London MET Police call for water cannons ahead of riots

First thread so appologies if this is in the wrong place.

Disclaimer: I'm not a conspiracy type but find them interesting to read; however this report marks the biggest militarisation of UK police in their entire history.

Link to report here - www.london.gov.uk...

The Background - The UK has long enjoyed a history of being one of the few countries in the world where police do not carry firearms as standard. They're by no means perfect but it's a world away from judge, jury and executioner roles some other countries have to endure.

Since the government has introduced austerity measures there have been a number of large protests and riots against the policies. As a result of this there have been calls to

The Report
It's best reading it in full, however here's a precís:

- Police acknowledge there will be mass protests and riots this summer due to austerity - however instead of recommending austerity be slowed down they want money to be invested in water cannons, baton rounds, fire arms and the like to quell dissent

- They also acknowledge that water cannons can cause permanent blindness, deafness, serious injury and even death - however justify their deployment on the grounds the other alternative is to use conventional firearms.

- The report also says Chief Constables should be able to deplo them without asking the approval of the home secretary.

This is a very worrying report indeed.

Its still considered non lethal but just about everyone, if you are worried about being hit with it, dont riot. Pretty simple. Certainly better than being shot and if you bring a gun of your own to a riot, you will be shot dead. We made not have many guns, but any gun is met with lethal force every time, we do not mess about in this regard.

Good.....let's soak the scummy pilchard classes....!

If I could add anything else then it would be a permanent marker dye (fluorescent Green should do) to mark offenders out for continual ridicule later....

PDUK

PurpleDog UK
Good.....let's soak the scummy pilchard classes....!

If I could add anything else then it would be a permanent marker dye (fluorescent Green should do) to mark offenders out for continual ridicule later....

PDUK

edit on 22-1-2014 by PurpleDog UK because: (no reason given)

I believe they do this with paintball filled with it already, im sure i read something about that in the recent London riots.

reply to post by bastion


I shouldn't read too much into this, it is just a report considering what actions could/should have been taking in 2011. It shouldn't be read that they either expect more riots or that they expect to sue them. For example, Baton rounds have been allowed on the mainland for many years, but to my knowledge have never been used, even in 2011 and are rarely deployed in NI.

As I said, I also doubt there will be any further rioting, much less any to do with austerity. The 2011 riots were opportunistic idiots getting shirty over a drug-dealing, gun-wielding gangster being shot dead and seeing as we now have expected GDP growth of 2+% and unemployment falling the most since 1997, I think "austerity" as an excuse to riot is a pretty thin one.

Rather a water cannon than a gun.

Its just water.

stumason
reply to post by bastion

 

I shouldn't read too much into this, it is just a report considering what actions could/should have been taking in 2011. It shouldn't be read that they either expect more riots or that they expect to sue them. For example, Baton rounds have been allowed on the mainland for many years, but to my knowledge have never been used, even in 2011 and are rarely deployed in NI.

As I said, I also doubt there will be any further rioting, much less any to do with austerity. The 2011 riots were opportunistic idiots getting shirty over a drug-dealing, gun-wielding gangster being shot dead and seeing as we now have expected GDP growth of 2+% and unemployment falling the most since 1997, I think "austerity" as an excuse to riot is a pretty thin one.

What dye mean? Any excuse is a good excuse to riot!

stirling
What dye mean? Any excuse is a good excuse to riot!

I'm sure you're just having a laugh, but seriously, no it isn't.

crazyewok
Rather a water cannon than a gun.

Its just water.

Indeed and it's worth noting that in 2011 there was discussion about "shooting to kill" people who were setting buildings on fire or otherwise a "risk to life", but this was quickly put to bed as a viable option except in the most extreme of circumstances, so we can thank our lucky stars we're not like so many other countries when it comes to dealing with civil disorder.

auterity is far from over, it will get much worse. an the economy is not improving.

break out the carbolic, i'm in. free showers for all.

taoistguy
auterity is far from over, it will get much worse. an the economy is not improving.

And you're source for this, is?

Pretty much every group of economists, be it the IMF or the BoE or one of the private "think tanks" has actually had to revise up their growth forecasts for this year and if things continue along this trend, will have to do so for next year too. Inflation is actually going down too, which counters the need for any interest rate hikes. Unemployment has fallen remarkably in the last year and continues to fall.

