Your view and why it's correct

After reading many threads that are put here on ATS I need your thoughts and opinions. The hatred, mocking, self inflated views about ones version or understanding of their religion or someone else's is mind blowing to me. So I would like to discuss why your version, your understanding is right. I would like to know how in your mind you know, not think, but know that your understanding is more deserving of being considered than another. Stemming from that knowledge why do you feel that puts you in a position to tell others of the same faith, or some other faith, how wrong they are in their understanding of it. This applies to all faiths and religions although the most discussed here on ATS is Christianity and Islam from what I have seen. So please tell me what drives you, personally, to be convinced. How that in itself puts you in a position to correct others in their understanding. My questions do not apply to things such as misunderstanding a words meaning or something simple but more the basis of the faith or tenants of that faith are called into question.

I mean this thread to help me see viewpoints of others. If you feel that you read someone's view on something and have an overwhelming urge to tell them they are wrong and why by all means create a thread and have that argument. I have no need to argue over whether or not a persons view is correct only why they came to that view and feel that it's more correct than another. I realize that possibly sharing this could leave one open to ridicule by others on this board as I have seen it over and over in the religion forum but I hope to appeal to people to come with a civil demeanor and respect for others.

I have my own views that some are aware of and I'm happy to share them if it helps the thread in any way. I have no fear ridicule nor do I feel my views are 100% correct, they are simply my views at this point in my life and open to change as needed.

Thanks and I look forward to your replies.

Good thread man.

drivers1492
I realize that possibly sharing this could leave one open to ridicule by others on this board as I have seen it over and over in the religion forum but I hope to appeal to people to come with a civil demeanor and respect for others.

A note to members in this forum. Changes are coming to eliminate this. This is just a notice. No need to reply to me.

Great question.
I personally don't follow any 'mainstream' or organised religion, although I do consider myself to be quite spiritual. I like to think that all paths lead to Rome, as the saying goes.
But I admit that I have judged and still do sometimes, certain religions and especially the more extremist people that follow them. (and here I'm talking both christian and islamic, although of course extremism exists in every religion)
I think in the end it all comes down to Ego, you could take this and apply it to so many other things, political ideologies, nationalism/patriotism, football teams. etc..
The need to belong to a group or idea, maybe related to the instinct of survival, sometimes takes over rational thinking.
The need to be right and to show others they are wrong, makes people forget how to be accepting and respecting of the other point of view.
just my 2 cents.

I keep wondering what religions are doing being discussed on a 'conspiracy and discussion of the unknown' type website.

If you believe in a certain religion, well, that's that, right? It's not up for debate, nor is it an unknown, by definition, because the belief function trumps everything else.

And why the recent uptick in these kind of threads, about religion? Seems like everything is being posted and discussed to death short of 'how many angels can dance on a head of a pin' type threads.

Does God do 'AMA' requests? Maybe that'd solve it once and for all.

reply to post by drivers1492

I would like to know how in your mind you know, not think, but know that your understanding is more deserving of being considered than another.

And this is the difficulty found in all religious discourse. If there is a such thing as truth, only one version can be "right", and the rest, by definition, would have to be wrong. So it is that people go out of their way to prove their version correct and disparage others as wrong. Out of this stems the most insidious of fanaticism, rather than realizing religion is a simple matter of taste and culture.

You will likely not receive a response to your request, because doing so would bring this dogmatism to light in he who answers. I love traps like that.

reply to post by drivers1492


This is a good thread. And I have a feeling not many people are gonna step forward..

I don't post in the religious threads cause I fear ridicule and being called insane... I know I'm not sane but I just don't want to be called names...

So I usually just sit back and lurk and read these threads.

My beliefs are even confusing for me, but I do know that I hold my beliefs in my heart and I judge no others for their beliefs. Everyone has their right to believe what they want and not be called names for it...

Discussions need to be had more and not name calling or telling someone they are wrong for a belief.

Peace and love is what I try to promote.. I wish more people could spread love and positivity more than hate and negativity.

Peace and love to you and thumbs up to everything you said
-nat

reply to post by athousandlives



I've been judgmental as well but I do try to keep it civil and simply point out my view without downplaying someone else's. Thanks for your input.

Im not sure that its a given that if one feels they are "right" that it automatically makes others "wrong."

Perhaps that is the real trap.

reply to post by drivers1492


no one is more deserving than another...

reply to post by signalfire


I think ATS is a bigger than just a conspiracy site. Your point here deserves repeating I believe

because the belief function trumps everything else

At its core this is it hands down. But, like you pointed out everything seems to get debated to death and they are quite heated and down right rude at times. I suppose I'm just curious as to what brings one to their personal "i understand it now and I'm right" conclusion to address others in their understanding.

