Victorian England Brings Back Food Banks

And yet we sit back and take it whilst the peoples of continental Europe have no qualms about taking to the streets and making their feelings known , oh to be British

How long can you kick a dog before it turns around and bites you .

agentblue
Uh..... What is "solicitor" slang for? It is such a vague term to describe an employment title. For all I know a solicitor is a Jehovah's Witness or a Mormon....

Maybe you should move out of the country and into a third world country.... Don't tell the gov't and keep getting your money but live dang good on what scraps they feed you.

I am sorry, it's the survivalist nature in me to think outside of the box when it comes to looking at economic collapse and making the best of it. I am sure I'd get bashed for even voicing this idea but it was fun and theoretical

edit on 1-10-2013 by agentblue because: (no reason given)

If you don't tell your government your moving out, and where you are going, you wont get your money!
Plus, your government may decide as you are moving out, you are no longer a citizen of that country, and are not 'entitled' to any money.

agentblue
Uh..... What is "solicitor" slang for? It is such a vague term to describe an employment title. For all I know a solicitor is a Jehovah's Witness or a Mormon....

Maybe you should move out of the country and into a third world country.... Don't tell the gov't and keep getting your money but live dang good on what scraps they feed you.

I am sorry, it's the survivalist nature in me to think outside of the box when it comes to looking at economic collapse and making the best of it. I am sure I'd get bashed for even voicing this idea but it was fun and theoretical

edit on 1-10-2013 by agentblue because: (no reason given)

that is exactly what many would have done by now, at least in the USA if it wasn't for having kids. Id be an illegal immigrant in Belize for 6 mos, then coastal Hondurus, then Curacao, etc.. heck, my wife and I would have bailed long ago, but having 2 pretty little girls and 3rd world aren't a comforting combo.

Or living on a sailboat, or living in an RV, etc..

the ELites have many of us because of familial ties. Children unfortunately are the chains of modern slavery.. It is SAD state of humanity..
As a young couple many options for making money or saving it are GONE when a child arrives. And this happens exactly when extra baby expenses arrive.
Now, you can't hold out for a mediocre job. Nope, now that sucky one where the boss gets rich and you cant even get by, that's your life.
Now, you can't rent a room from someone for a few hundred. Now you need a place. triple the living expense.

it snowballs.. when workers become desperate the ELites can plunder.

When their toilet backs up and NOONE is gonna fix it... THEN they will pay more..

When that rich CEO that plundered through vulture capitalizing companies and shafting entire cities is brought to justice.. then people will get fed.

If the people tarred and feathered the first 5 company CEO's that offshored the jobs to the third world then resold the goods and made a KILLING.. along with the stock holders that profited..

then people would get fed..

Or if countries weren't feeding, employing, clothing and housing all the immigrants...there might BE SOME JOBS where PEOPLE COULD FEED THEIRSELVES and some Welfare for those left out

reply to post by gortex


Those that would have taken to the streets backin the 70's and 80's such as in the Poll Tax Riots, are now hamstrung with mortgages and just being able to feed their family. Strikers no longer get any money. Students who used to be the "voice" of the people are saddled with huge debt even before they start working (if they are lucky enough to find a job) The Trade Unions are all but castrated and now have little or not power. The students Trade Unions and working class could make or break a Government, but they made the unions powerless and if no backing and no income who's going to strike or kick up a fuss? Thatcher told us we should all be self employed and home owners and brought in the right to buy for our council houses. Great....in theory. Self employed people have absolutely no back up should their business fail or they have a bad month and whilst its great to be your own boss, the headaches that go with it the bureaucracy and red tape make it a nightmare. Owning your own home means if you don't pay your mortgage you lose your house simple unlike when you were paying rent to the local council.

People are monged out on drugs despite the alleged "war on drugs", they seem even easier to get hold of than ever, they are comatose with reality tv and soaps, they are too lazy and too sick and tired to ever believe they could make a difference anymore, that coupled with the material greed society we have created where everyone wants more and more, means there is little likelihood of a revolution any time soon!

reply to post by phyllida


You pretty much summed it all up there.
Rainbows
Jane

The OP has my sincere sympathies, and she's quite right.

The two groups hated most in this country are the unemployed and paedophiles...and I'm not sure which one is hated more than the other.

6 years ago, when I was briefly unemployed, I was treated like garbage...by Jobcentre staff!

