BREAKING Multiple people stabbed at far-right rally, and counter protest

originally posted by: abe froman
If you think physically attacking someone over speech is ever right...

I don't think anyone, other than some flyers, have ever said that.

There is a difference in saying they should have foreseen that and they deserved that.

Of course, if they foresaw it and did it anyway then one can say that they deserved it but, it isn't because it is right.

originally posted by: daskakik
a reply to: UKTruth
Skinheads being their affiliate in california.

If "orchestrated pogroms by Zionist agitated colored people" doesn't sound racist to you then maybe your the one reading what you want.

I'm not judging them for being racist by the way. You are the one who made a blanket statement about anyone calling this group what they are calling themselves.

What's next, denying that the Black Panther Party or the KKK are racist groups?

No, I think the KKK are certainly a racist group although they too have changed their message a lot. A bit like Hillary Clinton's mentor Robert Byrd, with the passing of time the KKK grand wizards have tended to talk more about protecting white culture as opposed to burning and lynching other ethnic groups.

Black Lives Matter are probably the most racist organisation around at the moment though.

The group in question here openly state that they are against any idea of ethic superiority, which you have ignored, yet taken a statement to infer nazism. A little selective and what we see a lot these days from the left.

originally posted by: abe froman

If you think physically attacking someone over speech is ever right you should resign as a moderator, an American, and a member of a free society.

It all depends on the incident itself.

There ARE situations where keeping your mouth shut may be good for your overall health. Lots of scenarios come to mind, but then I grew up in a society where physical things happen to people with zero skills in talking trash.

originally posted by: masqua

originally posted by: abe froman

If you think physically attacking someone over speech is ever right you should resign as a moderator, an American, and a member of a free society.

It all depends on the incident itself.

There ARE situations where keeping your mouth shut may be good for your overall health. Lots of scenarios come to mind, but then I grew up in a society where physical things happen to people with zero skills in talking trash.

What were the skinheads saying to deserve the attack?

What were they doing, bullying handicapped people?

originally posted by: UKTruth
No, I think the KKK are certainly a racist group although they too have changed their message a lot. A bit like Hillary Clinton's mentor Robert Byrd, with the passing of time the KKK grand wizards have tended to talk more about protecting white culture as opposed to burning and lynching other ethnic groups.

Growing up I knew a few people involved with these types of groups. Even 30 years ago they were talking "seperate but equal" in public but once a little trust was there the talk about race wars would come out.

Funny thing is that I am hispanic but in a perfect show of cognitive dissonance I have heard "Yeah but not you, you're different".

Either way, racism doesn't have to include violence towards others. Sectioning off groups of people based on race is racism even if they get to live with equal treatment in their part of town.

The group in question here openly state that they are against any idea of ethic superiority, which you have ignored, yet taken a statement to infer nazism. A little selective and what we see a lot these days from the left.

I knew a group of neo-nazis that were against racism. You don't have to be rascist to be a neo-nazi.

I'm not infering nazism, their representatives in california are a group of skinheads that label themselves that.

I'm not leftist, I'm apolitical, in the apathy or antipathy towards all political affiliations way (before someone says that I can't be because I talk about politics).

originally posted by: burgerbuddy
What were the skinheads saying to deserve the attack?

These two groups have history.

Like a couple of gangs, just being in the same place is reason enough for a brawl.

originally posted by: daskakik

originally posted by: UKTruth
No, I think the KKK are certainly a racist group although they too have changed their message a lot. A bit like Hillary Clinton's mentor Robert Byrd, with the passing of time the KKK grand wizards have tended to talk more about protecting white culture as opposed to burning and lynching other ethnic groups.

Growing up I knew a few people involved with these types of groups. Even 30 years ago they were talking "seperate but equal" in public but once a little trust was there the talk about race wars would come out.

Funny thing is that I am hispanic but in a perfect show of cognitive dissonance I have heard "Yeah but not you, you're different".

Either way, racism doesn't have to include violence towards others. Sectioning off groups of people based on race is racism even if they get to live with equal treatment in their part of town.

The group in question here openly state that they are against any idea of ethic superiority, which you have ignored, yet taken a statement to infer nazism. A little selective and what we see a lot these days from the left.

I knew a group of neo-nazis that were against racism. You don't have to be rascist to be a neo-nazi.

I'm not infering nazism, their representatives in california are a group of skinheads that label themselves that.

I'm not leftist, I'm apolitical, in the apathy or antipathy towards all political affiliations way (before someone says that I can't be because I talk about politics).

For me, racism is when a person or group feel themselves superior to others based on race. I do not think a rejection of multiculturalism is racist at all - i.e the preservation of ones own culture or race. Among other disgusting traits, Nazism is closely tied to racism in so much that it takes self endowed superiority (racial or otherwise in fact) to the extreme and includes violence in order to subjugate or exterminate other cultures or races.

