Guantanamo Causes Terrorism - UK

Finally we have it:

America shares some blame for driving the muslims to commit acts of terror.

US prison at Guantanamo Bay is one of the causes of terror.

That criticism came from British Government.

This is a polite way of blaming United States for partly being responsible for modern terrorism.

BBC

Thursday, 12 October 2006

Guantanamo Bay should be closed down, Foreign Secretary Margaret Beckett has said during a speech on human rights.
The US detention camp did as much to radicalise new extremists as it did to promote security, Mrs Beckett said.
She added: "The continuing detention without fair trial of prisoners is unacceptable in terms of human rights."
Some 450 terror suspects are thought to be detained at the camp in Cuba - criticised for holding inmates without trial and for abuse allegations.
Launching the Foreign Office's ninth annual human rights report, Mrs Beckett said: "As the prime minister has said, we believe that camp should close.
"The continuing detention without fair trial of prisoners is unacceptable in terms of human rights, but it is also ineffective in terms of counter-terrorism.
"It is widely argued now that the existence of the camp is as much a radicalising and destabilising influence as it is a safeguard to security."
Since the camp started taking foreign prisoners in 2002, it has attracted widespread criticism.
United Nations human rights investigators have called for the camp's closure and Lord Chancellor Lord Falconer has called it a "shocking affront to democracy".
UK prime minister Tony Blair has called it an "anomaly".
The US has said it is a matter of security and military necessity in the "war on terror" and said inmates are treated humanely.
Mrs Beckett also disputed a report in the medical journal The Lancet that as many as 655,000 Iraqi civilians had been killed since the war began in 2003.
"No-one disputes that there have been many deaths in Iraq and all of those deaths are regrettable and tragically many have been deaths of civilians," she said.
"That doesn't mean one has to accept every figure that someone comes up with."
She said the British government did not keep official figures for Iraqi civilians, but got information from the Iraqi government and others.
"The [Lancet] report gives a figure which is orders of magnitude different from that which comes from any other source," she said.
US President George Bush said on Wednesday the figure was "not credible" - he has previously put the civilian death toll in Iraq at 30,000.
Mrs Beckett also said human rights abuses in Iraq and Afghanistan were not an indictment of the prime minister's foreign policy.
"In neither of those countries was it the case that human rights abuses were acknowledged or opposed or investigated and dealt with [under the previous regimes].
"It's dreadful that those abuses continue, but they continue at a time when we are trying our utmost to bring them to an end."


news.bbc.co.uk...

Therefore, what Britain is saying is that the threat of terrorism is partly to be
blamed on President Bush for keeping the jail open.

President's Guantanamo prison is pushing Arabs towards terrorism.

If there is any future terrorim and an attack on US or UK then we know what drove the Al Qaeda to do it: Camp X-Ray.

I am totally shocked that Britain would openly say such a thing about its ally !

Beckett could have told this to Bush privately.




[edit on 12-10-2006 by mr conspiracy]

Originally posted by mr conspiracy
US prison at Guantanamo Bay is one of the causes of terror.

Un-freak'n-believable!

THAT is the kind of thinking of some elected leaders in the west?? THAT is an example of the best minds we have? God help us.

Terrorism was around LONG before GITMO. It'll be around long after GITMO is gone. GITMO didn't cause terror ... except perhaps it strikes terror into the tiny hearts of the murderous terrorists.

Mr C dont be shocked thats the difference between us and you our politicians do sometimes speak the truth and are free to do so unlike your American counter parts. And Flyers the article did not say it was the cause of terrorism it said the unjust way they are held and conditions of the inmates would provide momentum for radical groups. Its quite simple if you treat people like animals then they will act like animals.

Originally posted by magicmushroom
if you treat people like animals then they will act like animals.

Terrorists are already animals .. murderous animals.

If they want to be treated as human beings then they should not have treated their fellow human beings as animals to begin with.

But whatever ... they are treated just fine at GITMO. They are reaping what they themselves planted. In fact, they are being treated better than they deserve.

GITMO isn't causing terrorism. GITMO is housing terrorists so they can't strike again. And frankly, terrorists will use ANY excuse to kill ... anything from GITMO; to how a person worships; to Danish cartoons; etc.

Just because the terrorists don't like GITMO is NOT a reason to close it down.

Originally posted by FlyersFan
If they want to be treated as human beings then they should not have treated their fellow human beings as animals to begin with

But whatever ... they are treated just fine at GITMO. They are reaping what they themselves planted. In fact, they are being treated better than they deserve.

Watch "The road to Guantanamo" and then say that. These guys were completely innocent and treated horrifically without trial. Do you know why they don't try them? Because there is no evidence against them. This is why people are pssed off about it.

[edit on 12-10-2006 by Xeros]

And that point is this.

You cannot claim to be "above" something, when you copy it.

So when Bush said "lets invade Iraq, Saddam has links to terrorsim and may have WMD's and he detains people without trial, tortures them and occaisionally pops a few people off if they don't fit in with his way of thinking by way of military courts with no appeals...."

Whilst having WMDs, links to terrorism and THEN the US goes and detains people without trial, and proposes military courts with no appeal...and images like the Abu Grahib ones get bounded about.....