The best thing was, I actually did have a job which I couldn't start till my frucking CRB check cleared.

Obviously, I wasn't supposed to claim benefits and set up home in a cardboard box while waiting for my job to start....

reply to post by phyllida


Phyllida, you have my heart, honey. I totally feel for your situation and your pain. I was made redundant (sacked illegally! ) in January, spent some time on the dole for the first time in my life (I'm 48) and am now self employed, thank the lord. Not an easy option by any means, but at least the stress is different from the nightmare that I experienced in the corporate world. I was a retail manager for a big company, and the stories you hear about them being psychopaths are understated by a long way. I too was ill with the stress it induced and I'm still not fully recovered...probably never will be, but I've learned to manage it, and am healthier than when I was employed by them.

It's been a very swift learning curve about how to make ends meet on a new business salary...that's nothing, in other words. Alright, so my partner has a good job and decent income, but also two very expensive children and ex wife, so yeah....we're both limited, let's say.

The food issue is a big concern with us too. We like to eat well and be healthy, and I have a couple of major food intolerances, probably made much worse by my illness, so we have to work round that. I'm sure you don't need me to lecture about this...you're obviously very smart and well informed, but sharing information is always good, and maybe it will help other people. I've long thought that we need a budget cookery thread here...maybe I will start that.

I've also noticed the food price hikes in places like Tesco...as much as 100% in a week on occasions, although usually less, maybe 30 or 50. We've become very resourceful when it comes to food. I'm trying to buy more veg from the market, and my friend Peter, who grows amazing stuff, just to get out of the Tesco loop. Weirdly, it makes a huge difference to what we eat, and how much we eat.

We're on a budget or about £25 a week, for two adults, and that's all meals, including lunches for us both. We never buy lunch or coffee out anywhere....just too expensive. We've also stopped buying packeted food of any kind, except dried pasta, and a few tins. We don't buy dairy, except for milk, and maybe a chicken to roast for his lunches, which will make a lot of sandwiches. We also have a breadmaker, so no more chemical laden, massively expensive bread either. We never run out of food, the fridge and freezer are always well stocked, and because of where we live, we have to have back up...we're kind of in the middle of nowhere.

More importantly, it occurred to us last night that our idea of what a meal actually is has changed. We regularly use up left overs and half portions from the day before. A healthy soup packed with vegetables and beans is now a meal, not because we're being mean...we love to eat!...but because our appetite has changed. Using organic veg, and decent ingredients that aren't expensive means the food is so much more nourishing...you will get so much more out of it, so you don't need masses of corporate food, with all it's addictive chemicals. I really blame Marks and Spencers for starting all this convenience food nonsense, and regulating our portion control to make us eat more and get fat...they were the first in the 1970's to start it all. Massively profitable, but so harmful.

I think our budget is quite high for most people, and we did a little paper exercise last week and reckoned that we possibly could feed ourselves for maybe £15 a week, if we really had too. And that would be a really good diet.

My personal feeling on this is that they think they have a trapped in their greedy, profit driven, addictive food paradigm...I've seen it from the inside too, remember, and they really genuinely DO NOT CARE about us. All we need to do is eat differently, make our own stuff, even simple stuff with market food, and see how our appetites and health improve.

I don't mean this to be any kind of criticism of you, and I know you're struggling...it's not a good situation to be in. I wish you all the best! You will find a way out of this, and I remind myself that intelligence combined with a strong sense of integrity will win over their greedy, fascist "smartness" that they use to manipulate us. Food is a weapon...we need to take it back.

when i go to the local shops i am shocked at the prices that tesco and co are charging every time you go in prices have gone uo 5- 10 or more % .

i found a old till recipt from 2008 and it shocked me how much things had gone up in that 5 years it has not gone on wages as most people are on the same as then or petrol as it is the same .

so how has food gone up that much in 2001 a barrell of oil was $ 29 now it is $110 but we the people are not seeing any better life through social care everything is getting cut so where is all this money going .

get some ground any ground and grow your own and barter it is the only way out of this mess tesco/asda etc need you not the other way around remember that .

their chickens are fed gmo corn in the far east and flown here they cost less than £1 on the shelf a mark up of 500% .
i only buy reduced food from them and get most of my food reduced or grow my own it is the only way possible .

