Secrecy still shrouds Sandy Hook investigation!

Mikeultra

Wait a minute there, I told you what I want to hear in the 911 tapes. It's a few pages back. To save you time though here's what I want to hear.
1. The various calm radio chatter talking about Newton PD looking for something to do from CT state police to dispatch.
2. Numerous shooters detained in the woods and on Yogananda Street.
3. What they don't want to release because of the overlapping drill taking place in Bridgeport.

Hmmm. The report specifically said there were initial reports of people running around with guns outside but which turned out to be a concerned parent holding a cell phone. There was someone else they arrested in the woods who turned out to be a curious onlooker who was tipped off by a warning he received on his smartphone app (apparently there are apps that warn people of such things). This is almost certainly the "additional shooters in the woods" you are referring to so what is in the 9-1-1 call that would add any more information on this?

Also, it's already been pointed out the supposed overlapping drill in Bridgeport wasn't even a drill, but a conference addressing the special needs of children for disaster planning. I read the report you're referring to and this is specifically what it said. You are quoting incorrect information some internet web site is intentionally misquoting, here.

HOWEVER, the "various calm radio chatter of Newtown police lookign for somethign to do" is interesting, and if true it definitely needs to be released to the public...but you say this is radio chatter. Why would that appear in a 9-1-1 call?

All information must be released, because we don't know the importance of a piece of information without reviewing it.

Trusting the establishment to tell us what we need to know has never been a good idea. The only way we can truly trust the establishment is with total transparency.

If the release of other information leads to more questions, so be it. There may be a very small percentage of the public who will never be satisfied, but most simply desire full transparency.

There may or may not be a conspiracy in regards to what happened that day in Connecticut. There is most definitely a conspiracy in regards to how information is handled and disseminated to the public. This should have all of us concerned.

The events in Newtown are only part of the story. The "shut up and believe what you're told" mantra is perhaps even a bigger deal in the scheme of things.

So many are getting hung up on whether anything happened or not, or if it happened the way it is being reported. The biggest story, in my opinion, is that stories like this could be faked and controlled, based on how the information is presented. Whether this is a completely real event or not, it is clear that the government and media are running a play on us.

Snarl
reply to post by VandalX

 

I think you're hitting one of the nails right on the head ... the MSM coverage of this story was less than professional, at best. That makes me wonder about a disconnect between 'local authority' and the press. All the threats coming out of that one cop's face really bothered me.

All right, whoever created that video is being an outright BS artist. I was watching the news that entire day and I saw that very announcement. That cop was referring to all the hordes of papparazzi acting like a bunch of vultures and chasing after the victims' families looking for an interview to the point where it was outright stalking. Constantly calling people on the phone and knocking on their door...and yes I know that's exactly what they did becuase they've done this exact same thing at other school shootings...is not only harassment, but it's outright disgusting seeing that the families are still in shock from losing their children. It was NOT about people posting things to social media as this video make it look like. Somebody intentionally edited that whole segment out of the news release here.

I think this is what disgusts me about the whole conspiracy issue. It would be one thing if people had concerns over legitimate issues they suspect there might be- whether the police responded accordingly, whether the mother tried to get the kid committed but couldn't becuase of overwhelming gov't beaurocracy, etc...but it's clear that isn't what people are concerned about. What people ARE being concered about is over the outright fake information being relased by phonies who want to stir up false public unrest, exactly like this. Look at the video yourself; you can even see where the video skips at the point where something was removed from it. Thwre is no way this happened accidentally.

One other poster here said "he wanted to know more about a suspiciously similar active shooter drill a few miles away at the exact same time" but when I look at the report he's referring to I see it was really just a conference to discuss the needs of children during disaster recovery planning. It had absolutely nothign to do with school shootings so he was just quoting fake information too. There is clearly a pattern of behavior here.

BillN

Pinkorchid
reply to post by BillN

 

Really Newtown ehhhh? Well are we lucky to have someone on the spot , amazingly lucky , do you live across the road?

I detect some sarcasm. Have the mods check my IP if you think I'm BSing. I've got nothing to gain here.

I think we're seeing the REAL reason for all these conspiracy discussions; abject paranoia. Everything just has to be some sinister secret plot to take over the world to certain people, so when a massive event like the Newtown shooting occurs such people will naturally see it through conspiracy colored glasses and they will naturally see hidden clues all over the place that simply isn't there. A cigar simply can't be just a cigar.

