetry.


Sorry about jumping all over you...by way of atonement I will endeavour to stay out of these type of threads.

Regards

midicon

originally posted by: TheJourney
I'm sorry but I don't understand how this thread is 'life-denying' at all...you're obviously projecting some notion you heard elsewhere and didn't like onto my words...

You are right the OP is not life denying. My mind wandered off on some replies. That quote from Nietzsche, as I said was just a bit of fun. You might take something from it though.
I agree with a lot of the the OP.

Apologies.

a reply to: midicon

Apology accepted.

I'm not surprised the quote was relevant, I was inspired to post it.

Yes, I too believe it would be a good idea for you to stay out of these kinds of threads. It seems a fitting atonement. At least, for now.

a reply to: BlueMule

Judgemental words my friend.

The door is always open, no matter the person who peeks in from the other side. Who were you before your mystical experiences ? Who are you now ?

Entitlement is only for those who imagine there to be a seat to be won in the first place. No one is entitled... All is given freely, to those that see and those that don't.

a reply to: preludefanguy

It wasn't my idea for him to atone, nor was the manner of his atonement my idea. I am just agreeing with it, because he was probably inspired to do it. I would not have taken it upon myself to suggest it.

It will give him a chance to write some poetry, and to remember himself, so that perhaps when he comes back to these kinds of theads he will bring his tack. And hopefully, some poetry.

And, I did accept his apology. So, I think I am less judgmental than you think.