i am unable to work but i do not sign on but i manage to survive quite good i have free internet free housing and live good on £15 most weeks all it takes is a little imagination and a bit of hard work and £20 of seeds at the start of the year

reply to post by caitlinfae


Hiya thanks for your kind words. Always nice to share....even if its misery

I had a strange experience 4 months ago which has helped me enormously actually. I had a strange dream about something I couldn't remember except when I woke up I had this word in my head tilapia. No idea what it was or what it meant or even how to spell it lol so googled it and found it was a type of fish. No idea why I was dreaming of fish either!! Went onto Tesco later that morning as in the morning all the reduced stuff is out (you learn these little nuggets in our position !) and on the fish counter was the sign "Special Offer Tilapia Fillets £2 each". You could have knocked me over with a feather! So I bought 2, looked up how to cook them and bugger me if it wasn't the best meal me and my daughter have had in probably years!

Now the point is, that prior to that 4 months ago I have NEVER cooked. Didn't want to...didn't know how to...wasn't interested. We lived off ready meals and take aways and just about anything that was quick and easy. Four months later I haven't even looked at a ready meal, in fact I can barely stand to look at them and all the crappy ingredients. I cook like a pro and enjoy every minute of it and now I have my cupboard stocked up with the necessities, herbs spices vinegars etc I find I can cook super nutritional food at the drop of a hat. Its now far cheaper to just buy the meat and some fresh veg as and when than the hundreds I would spend on rubbish processed stuff.

Guess "God" showed me the way ....my daughter and friends can't believe that I've finally started cooking after 53yrs on this planet!!

But on a side note, I think it pretty damn awful the way poverty and struggle makes you lose your pride and self worth.

Most of the time I'm angry but dealing with that in my own way...angry at not being able to do anything about well, anything really.

reply to post by geobro


Unfortunately the old days of allotments are long gone. Where I am nr Bradford almost all allotments have now been taken over and turned into car parks or housing estates. Prior to that there was allotment inspectors going around saying this and that was unsafe and food grown on certain ones wasn't fit for consumption etc. Clearly a way of preventing people growing their own food. I recall a friend of my stepfather being threatened with a fine if he didn't remove the rain barrel from his land as it wasn't his water apparently!!

I live in a flat above a shop....so have no garden. Land is at a premium with various associations and builders buying up any and every spare bit they can due to the Government's incentive to build as many houses per square metre as they can which is why you see so many flats/apartments going up in record time.

I'm not particularly griping at my own situation, I just worry immensely for my children and their children and then to make matters worse, I noticed today the headlines of 1 newspaper saying that Cameron was thinking of preventing anyone under 25 from claiming benefits!! Ok nice idea...will fix the figures good and proper...but who the hell is going to support these poor folk?? If they don't stay on at school go into training or apprenticeships they get sod all. When my daughter reaches 18 in two years, the little benefit I get stops and yet she isn't allowed to claim anything as fingers crossed she will go to university, so I have to support her on less money! Where's the sense in that?

I know a few people whose children have had to leave home simply because the parents cannot afford to support them on benefits, so the kids leave home, become homeless or pregnant, get housed and put on benefits and the cycle starts again

reply to post by phyllida


You're welcome.. and I think it's good that you're angry, in a way. I've always found it to be a very creative state. And you should be ridiculously proud of yourself for the way you've coped. You've learned a whole set of new and massively useful skills all by yourself, which most people just don't have any more...you can cook! Do you know how valuable that is? How many people just can't make soup, for god's sake. Maybe you should write a blog on real food and how to cope on a budget. There was a thing recently about low income food stuff on the BBC, not that I watch much tv, but it was amazing to see what people thought they had to put us with. Maybe you would find it on I Player.

I'm a big fan of soup myself...so versatile, damned easy to make, and very good for you. I use all kinds of ingredients besides vegetables, like coconut milk (ok, it's expensive, but not as costly as meat, and very nutritious...slightly exotic too), then add some rice, and a little bit of spicy stuff and you've got a whole fabulous meal in one pot.

reply to post by phyllida

who needs gardens phone a few local decoraters and ask them for emulsion buckets and fill them with soil put holes in the bottoms for drainage .

put a advert up in local shops or gumtree for a garden you will be suprised how many people would be glad to get rid off one then sell spare veg to hotels etc .

got a loft grow some green with led lights people i know do and they do well mind you they have the care factor of 0 and the attitude that the worst the goverment can do is give you 3 meals a day and a warm bed it does make one think though .

ps have a look at blacks law 1933 edition for a human being funny old world

reply to post by caitlinfae


I was just about to post about fruit trees until I saw that you live in a flat...bummer. We've just cropped some of the trees in our garden and the amount of jam we can make is mad. And there are still loads left. And we gave some to friends.