My view of this event is that a group dedicated to self preservation of their own race and culture were attacked by Nazi's trying to close down their freedom of expression with violence. The group organised to shut down the rally may think they hold some kind of moral superiority and they may have decided that the real purpose of the group they were attacking was a racist purpose, but their opinions and interpretations do not make them right and does not offer them the remit to resort to violence. It is they who absolutely acted like Nazi's.

a reply to: UKTruth

No matter which way you want to slice it, the GSS, the bulk of the group representing TWP at this event is a neo-nazi group, they call themselves nationalists and use nazi type images to identify themselves, why do you have a problem with that?

I agree with them when they that you don't have to be rascist to be neo-nazi. I don't believe them when they say they are not but, that doesn't really change anything that I have posted.

originally posted by: daskakik
a reply to: UKTruth

No matter which way you want to slice it, the GSS, the bulk of the group representing TWP at this event is a neo-nazi group, they call themselves nationalists and use nazi type images to identify themselves, why do you have a problem with that?

I agree with them when they that you don't have to be rascist to be neo-nazi. I don't believe them when they say they are not but, that doesn't really change anything that I have posted.

They are a neo-nazi group based on your label or theirs? What I am saying is that your label applied to another person or group is inconsequential unless their is some clear evidence of nazi practices.
It's about time the whole nazi smearing was stopped and only used where it is warranted, as it is with people who think their views and opinions are superior and then use violence to enforce their views or opinions. As with racism, nazism is a card played too often and can have the effect of desensitizing what it actually means.
Skinhead does not equal nazism. Standing up for white culture does not equal nazism. What exactly is the difference between this group and Black Lives Matter or La Raza?

For example:

Every day Whites work to make America stronger. They energize the economy and strive to make better lives for themselves, their families, and their communities. Our mission is to improve their opportunities for success in achieving the American Dream. Since 1968, the National Council of TWP has remained a trusted, nonpartisan voice for Whites. This is the community we serve through our research, policy analysis, and state and national advocacy efforts, as well as in our programs work in communities nationwide. We partner with Affiliates across the country to serve millions of Whites in the areas of civic engagement, civil rights and immigration, education, workforce and the economy, health, and housing. We believe in fighting for our community and for an America where economic, political, and social advancement is a reality for all Whites.

The above is a statement made by La Raza about their organisation with White substituted where Latino was written and La Raza substituted with TWP.. The paragraph above would be called racist and also Nazi by many on the left and is not that far removed from what TWP actually say about themselves. Can you imagine if Donald Trump made the above statement?

originally posted by: UKTruth
They are a neo-nazi group based on your label or theirs?

Theirs. I keep repeating that in almost every post.

What I am saying is that your label applied to another person or group is inconsequential unless their is some clear evidence of nazi practices.

Neo-nazis are not WWII nazis. So they don't have to be exact copies of WWII german nazis to espouse nazi political ideals.

Skinhead does not equal nazism. Standing up for white culture does not equal nazism. What exactly is the difference between this group and Black Lives Matter or La Raza?

There isn't any, calling those groups rasict wouldn't be smearing either, so why are you making such a big deal?

originally posted by: daskakik

originally posted by: UKTruth
They are a neo-nazi group based on your label or theirs?

Theirs. I keep repeating that in almost every post.

What I am saying is that your label applied to another person or group is inconsequential unless their is some clear evidence of nazi practices.

Neo-nazis are not WWII nazis. So they don't have to be exact copies of WWII german nazis to espouse nazi political ideals.

Skinhead does not equal nazism. Standing up for white culture does not equal nazism. What exactly is the difference between this group and Black Lives Matter or La Raza?

There isn't any, calling those groups rasict wouldn't be smearing either, so why are you making such a big deal?

I didn't mention WWII and I am yet to see this group refer to themselves as neo Nazi's. You can keep repeating all you like but it doesn't become truth due to repetition. Here is their website link again.

Traditionalist Workers Party

Find me somewhere or something that defines them as neo Nazi's.

The 'deal' is to actually stand by the reality of what happened. A group demonstrating in support of their political platform were attacked by a group who tried to shut down their free speech because they don't like the message. That's pretty much it.
The violence by the people trying to shut down the protest should be condemned and no excuses should be made for their behaviour.

a reply to: UKTruth

Do you have a link that shows which side initiated the violence?

a reply to: UKTruth

Yes and that group calls themselves national socialists (commonly called Nazi in english) what is wrong with standing by that reality?

Calling that group by the name that they want to be called is not an excuse for what the antifascists did (also what that group wants to be called).

You're the one who came in like calling them by what they are is automatically a smear and, to be honest, to many people it is but not to me and not to them, since that is what they choose to be called.

GSS, Maybe you are right, no neo-nazi's to see here.



And yes it's from their site goldenstateskinheads.org