The “Tea Party” is NOT the Enemy

ThirdEyeofHorus
reply to post by Timing

 

And give Obamacare a free pass? I don't think so!!!!! It's time for Congress to stop taking perks while giving up our liberties and our life blood in our name. I don't even care if they blamed the Tea Party, it just shows how petty and trivial these government operatives are, who are bringing Marxism and fascist Totalitarianism to our country with only the Tea Party to say NO already! Even the Occupy movement was primarily concerned with not paying up their student loans and with destroying what's left of free enterprise.
Oh, by the way, I'd like to remind you that G Washington had to beg Congress for shoes for his soldiers when fighting the British army. He fought against terrible odds, so let's get it in perspective shall we? There were 14 yr olds fighting and one of them was my ancestor.

edit on 19-10-2013 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

The constitution has been shredded methodically for a long time. Putting all the blame on the democrats is dishonest. Bush jr was the epitomy of evil killing 3000 people in one day with that heinous false flag and framing alqueda, to use as an excuse to attack afghanistan and iraq(iraq for the second time mind you).

Then comes along obama who will always play the racist card to borrow trillions of dollars from the federal reserve to bailout big business, namely banks, the automotive industry, insurance companies. He continued the wars and got involved in libya as well. We almost got involved in syria. He tried to confiscate as many guns as possible by renacting and strengthing the assault weapons ban(semi autos included).

The tea party needs to pick their fights better. What they did now was akin to a japannese suicide mission called kamikaze during world war 2. They were fortunate to walk away without looking like losers. It is true the democrats took a licking as well in that ACA has been exposed beyond repair. In other words dont look so desperate AND try offering solutions to the economy. Saying I want small government isnt really good enough.

ThirdEyeofHorus
Even the Occupy movement was primarily concerned with not paying up their student loans and with destroying what's left of free enterprise.

Slandering occupy hurts your cause. What they want is less big business favoritism and a smaller military industrial complex for starters. They want much less corruption. They want less wars.

It seems you feel for faux news propaganda of the "dirty, lazy hippies" monologue.

Oh, by the way, I'd like to remind you that G Washington had to beg Congress for shoes for his soldiers when fighting the British army. He fought against terrible odds, so let's get it in perspective shall we? There were 14 yr olds fighting and one of them was my ancestor.

edit on 19-10-2013 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

They may have been shoeless BUT there were many fed up colonialists against the british monarchy. Everyone was a loyalist till they decided to become independant.

How does your example compare with right wing extremism?

ThirdEyeofHorus
reply to post by dlbott

 

Unfortunately they are the enemy. Americans don't act like children. My way or no way, wah wah, change this or i am gonna take my toys and go home lol.

What? And you don't see the Prez arbitrarily making decisions based on his usurpation of power, signing away our rights and liberties with the stroke of a pen in the form of Executive Orders? You could use a little healthy research instead of parroting the liberal media bias. If I were you I'd start with "They Fired The First Shot...2012" by A Friend of Medugorje. He explains the ramifications of some of these EO's by a treacherous and dangerous despot under the guise of bringing more democracy to our Constitutional Republic.
When you realize just how much of a bite he's singlehandedly taken from your private property rights and that of your children, you may become sick to the stomach, unless you love giving your power and freedom away to Big Government and Marxist despots.

edit on 19-10-2013 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

You are spewing the same old BS my friend and selectively only tout your point of view. Guess you missed the part where I said they are both wrong and that most of us good old independent Americans who are not tied to your party line BS know and understand that they are both wrong and that you must have a true and balanced approach. Reform tax code, stop letting greedy corporations get away with tax evasion by headquartering on some island somewhere. Yes we need corporate tax reform but if you want to do business here then you have to pay period, or hey, don't do business here and we will see how that works out for ya.

Give me a break you greedy bast@#$s. Again they are both wrong and must work together period. You can't just cut your way to fiscal correctness, you must have cuts along with revenue. The richest man in America along with numerous others sent letter stating they don't pay their fare share. The tea party and Republican answer was well you can always voluntarily give more. Oh my god, lol.

Some even said well we should give you and us more, that is the answer, then we will invest more. Lolololol,

Of course the wealthy group just shook their collective heads in disbelief. This my friend is the problem, greed, stubbornness, pride, vanity, all of which most religions regard as sins. We need a strong third party now more than ever, just to make the other two compromise lol.