I myself live maybe thirty minutes from Newtown myself so seeing someone else from Connecticut logging onto ATS is about as incredible as seeing someone buying milk at the grocery store. Insinuating that you're some secret agent simply becuase you're in the area is pretty bizarre.

notquitesure
All information must be released, because we don't know the importance of a piece of information without reviewing it.

Trusting the establishment to tell us what we need to know has never been a good idea. The only way we can truly trust the establishment is with total transparency.

If the release of other information leads to more questions, so be it. There may be a very small percentage of the public who will never be satisfied, but most simply desire full transparency.

...but then, there is a difference between "wanting to fully document a major event to establish a historial record" and "looking for that sinister secret conspiracy you're 'so sure' has to be hidden in plain sight somewhere". Don't you agree?

reply to post by GoodOlDave


There are many aspects to this case that are troubling, one of the issues I have is right here. Project Longevity is a federal grant to Connecticut to get guns out of the state. It was taking place just weeks before the shooting. Interesting how everyone in the Sandy Hook, Newtown area went on an anti gun crusade after the shooting. The president used the Sandy hook families to parade them around on his anti gun tour, where was their appeal to privacy then? Giving speeches and interviews just days after the tragedy, where was their need for privacy then? Didn't anybody notice how quickly they started talking about guns?

How convenient that there is another large federal grant given to Connecticut to tear down the school and build another one. The Fed's fingerprints are all over this, whether you want to acknowledge it or not.

reply to post by jaws1975


I would give you 10 stars for that one if I could.

And I said before, if I had lost a child, in that situation or any other, the last thing on my mind would be going out and giving interviews. The very last thing.

GoodOlDave

notquitesure
All information must be released, because we don't know the importance of a piece of information without reviewing it.

Trusting the establishment to tell us what we need to know has never been a good idea. The only way we can truly trust the establishment is with total transparency.

If the release of other information leads to more questions, so be it. There may be a very small percentage of the public who will never be satisfied, but most simply desire full transparency.

...but then, there is a difference between "wanting to fully document a major event to establish a historial record" and "looking for that sinister secret conspiracy you're 'so sure' has to be hidden in plain sight somewhere". Don't you agree?

edit on 28-11-2013 by GoodOlDave because: (no reason given)

Yes, there is a difference.

Bad things happen everyday. Recently in my area there was a murder of three individuals allegedly committed by a Church Pastor. The murder was carried out in front of the children of two of the three victims.

There has been no lack of information forthcoming about the case. The police aren't trying to keep any secrets. This was a horrible event, but the public is not being shielded from the truth.

Lack of transparency and media control lend themselves to conspiracy theories. In the Sandy Hook case, the information has been presented in such a way that the appearance is that something is being hidden.

It's indisputable that the case is being used to promote an agenda dealing with gun control and mental health. The question becomes, is the establishment simply opportunistic or complicit?

reply to post by GoodOlDave

I think we're seeing the REAL reason for all these conspiracy discussions; abject paranoia. Everything just has to be some sinister secret plot to take over the world to certain people, so when a massive event like the Newtown shooting occurs such people will naturally see it through conspiracy colored glasses and they will naturally see hidden clues all over the place that simply isn't there. A cigar simply can't be just a cigar.

I think you make a great point and want to add, it may be quite a bit simpler than that. The seeming need from the first moments and hours following an event to put wild or conspiratorial motives to it is fascinating to watch.

Sure, plenty of things earn the focus because, well, they ARE conspiracies. Even paranoids have enemies, right? On things like this and Boston though, the speculation and seeming DEMAND that it be something more than it seemed came immediately and never ended. No evidence or anything else considered..or even will be in some cases.

I've come to think it has a lot to do with people's need to find ways it can't happen to them or close to them. If we accept Newtown at face value, and that a monster like this could have been festering in plain sight all along? We have to acknowledge it could be happening right now, anywhere in America and within any community.

That's just more than some can or will ever allow themselves to consider as real, I believe.

