ATS = Altruism, Trust & Sincerity

The above phrase sits proudly in large letters near the top of the screen. While I endorse the values wholeheartedly and am a supporter of ATS, I find it interesting that the forum would promote values so close to mainstream masonic values while being populated by a number of people that could be described as anti-masonic.

If these anti-masons are against what freemasonry stands for, then are they against what ATS stands for? There are clearly a number of similarities between the two organizations as evidenced by the banner headline.

Just wondering what others thought about this spin on things?

www.abovetopsecret.com...

This is what everyone thinks and this is what the 'offiical' reason for it is.

Thanks for the link FF. Interesting reading and confirms to me that ATS are endorsing "masonic values".*

I think these values should be endorsed by everyone and, as a member, I'm happy with the direction the forum is going.

These values are a GOOD thing, not a BAD thing, and should be supported by everyone.

*Of course they are not exclusively masonic, but I figured that if freemasonry is responsible for all the symbols it uses it might as well the credit for the value system. Just don't mention the Bible anyone

Only 34° ATSers would know the true secrets of this forum. (I’m afraid Simon, SO and Springer are only 33° )

Personally, I hold Masonic values above biblical values. (less wars) I wish masons would embrace its revolutionary past and once again get involve in politics. Events like 9/11 and widespread killing of the defenseless worldwide requires revolutionary ideas.

Although I admire the good work the masons are doing, their charity work amounts to little more that a Band-Aid on society’s woes. vivre la revolution!!!


[edit on 17/11/06 by ConspiracyNut23]

I am not anti-masonic, but I would like to suggest that the values outlined in the Altruism-Trust-Sincerety thread are certainly not exclusively masonic; and if masonry shares these values then great-- but it did not invent them* What I mean is that these same ideas should be found in the round table discussion of any liberal university worth its merit-- does this mean the university is masonic? Certainly not* Perhaps thousands of philosiphical discussion groups adhere to these principles, are they masonic?

While I believe Freemasonry is a fine, upstanding organization it is perhaps a bit presumptious to say a forum is pro-masonic because it espouses the same values that masonry holds* The Rainbow Family of Living Light hold the same values, could I say Ats is pro Rainbow? The Rosicrucians hold the same values as well, could it be said ATS is pro Rosecross?

These are just "goodthinking" values, and it is good for any group to think this way, but it does not mean that just bc two groups hold the same ideals, that they are sympathetic one to another

Originally posted by Trinityman
I find it interesting that the forum would promote values so close to mainstream masonic values while being populated by a number of people that could be described as anti-masonic.

I don't think the majority of people who are labeled as "anti-Masonic" are actually against the Masons. Due to the secretive nature of the Masons, most "anti-Masons" are not anti-Freemasonry, just anti-ignorance. Human nature causes us to hate not-knowing, so anti-Masons just hate the fact that they don't know what the Masons are about. (Most know what the Masons claim to be about, but with all the secrecy it makes people suspicious of the true nature of the Masons.)

Many masons are still very involved in politics, just not in a revolutionary manner.. but i have found that some masons, such as those who join the masons in order to become shriners, have little to no interest in politics. For them masonry is about spiritual growth, and in that growth helping others.. both in the ease of suffering on the material plane, and in helping others in their own spiritual growth.

Whats more, i find that very little to do with masonry, is exclusively masonic.. indeed it is very much the opposite.. masonry has attempted to take those virtues and values that are the very best of the human condition and bring them together in one place where men can discuss, debate and share them.

And lastly, i have to agree that many who are labeled anti-masonic are not so.. but rather anti-conspiracy, and they have simply not had the chance, or taken the chance, to investigate masonry to see it for what it is.. that being a system of values and ideals that can help a man find what is at his deepest core, to evaluate what he finds, disgard that which is unnessisary, and to strengthen that which makes good men into better men

Originally posted by Spores From Space
I am not anti-masonic, but I would like to suggest that the values outlined in the Altruism-Trust-Sincerety thread are certainly not exclusively masonic; and if masonry shares these values then great-- but it did not invent them* What I mean is that these same ideas should be found in the round table discussion of any liberal university worth its merit-- does this mean the university is masonic? Certainly not* Perhaps thousands of philosiphical discussion groups adhere to these principles, are they masonic?

Excellent points. Being aligned with certain values doesn't make you a member of a particular society or organisation, or sympathetic with their objectives.

Good causes share similar points of views, that's about as far as a comparison between Masonry and ATS goes.
Besides, the goals for ATS and Masonry are generally different from each other.

reply to post by an3rkist


All one needs to do is Google Freemasonry, or visit any Grand Lodge of Freemasonry website around the world to find out what Freemasonry is all about. The fact that we hold our meeting behind closed doors, doesn't make us a Secret Society. This country was built by men who were Freemasons, not just our Founding Fathers, but Founding Fathers in a huge number of towns and cities in not only the United States, but also in other countries around the world. Anyone who doesn't research the truth about Freemasonry is surely among the philosophically ignorant. True Freemasonry is an organization of Truth, Trust and Brotherly-Love of the highest order.