Get serious my friend, be willing to change, you are not always right. And make sure you are honest about it or you are as bad as they are, like I said in the first place they are both wrong.

The Bot

reply to post by dlbott


We need many parties in america, not just three. I could name six or seven right off the bat, because unlike others I have done the research and can tell what each stands for. We also need a socialist party and a communist party, and guess what they already exist. Not liberal globalism, but actually national socialism.

I personally like two parties. green and constitution. they are only registered in about a dozen states. libertarian party is registered on all state ballots but they still got less than one percent of the total national vote. ron paul was both a blessing and a curse at the same time. a blessing because he was a different kind of conservative than the typical conservative, but a curse because he stole votes from gary johnson.

I tell it like it is. I am centrist on most issues and proud of it.

You made a good post. I am just following up on what you said.

The TEA Party and Occupy have their roots in the same basic impulse. Both sense that the power no longer lies with the people anymore. That's about as far as it goes when it comes to commonality.

Occupy wants to abolish free enterprise and individual self rule. While they rightly target big business, the solutions they wanted would pretty much abolish all free business. For starters, one of the Occupy demands was a living wage of $20 paid to anyone and everyone regardless of whether or not they worked. That comes straight out of Marx. The Occupy solution to the problem would have been to empower the very root of the problem - Big Government - which is the only way to even try to enforce the Communist/Marxist Utopia where many of their ideals come from. In the end, we would have been even worse off which is why government bent over backwards to identify with Occupy rather then vilify it.

The TEA Party wants to break down Big Government and cut it off at the knees. They want to remove most of the laws that hamper competition between businesses which have allowed most of the truly big businesses to flourish at the expense of the rest. They want to simplify the tax code to the point where favorable breaks aren't given out to cronies and everyone pays the same rate or pays a flat consumption tax rate with no changes. They want to return American Federal government to the one caged in the Constitution as written by the Founders which would break much of the power of the DC establishment. That's why no one in DC likes the TEA Party; they threaten their meal ticket and cushy pensions.

This thread got away from me but I would like to comment on this post:

amfirst1
This is listed on their website. Does this sound extremist to u?

Yes, some of them do:

15 Non-negotiable Core Beliefs

1. Illegal aliens are here illegally.
3. A strong military is essential.
5. Gun ownership is sacred.
6. Government must be downsized.
7. The national budget must be balanced.
8. Deficit spending must end.
9. Bailout and stimulus plans are illegal.
10. Reducing personal income taxes is a must.
11. Reducing business income taxes is mandatory.
14. English as our core language is required.
15. Traditional family values are encouraged.

I've removed three from that list that I felt weren't extreme positions. 3, 5, 11, 14 and 15 are probably the worst on the list.

reply to post by xuenchen


Look, I'm against all of Congress with a very few exceptions. There is too much fraud going on and not enough policing of it. My dad worked for the GAO, which investigates the crap going on, and the Tea Party is part of that too.
There are a great many loopholes that the Republicans don't want closed. I want them closed. There are a great many cheaters involved in food stamps, welfare, Medicare and Medicaid.... it seems the Democrats don't want them taken care of. Each party has its base supporters that don't mind cheating the rest of us taxpayers in one way or another. The wealthy avoiding taxes the rest of us pay, and the poor and not so poor taking advantage of things meant for the truly needy. The Tea Party almost seems anarchistic. Tear Down The System! Well, if you don't have a BETTER PLAN ready for after than, it will be chaos!
Close the loopholes. Get EVERYONE that can afford taxes to pay taxes, including Corporations!!!!!! There seems to be a lack of understanding that many people now have NO disposable income and can't make ends meet already... they cannot afford to pay taxes until the economy gets better, plain and simple. The rich are getting richer, so they are hoarding wealth that would be better going into the economy. There needs to be work done from BOTH ends of the spectrum. People using food stamps for lobster? Families that have been on Welfare for generations? People unwilling to even attempt to enter the workforce or get an education? Libraries are FREE! I believe in WORKfare. If you get government money, you need to do more than sit on your ass at home. Getting tax breaks when you can't decide if you should buy a 5th house or 2nd yacht? Bull.
We are the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA but we are NOT UNITED.... its everyman for itself. A terrible shame.

reply to post by xuenchen


It is called Gerrymandering, if you are going to talk about this damn subject like you know anything about it I suggest you look it up. You are confusing the poor bunny, who usually has a brain in his head. The districts are drawn specifically to make people like you think the way you do. There is something wrong when the districts look like a kindergartners art project.