...but then, there is a difference between "wanting to fully document a major event to establish a historial record" and "looking for that sinister secret conspiracy you're 'so sure' has to be hidden in plain sight somewhere". Don't you agree?

reply to post by GoodOlDave


When the SH event is used to rollout the biggest sweeping gun reform this country has ever seen, I think it's absolutely appropriate to examine every facet of this case. It is our right, and our privilege
as American citizens to keep our elected officials honest and transparent, I'm sorry you don't feel the same way, try living in North Korea that may be a better fit for you.

jaws1975
reply to post by GoodOlDave

 

There are many aspects to this case that are troubling, one of the issues I have is right here. Project Longevity is a federal grant to Connecticut to get guns out of the state. It was taking place just weeks before the shooting. Interesting how everyone in the Sandy Hook, Newtown area went on an anti gun crusade after the shooting. The president used the Sandy hook families to parade them around on his anti gun tour, where was their appeal to privacy then? Giving speeches and interviews just days after the tragedy, where was their need for privacy then? Didn't anybody notice how quickly they started talking about guns?

This is one of the troubling things I have about conspiracy theories. Their proponents are so eagar to spin all these alternative theories being perpetrated by "them" but not even two of them can agree with each other on who the "they" are.

I will tell you right now who the "they" are in this case. They are the politicians and political activists who hate guns and will sieze any opportunity to chip away at people's ability to possess a gun. I myself saw literally not even an hour after the tragedy occurred, while the bodies lying on the floor were still warm and everyone else was staring in shock at what they were seeing on TV (including me), those characters from Mayors against Illegal Guns and the Brady Campaign releasing statemenst on how we need more gun control laws. It is as self serving and disgusting as it gets, but in truth what else are we going to expect from such single issue zealots?

I agree with you completely that the gun control proponents are using this tragedy shamelessly to pursue their own political agenda, but that doesn't mean this event was staged by them in order for them to do it. For one thing, Obama comes from Chicago, and Chicago has only ever allowed criminals to have guns. What else would you expect from that guy, either?

jaws1975

 

When the SH event is used to rollout the biggest sweeping gun reform this country has ever seen, I think it's absolutely appropriate to examine every facet of this case. It is our right, and our privilege
as American citizens to keep our elected officials honest and transparent, I'm sorry you don't feel the same way, try living in North Korea that may be a better fit for you.

???? Excuse me??? I live in Connecticut, and not only did this travesty happen here, we also had our socialist passing himself off as a liberal governor Malloy pass without question the most retarded gun laws in the state's history. I don't need to log onto ATS to find out about all these things happening. I am seeing it happen right in front of me, thank you very much.

The difference between you and me is that you are seeing the patterns you yourself want to see; event A happens, somebody invokes event B, which leads you to suspect that this person instigated event A in order to invoke event B, rather than just responding to event A. I will be the first to admit seeing patetrns that we want to see applies to me too, but I personally think most legislators are bumbling idiots who get elected becuase they are experts at makign themselves look competent. The pattern I myself see is that such people are passing laws not becuase of a overall master plan, but because addressing the actual problem; mental health, gangs, etc; are too complex for them to address so they give us this gun control swill which does nothigngto give voters the impression they're actually doing something so they can go back to sleep.

The thing is, I can give you as many examples as you'd like of incompetent politicians giving us swill that accomplishes nothing. Can you give me even one case where the gov't instigated a false flag school shooting in order to install more gun control?

Re/patterns

I would love to believe that what we are dealing with is a bunch of bumbling politicians, really I would. I would love to believe that some inexperienced guys managed to fly with such precision and that planes vaporize on the ground on impact. I would love to believe that an unemployed med student had the resources to amass such an arsenal and defy odds of entrance. I would love to believe that a lone geek, slight of build and learning mostly from video games managed to pull off such a hit of expertise. The list goes on…

Because the alternative is so evil, so calculated it means there is more to correct than incompetent politicians. However, as I study history I cannot write this all off as incompetence and lone gunmen, loan geeks et all.

To
Wrabbit2000 /you said...

I've come to think it has a lot to do with people's need to find ways it can't happen to them or close to them.

Odds being what they are I believe I have much better odds that encountering the lone psychopath is substantially less than encountering a government run by such~

arosebyanyothername
Re/patterns


Because the alternative is so evil, so calculated it means there is more to correct than incompetent politicians. However, as I study history I cannot write this all off as incompetence and lone gunmen, loan geeks et all.

We see the same patterns.

reply to post by GoodOlDave

The difference between you and me is that you are seeing the patterns you yourself want to see; event A happens, somebody invokes event B, which leads you to suspect that this person instigated event A in order to invoke event B, rather than just responding to event A.