Granted, we're not "out of the woods", but it would take a very special kind of person (like Ed Milliband & Chums) to ruin it.

And if you dislike "official figures", consider PwC's recent survey of business leaders shows confidence is up and over 2/3rds will be taking on more staff this year.

And just to end it on, we now have a record amount of trade with China, some £70 Billion in bilateral trade and growing, with double the amount of investment than any other EU country and ranked in the top 10 for Chinese investment in the world, so we must be doing something right...

Its Ironic really.

America breaks away from the UK because we are tyranical.


But they are the ones haveing the debate on cops shooting and torturing people for minor offences.

We get the debate on if we are allowed to get rioters wet

crazyewok
We get the debate on if we are allowed to get rioters wet

And we still need the Home Secretaries approval to do so!

stumason

crazyewok
We get the debate on if we are allowed to get rioters wet

And we still need the Home Secretaries approval to do so!

Tyranny my Kentish arse.

reply to post by crazyewok


Ummmmm, you do know water cannons can kill you too don't you? Being hit with high pressure water is the same as being hit with a solid object at a high volocity. It can rupture organs, break your neck, give you brain damage etc etc. This is not squirting a hose at someone.

reply to post by TKDRL


Well, yes, that is a possibility, in the same way it is entirely possible for you to be killed while heading a football...

But back in the realms of the day to day, the amount of people killed by water cannon is far less than pretty much any other device used by the Police. In comparison, rioters nearly always resort to bricks, steel poles, wooden planks and fire bombs, all of which are considerably more dangerous than a jet of water, so you have to take everything into account.

TKDRL
reply to post by crazyewok

 

Ummmmm, you do know water cannons can kill you too don't you? Being hit with high pressure water is the same as being hit with a solid object at a high volocity. It can rupture organs, break your neck, give you brain damage etc etc. This is not squirting a hose at someone.

Better than a bullet.

Biigs
Its still considered non lethal but just about everyone, if you are worried about being hit with it, dont riot. Pretty simple. Certainly better than being shot and if you bring a gun of your own to a riot, you will be shot dead. We made not have many guns, but any gun is met with lethal force every time, we do not mess about in this regard.

No offence but read the report. Water cannons are classed as less than lethal weapons with the police report clearly stating they can be deadly.

Also they're not being deployed in riot situations but any public disturbance that upsets the norm (i.e protests, marches etc...). Do ou think it's only going to be Jeremy Kyle types out on the streets when pensions are scrapped, the NHS is closed down, we run out of electricity, people can no longer afford food etc...? Austerity hasn't even begun.

Can't believe how many people on here are more than happy to spend hundreds of millions on turning the police into a military force instead of using the money to tackle the root of the problems.

stumason

taoistguy
auterity is far from over, it will get much worse. an the economy is not improving.

And you're source for this, is?

Cameron anouned it a few weeks back that austerity measures will remain in place long after economic recover. If you think austerity had anything to do with rescuing the economy then I'm afraid you haven't met the Tories.

Even the Daily Mail are against him: Cameron: Austerity should last for ever
www.dailymail.co.uk...

stumason
reply to post by bastion

 

As I said, I also doubt there will be any further rioting, much less any to do with austerity. The 2011 riots were opportunistic idiots getting shirty over a drug-dealing, gun-wielding gangster being shot dead and seeing as we now have expected GDP growth of 2+% and unemployment falling the most since 1997, I think "austerity" as an excuse to riot is a pretty thin one.

Those riots had absolutely nothing to do with austerity - they initially an outburst against yet another police murder of a young black male. Sadly the original very pressing issue was overshadowed by opportunist types with no motive using the disruption to try and grab themselves a new TV.

Also Duggan wasn't a drug dealer, he received one minor fine for possessing a small amount of cannabis years earlier, he was hardly scarface.

bastion
however this report marks the biggest militarisation of UK police in their entire history.

How so? Water cannon are not military. They are riot control. To be honest, when demonstrations become riots I believe that the police should be able to control and disperse in a non-lethal manner. If this means that water canon are deployed then that's good.

I am very politically active and participate in public demonstrations. Riots are not demonstrations. They are anti social and destructive and the police need to be able to disperse them. If that means the rioters getting a bit wet and cold, then that's appropriate.

I say, good.

Regards