Redrawing the map on redistricting.

ketsuko

Occupy wants to abolish free enterprise and individual self rule. While they rightly target big business, the solutions they wanted would pretty much abolish all free business. For starters, one of the Occupy demands was a living wage of $20 paid to anyone and everyone regardless of whether or not they worked. That comes straight out of Marx. The Occupy solution to the problem would have been to empower the very root of the problem - Big Government - which is the only way to even try to enforce the Communist/Marxist Utopia where many of their ideals come from. In the end, we would have been even worse off which is why government bent over backwards to identify with Occupy rather then vilify it.

There is a reason marxism came to be, it didn't happen over night either. There was always the aristocrats, a relatively small middle class, and then lots of poor folks. This was prevalent in the middle ages during feudalism.

They dont want to abolish free enterprise, they simply want big business regulated to the same extent as small and medium size business. Abolish self rule? I guess thats much more subjective than objective, although generally speaking the left believes more in collective rule and less in personal rule.

As for minimum wage laws if we were to take inflation into account the mw should be close to $20/ph. I see no reason why doctors and lawyers can make up to $500/ph and manual unskilled labor making only $7.50. If you think this is ok then there is something terribly wrong with your moral compass.

And how could occupy be worse than liberal globalism? They are against bailouts for everyone, especially against big business bailouts from "the too big to fail" ones. They are against wars and they want a much smaller military-industrial complex.

I think you are exaggerating the differences to some degree.

The TEA Party wants to break down Big Government and cut it off at the knees. They want to remove most of the laws that hamper competition between businesses which have allowed most of the truly big businesses to flourish at the expense of the rest. They want to simplify the tax code to the point where favorable breaks aren't given out to cronies and everyone pays the same rate or pays a flat consumption tax rate with no changes. They want to return American Federal government to the one caged in the Constitution as written by the Founders which would break much of the power of the DC establishment. That's why no one in DC likes the TEA Party; they threaten their meal ticket and cushy pensions.

edit on 19-10-2013 by ketsuko because: subject/verb agreement

Those that make more should bloody well pay more. Taking money from a poor person is denying them food from their table and clothes on their body. Someone who makes $500k per year can afford to eat less lobster and take less vacations, and someone making $5M per year can afford a smaller yacht!

Yes the tax code needs some working. And here is another one. Penalise those that have more than two kids. They burden society with too many problems. The world is already over-populated and this will sometime in the future become a big problem. I am not saying we need any monkey business such as diseases and such, but hit them with more taxes and even throw the parents in jail if they have more than four kids.

The best way to get business to stay in america is hit asian imports with heavy tariffs. They dont need anymore breaks, they need some strong arming to convince them. I am sick and tired of government bending over to wall street investors. We need jobs here in america, not people on unemployment and welfare.

reply to post by links234


A strong military is part of the Constitution. If we can't defend our country, none of the freedoms we enjoy will matter. Most of the countries around the world who don't have much military get away with it because we have ours. Now, no one is saying we can't survive some cuts to the military, but we can't go with European levels, either.

Gun ownership is part of your basic unalienable right as a human being to defend yourself and your property. Unalienable means that it's innate to you and no power or agency of mankind can take it away from you, only oppress you to try to remove it. Guns are the current basic means of self-defense, and without them, we'd have a hard time having any chance of defending ourselves against a government grown too big for its britches. Don't say it can't happen here; it already has. Ask the Cherokee or the Japanese.

Reducing all taxes is a TEA Party basic principle. It would simply be unfair to reduce individual taxes and leave the business taxes the croniest mess that they are. That pretty much means a mandatory reduction.

Most successful countries in the world have one culture that they adhere around. Even the European countries are starting to realize that multi-culti is a failure. Recognizing one language is part of that common culture. You cannot have a common people without that common culture and a common language helps enforce that. No one is asking immigrants to completely stop speaking their primary language, only to learn their new language and culture. I am pretty sure that I would be expected to do so if I expatriate to most other countries in the world. Why should America be any different?

And, oh the horror! You do realize that a traditional family is the basic building block of pretty much all other successful cultures. I am not talking about a Christian family, just a traditional one composed of two parents and their biological children. I suppose we should ignore all the mountains of data that say that such families offer children the best chance to grow into successful, self-reliant individuals in favor of not hurting anyone's feelings? I wish data said otherwise because it would be best given the current lack of traditional families in our country, but they don't.

reply to post by EarthCitizen07


No matter how idealized Marxism is on paper. It doesn't work in real life. It never will.