Its hypocrisy you see. And when people see it, they are more likley to stand up, scream "FU" and take up arms in protest.

Originally posted by Xeros
These guys were completely innocent ..

No they aren't. They are terrorists. They are insurgent murderers. They are where they belong. And those that have been let go just end up pulling the same crap and get themselves back in. There ARE repeat offenders in GITMO. They are not innocent.

and treated horrifically ...

Nope. They have better housing than they deserve. They have three religiously appropriate nutritious meals. They have better medical care and dental care than many Americans get. They get their Koran and their clothing .... and even get their Islamic calls to prayers.

We treat them better than they deserve and it's all paid for by us.


Again - GITMO doesn't cause terrorism. The terrorists have found ignorant excuses for decades to murder innocent people. They did it before GITMO and they'll do it long after GITMO is gone. The only thing getting rid of GITMO would do is embolden the terrorists and make it necessary to house them in the American homeland ... and I don't think ANYONE wants those murders housed anywhere near them.

I don't want them in my backyard. Do you? If you think they are all innocent then offer your home ... go ahead if you dare .. best be careful though - I'm sure they'd slit your throat the first chance they got.



[edit on 10/12/2006 by FlyersFan]

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by Xeros
These guys were completely innocent ..

No they aren't. They are terrorists. They are insurgent murderers. They are where they belong. And those that have been let go just end up pulling the same crap and get themselves back in. There ARE repeat offenders in GITMO. They are not innocent.

and treated horrifically ...

Nope. They have better housing than they deserve. They have three religiously appropriate nutritious meals. They have better medical care and dental care than many Americans get. They get their Koran and their clothing .... and even get their Islamic calls to prayers.

We treat them better than they deserve and it's all paid for by us.


Again - GITMO doesn't cause terrorism. The terrorists have found ignorant excuses for decades to murder innocent people. They did it before GITMO and they'll do it long after GITMO is gone. The only thing getting rid of GITMO would do is embolden the terrorists and make it necessary to house them in the American homeland ... and I don't think ANYONE wants those murders housed anywhere near them.

I don't want them in my backyard. Do you? If you think they are all innocent then offer your home ... go ahead if you dare .. best be careful though - I'm sure they'd slit your throat the first chance they got.

I'm talking about the guys in the documentary film "The Road to Guantanamo".

'Intelligence' comes out of this film looking almost comically stupid. The interrogators are entirely convinced of their captives' guilt, but seem less sure of (and indeed less interested in) easily verifiable details like who the detainees are, what language they speak, and whether they were actually in England (under well-documented police probation) at the time that the interrogators insist they were meeting Osama bin Laden in Afghanistan.

What the three actually have to say is rarely heeded, while manipulative lies, brutalisation, beatings, stress positions, and months of solitary confinement are regularly employed to persuade them of the interrogators' point of view. Of course such abuses will come as little surprise to anyone reading the newspapers, but to see them re-enacted (albeit with a certain restraint), and to hear the victims' personal accounts, has a much greater impact than the written word, putting paid to America's claims that the treatment of so-called 'enemy combatants' is, as Donald Rumsfeld puts it, "humane and appropriate and consistent with the Geneva Convention for the most part."

You should see it. They were kept in a cage outside in the baking sun with no shelter for days. They were tied by their hands to their ankles so that they were forced to squat whilst having heavy metal played at deafening volume for hours. They were beaten up including a mentally ill man. they were verbally and racially abused. They were refused prayer. Not a nice place.

[edit on 12-10-2006 by Xeros]

Flyers keep your head in the sand if you want to, these terrorists as you call them have no right to due process so they are guilty of nothing until a court says otherwise. And dont tell me their outside the law. America is outside world law on all these issues, human rights, the Geneva convention etc. How stupid can you get, if you were arrested and jailed with no right to due process does that make u a terrorist, how would anyone Know.

And what do you think people will think of Americans now with the numbers of deaths reported in Iraq you will be seen as terrorists and animals because thats just how you are behaving, one does not install democracy at the expense and mass slaughter of innocents, if you had any understanding of these processes you would know that.

Originally posted by magicmushroom
Flyers keep your head in the sand if you want to,

Actually, I could say the same right back atchya.

now with the numbers of deaths reported in Iraq

If you are going to quote that pathetic story about 650,000 dead iraqis .. don't bother. It has been debunked.

I am suprized this would be news. As someone said if you treat people like animals they will behave like animals. When you imprison and torutre you are NOT the good guys anymore. You are what the world fought against in WW2.

If they are accussed of something then try them, they can't cause their is no proof. There is no proof because they are innocent. This is a war crime, and that is indefensible for a so called modern country.

Now a top British army chief has said that US and UK troops are responsible for
all the chaos in Iraq.

Without foriegn soldiers being there, Iraq might mot be as bad it is now.

He has called for a pull out from Iraq by Christmas.


Reuters

Originally posted by mr conspiracy
Finally we have it:

America shares some blame for driving the muslims to commit acts of terror.

Ya Sure!! And women share the blame when they get raped; for if they didn't dress so provacatively maybe the rapist wouldn't be so horney

Stupid logic!!

Islamists "terrorize" because they hate anything non-Islamic. Plain and simple.