In my personal opinion the answer is right in front of all of us. To become the "light of the world" you must first recognize it and we all have it.

You will likely not receive a response to your request, because doing so would bring this dogmatism to light in he who answers. I love traps like that.

reply to post by Aphorism


That's sad that we can't have that type of discussion though. I by no means am trying to trap or bait anyone and I hope folks see that. Possibly I should have stated if they would like to msg me privately if they felt putting it out there was a bit much I'm fine with that as well.

reply to post by natalia


Thanks and if I may ask a question without putting yourself out to much? Like I originally asked in the op I am curious what brought you to the point to where you believe your correct in your belief? Research or personal experience?

No worries if your not comfortable sharing I don't want anyone to put anything forward that makes them feel uncomfortable as faith is a very personal thing.

SisyphusRide
reply to post by drivers1492

 

no one is more deserving than another...

...expanding upon

Darwinism doesn't embody this principal, specially when pertaining to our single species... Darwinism would thrust us so far back that it is almost indescribable.

we're not there yet people! and if one society tries to go there without it being a global phenomenon you will be devoured by your neighbor and have no legacy to be known.

yes, we're animals alright... but we must transcend above.

RISE!

I've been on a few different sites and it's always the religion forum that is the worst part of the sites. I'd love to see it closed down here totally. But the flip side of that is that it keeps the folks who feel the need to proselytize off the main boards.

reply to post by drivers1492


Ill go out on a limb and say I feel my beliefs are correct (everyone feels that way anyway!).

However, those beliefs are formed by a limited filter on a universal data set. So, others using different filters are not necessarily wrong, it is just looking at the same thing through a different lense.

Both valid, and when put together, start to become closer to the "Truth" as they are a part of what they observe. I think this is why science is so important, because it gives us an avenue which is less subjective than other options like language.

I think the difficulty comes in when we are not able to physically look through anothers perspective and "confirm" anything. We have to remain looking at it through our own limited means, and without a way to meaningfully explore it (like math), its very easy to get caught up in semantics.

Anothers version of the "truth" may be 100% inverse to my own, but I am unconvinced that makes it any less valid. And mathematically, it is a simple relationship between them. So, perhaps, they arent nearly as far apart as it may seem in our fish eye lenses.

I could be wrong though. So, theres that too.

reply to post by Serdgiam


I can agree with this absolutely yet that is a very prevalent trend.

reply to post by SisyphusRide


While I agree with you that doesn't seem to be how people are treated

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1


Not to draw attention to you but I have read alot of your posts you have some interesting views imo. I do like the sig quote. Its not what you look at that matters its what you see. Perhaps that statement is relevant in theology.

reply to post by SisyphusRide


I mean no disrespect but you confuse the crap out of me. I think I may understand your point yet not fully.

reply to post by FlyersFan


I would hate to see it closed I read a lot on this particular board even though I don't comment much. It's sad that the conversations are so riddled with mud slinging instead of just thoughts or civil differences of opinion.

reply to post by drivers1492


The only thing I have a problem with in religions (any variety) is the shaming and humiliation and degradation of people.
Especially children, and equally, animals.

Religion is for adults. The only thing a child needs to learn is The Golden Rule.

Being told, from the cradle, that one is a hopeless, worthless sinner is abusive. Being told as an adult that one is an abomination is abuse.

I've studied many of the world's religions. The only thing that matters (as far as I'm concerned) is The Golden Rule.

Anyone who abuses their kids (either physically, as in beatings; emotionally, as in "you are worthless and deserve to be tossed into hell"; or mentally, as in "this is the truth because I say so and no you may not listen to other peoples' perspectives because they are all wrong and 'we' are right") needs to be addressed.

I don't care what people think about "God" or any of the various suggestions on offer (and they are all merely suggestions), I only care that people SHOULD NOT BE shamed, humiliated, told they are doomed, condemned, beaten, etc.

ANY religion that makes people feel like they are a piece of crap is worthy of ridicule. We will never get out of this cycle of exploitation, greed, power, and domination unless we recognize that all people deserve to have safety, sustenance, nurturing, education, and DIGNITY.

There are two vids I've posted numerous times that represent my view:
I am here to promote justice, equality, and humanitarian reorganization of this world; and to argue against the rape, pillage, destruction, and indifference to our home...our planet... "Earth" and all of her creations.
The human race has lost its way.