How are we suppose to respond to event A when the authorities and media present us with an event B and event C? For example Lt. Vance made a statement during a press conference that the man in the woods was chopping firewood, the Newtown Bee said that it was an off duty swat officer from a nearby town, and the official report says that it was a guy who had an app that let him know what was happening. And you wonder why people are asking questions?

I went down a rabbit hole with the guy Richard J Novia. That is the Tech Club teacher who says he insisted that Adam join the club. The Tech Club had a TV spot on Channel 17. Adam would run video cameras for this and do video editing. The Tech Club got this TV spot when Channel 17 got a new owner News Corp. And the strange thing is when News Corp dropped Channel 17 Richard J Novia decided to leave Newtown Elementary School?

But this is not the only thing bothering me here. The list is long. Richard J Novia was in charge of Security for the school and protection for the children from school shootings. Seems Adam only got interested in this as he joined this class with Richard J Novia. And his job is to research this type of thing just like Adam decided to do. Could there be a link there where Adam was working with him to research the school shootings? A student teacher project?

And then you have the Granny Book. Digital rights for the animated Granny was given to some one else name redacted. Now this book Probably came from this class. Why do I say that? Well binders which this book was is used on class projects in computer classes. I guess it goes along with the hole office experience thing to learn binders for presentations and reports. But that is not the only part there. There is more that leads me to that class. The digital image looks like some of the early MSDOS animated characters you would create with old software. And another thing would be the credit for works of others. Listing the names of those who helped like he did. I am sure he would have got a "A" for the project for correctly doing everything. But a WTH for the story line used.

But there is still more to this guy that seems off. I guess you remember the elementary school kids being taught Stranger Danger in school. That is where they yell Stranger Danger if approached by a stranger and run. They are taught this in elementary school by security officer or local police. Richard J Novia was the guy in charge of security. And that tied in with Adams internet records pulled by a search warrant for a Smiggles conversations about Pedophilia nonporn. Could this be him researching what his teacher taught him? Could this be even a conversation with his teacher Richard J Novia? In the PBS article he talks about sitting for long periods of time with Adam and not saying a word? Overnight class projects for a computer class? And when he taught Adam needed to go home he would call Nancy himself? Not send him to the office to have the secretary call his parents which would be done normally?

Richard J Novia is part of Infragard and ISC2 government hackers. ISC2 are incharge of all certifications and training for Information Security under DoD 8570.1m. Yes the military put ISC2 in charge.

I am sure there is more because I did not go all the way down the rabbit hole last night. I could see this was a deep dark hole that some body could get lost in. After all it is Thanks Giving today. I will look into some more and post if I see more.

His Linkedin account showing he is tied to Newtown,ISC2 and Infragard.
www.linkedin.com...

DoD 8570.1m
infoseccerts.com...

The PBS story with the information stated by him that has really made me scratch my head about this guys ties to Adam and his family.
www.pbs.org...

The rest came from the ct.gov website. Smiggles was listed under the digital history and search warrants issued.
www.ct.gov...

This site has the documents also.
www.documentcloud.org...

reply to post by jaws1975
Exactly, i agree with you 100%.... Which scenario is the correct scenario? Nobody knows... or is it the "official scenario", that the officials state is the official scenario?? That's why people are asking questions, because none of it makes sense! I like to know when the "Officials" are going to clamp down on MSM... Because it still seems to me that the MSM is the cause of all this misinformation...INTENTIONALLY!!!

reply to post by VandalX


Look at the above post. A man connected to the media News Corp Channel 17, DHS, ISC2, Infragard, the school and Direct connection to Adam and his family. If anybody had a position to misdirect the media and even the investigation it is him. Hell a lot of what has been told came from his class with Adam. I am not saying he was there or put him up to it but I think he did unintentionally plant the seed for Adam to look into school shootings which he later did.

This guy is in the perfect position to twist all the information about this event because he was part of it before and after but not during.

But this is not the only thing bothering me here. The list is long. Richard J Novia was in charge of Security for the school and protection for the children from school shootings. Seems Adam only got interested in this as he joined this class with Richard J Novia. And his job is to research this type of thing just like Adam decided to do. Could there be a link there where Adam was working with him to research the school shootings? A student teacher project?

The entire post was very interesting. But this paragraph jumped out at me. As previously discussed, the security cameras did not have any recordings, which is odd. This would explain why there is no video from that day, or any video showing Adam going into the school.