The only way it ever would is if we suddenly ignored our inner nature and become a hive of ants or bees. Humans work to get ahead, and if you trap people into situations where they only ever work to make the same reward as the guy next to them who only works half as hard doing the same thing, after a while, everyone figures out how to do the absolute least they can for the amount they receive from the system. This is part of the problem with the union system.

And, this is why so many Communist and Fascist countries have cultivated such a fierce strand of nationalism. They need to give the people something to compete against. So they make them all compete against Eastasia or is that Oceania?

They're all like the different bee hives or wasp nests competing against each other.

As for taxes, you are arguing for a progressive tax system which is what we have now. You want people to pay their "fair share." So tell me, what is someone's "fair share?" How much is too much? What amount of my personal property (which is what my income really represents) do I deserve to keep?

There's so much wrong with many aspects of the OP's argument that it's difficult to know where to begin but what infuriates me the most is the general premise:

International banking cartels operate contrary to the interests of the public therefore the Tea Party cannot be "the enemy."

That's a host of fallacies wrapped in a false dichotomy and it's the sort of irrational argument that fosters extreme divisiveness in American political discourse.

So why might a person consider the Tea Party an enemy of the people? Let's start with the fact that the Tea Party Movement is not a grassroots movement that began with anti-tax protests and rose to prominence in the wake of Ron Paul's 2008 presidential campaign as TP leaders would have you believe. It's a collection of non-profit entities serving as conduits for wealthy individuals and corporations to use their money to influence people and policy.

- The first TP related website, www.usteaparty.com, appeared in 2002 and was created by Citizens for a Sound Economy (CSE). CSE was founded by Charles and David Koch in 1984. In 2004, CSE split into two organizations-- Americans for Prosperity (AFP) and FreedomWorks.

- There is compelling evidence to suggest that Tea Party Patriots organization is little more than a front for FreedomWorks.

- The Tea Party Express and its bus tours have been largely sponsored by AFP. Ironically, it's been denounced and accused of "astroturfing" on a number of occasions by the Tea Party Patriots who have claimed that the organization is run by Republican strategists.

- The CEO and Chairman of the Sams Adams Alliance is Eric O'Keefe, who was previously employed by the CSE's Citizen's for Congressional Reform and a member of the Institute for Humane Studies, whose CFO admitted in 2012 that Charles Koch is "a longtime and generous supporter."

- Eric Odom, one of the two founders of #DontGo, worked at the Sam Adams Alliance as "New Media Director" prior to starting the American Liberty Alliance. He has also worked with FreedomWorks and AFP to organize events such as the Conservative Leadership Convention.

It goes on and on-- a seemingly endless series of incestuous, non-profit siblings. Should we then conclude that anyone who supports the alleged ideals of the TP is in favor of manipulation of the American political system by billionaires who are trying to use their wealth and influence to determine the outcome of elections so that they can they can mold our government and our laws to better suit the needs of their empires?

ketsuko
reply to post by links234

 

A strong military is part of the Constitution. If we can't defend our country, none of the freedoms we enjoy will matter. Most of the countries around the world who don't have much military get away with it because we have ours. Now, no one is saying we can't survive some cuts to the military, but we can't go with European levels, either.

I remember reading somewhere that we spend about seven times more for our military than does russia and china on average. I will try to find it. This is wasteful because its not defense, its offense. How many air craft carriers do we need, how many stealth fighters and bombers do we need, how many gas turbine tanks made from depleted uranium?

Gun ownership is part of your basic unalienable right as a human being to defend yourself and your property. Unalienable means that it's innate to you and no power or agency of mankind can take it away from you, only oppress you to try to remove it. Guns are the current basic means of self-defense, and without them, we'd have a hard time having any chance of defending ourselves against a government grown too big for its britches. Don't say it can't happen here; it already has. Ask the Cherokee or the Japanese.

A well regulated miltia means guns can be regulated. Only a gun fanatic will say no firearm should be denied. I say even automatic firearms can be allowed if you pass a special nra course and get approved. I am not for any assault weapons ban, and especially one that includes semi-autos because of the dishonesty involved. I want mild gun control. Yes I think guns should be registered by the state authorities, not the federal government.

There is no such thing as a slippery slope arguement because its a cop-out.

reply to post by EarthCitizen07


I'm not just blaming the Democrat, I'm blaming spineless and treacherous RINO Progressives in the Republican Party too, like McCain and Mitch McConnell.

I am also against endless wars and warring too, as the Rothschilds and other Elites fund both sides of every conflict and profit from it.

I've held off saying anything... Can't help myself. The TEA party make good scapegoats, but they got everybody's attention, didn't they? I agree with a lot of what's been said about the current resident of the white house and his party.
Here's the picture in terms I think even "low information" voters should be able to understand:

reply to post by ketsuko


I am not advocating for communism and exaggerating the other persons opinion is dishonest. You simply dislike all forms of statism as though they are the same. LIberal statism, green statism, welfare statism, military industrial complex and constant war statism, big business statism.

Too much statism is wasteful and intrusive, too little statism is anarchy.

reply to post by theantediluvian

It's a collection of non-profit entities serving as conduits for wealthy individuals and corporations to use their money to influence people and policy.

Oh BULL! Only Freedom Works has any money backing it. The rest of the groups depend on individual donations and volunteer work. Your statement shows just how much you rely on the controlled media for your opinions and information.

The Tea Party Express and its bus tours have been largely sponsored by AFP.

Hmmm maybe and maybe not. I personally know someone who traveled with the T Party Express and ran through all her personal savings to do it. No one paid her for her volunteerism, least of all the Koch bros. I also personally know the head of Americans For Prosperity in my area, and I know that he has paid for things out of his own pocket.
I wonder if you have this same criticism for the Occupy movement who had Adbusters, Soros, and Tides Foundation as backers and organizers. But whatever, people believe what they want to believe.
Oh yah and by the way, some of those Adbusters are from Estonia, a former Communist country. Adbusters are anti-corporate and people who subscribe to Communism are always anti corporate and anti Capitalist.

reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus


Well its pretty obvious that occupy failed and tea party has a monopoly of influence against the globalist machine called new world order. Democrats are still a hijacked party but republicans have managed to cleanse themselves to a large degree.

I wish all these ex-democrats vote either green or for some socialist party out of spite.

EarthCitizen07
reply to post by ThirdEyeofHorus

 

Well its pretty obvious that occupy failed and tea party has a monopoly of influence against the globalist machine called new world order. Democrats are still a hijacked party but republicans have managed to cleanse themselves to a large degree.

I wish all these ex-democrats vote either green or for some socialist party out of spite.

Perhaps it depends on what it meant to be a failure. They did not succeed in destroying the banking cartel, which could only have been it's surface objective, as Soros is part of the banking structure and the NWO with his team of 26 hedge fund operators and his ability to manipulate the market, as well as his Bilderberg connections, but Soros' ends are different, they are to ruin free enterprise and bring in Socialism/Communism, and he just uses the marketplace to his own ends. So did they fail? I'm not entirely certain.

ketsuko
reply to post by links234

 

A strong military is part of the Constitution...

We spend more money on our military than every other country in the world, combined. I'm pretty sure our military is as strong as it needs to be. I'm certain that we could manage some cuts. I don't support the TP effort to maintain or increase our military size, growth and spending.

Gun ownership is part of your basic unalienable right as a human being to defend yourself and your property.

I believe in the right to self defense but I don't believe in the right to allow anyone to own any firearm they want. The TP wants violent felons and abusive husbands to own firarms. The TP wants anyone to be able to purchase a firearm, regardless of criminal history.

Reducing all taxes is a TEA Party basic principle.

I think it's a foolish principle. Do you remember the last time that federal income taxes were raised? 1993. Tax rates aren't high enough for too many people. We should raise taxes. We should be raising lots of taxes. That's taboo though. Everyone wants to spend, spend, spend without taking in any additional revenue. It's stupid and short-sighted.

Most successful countries in the world have one culture that they adhere around. No one is asking immigrants to completely stop speaking their primary language, only to learn their new language and culture.

That's exactly what's being asked! "English only" is a horribly jingoistic and nationalistic ideal to get behind! America is not just one culture, we are many cultures. You cannot define American culture.

And, oh the horror! You do realize that a traditional family is the basic building block of pretty much all other successful cultures. I am not talking about a Christian family, just a traditional one composed of two parents and their biological children.

When the TP starts insisting their members fight for marriage equality I'll start believing what you're saying. Until then 'traditional family' is going to mean one man-one woman when the TP is concerned.