Anyway...I was also wondering if there is something like a garden buddy scheme where you live? Maybe someone with a larger garden would love some help to look after it in exchange for you growing your own stuff in it for food. Or containers...it's amazing what you can grow in containers...even potatoes. If you've learned to cook like you have in such a short time, I bet you would be a great gardener.

reply to post by caitlinfae


My stepfather who had a stroke started to grow his own food as he was even poorer than I was and after a lifetime of working!! He had pear tree peach tree and plum tree, cobbled together a greenhouse and had numerous paint pots full of veg. His trees were stolen believe it or not and his greenhouse raided so many times it just wasn't worth the hassle poor old bloke.

Garden sharing or looking after other folks' gardens and growing stuff is a sound idea, except I live in the town centre, dont drive and am housebound now with severe rheumatoid arthritis and SIJD so digging bending carrying is an impossibility. Sounds like excuses I know, but alas tis the truth of the matter. My son takes me shopping once a forthnight and other than that with living in the town centre the most I go out is to the butchers and the charity shops if my daughter needs clothes.

One thing I've noticed about people generally is, that if they can't see something wrong with you, they tend to a)forget you're actually ill or b) don't believe you're disabled in the first place and c) because of all the hype over benefits and scroungers automatically disregard you and your circumstances as being of your own making.

Or you're simply not trying hard enough

Even if I wasn't ill, getting a job at my age is nigh on impossible too. I do whatever I can. I tried working briefly in a coffee bar, tried working at a washing machine factory but my fingers aren't dextrous enough apparently, tried self employment but there is no help for people my age, all grants and programmes are designed and aimed at young people so I found. Even the Local Enterprise people were suprised there was nothing in place for older people to become self employed.

Its called the poverty trap for a reason...its quite apt! But hey ho not much longer to go and I'll be dead and one less sponger on the system

reply to post by phyllida


Someone stole his fruit trees? That's mental! I hear what you're saying about your disabilities...that's very tough to deal with. I thought I has RA till the blood tests showed up negative, so I know how bad the pain can be. I'm sure it's fibromyalgia....not a lot of fun, and no formal diagnosis either.

Anyway...what about New Enterprise Allowance? The charmers at the job centre didn't bother to tell me about it...I found out about it by accident, and I don't believe there is an age limit on it.

reply to post by caitlinfae


I will have a look at the new enterprise allowance see what it is about.

Yup they stole his trees lol he was flabbergasted but just goes to show how desperate some folk are

Nope definitely RA and coeliac disease and sacro iliac joint displacement due to my last pregnancy 16yrs ago now which means my hip is slightly lower and further back than my other which puts stress on the muscles of the thigh and back as they are slightly twisted. For years I'd been saying I felt "out of line" they called it fibromyalgia, however as I've now discovered fibromyalgia is simply a name for a group of symptoms that they don't know the cause of.

Suffered with various pills and potions for years until I finally had to give up work. Then 2yrs ago my eldest daughter's bf came over from greece and spotted the sign "osteopath" down the road from me and said good greek word go see him, he'll fix you lol. I saved up the cash (quite reasonable really) and within 3 visits I was walking again and felt great. Unfortunately its a treatment of diminshing returns and I can't always afford it anyway but...as soon as he looked at me from the back he saw my hip was out, only by cms but makes a huge difference to your body and he was the one who suggested RA and blood tests which after months of battling my gp I finally got and yes it was positive and for gout too just to round things off nicely lol

My osteo said that for every pain there is a cause and its just a matter of finding the cause so it can be treated and if not treated, it can be made manageable or less painful or both.

I find it all sickening to be honest, I feel myself getting drawn into debates with working class Tories more and more often. People appear to have been duped into going along with these policies that are driving the lower classes further into poverty while the rich, may of whom fund or benefit the Tories (whether it be directly or underhandedly) prosper with tax cuts.

I place some of the blame on the right wing tabloids aimed at the working class here such as the Daily Mail. As you say OP the poor, unemployed, disabled, immigrants are being made scapegoats in this, our problems being blamed on so called 'benefit scroungers' which are in reality few and far between.

I am sorry to hear about your personal situation OP and if starting up as self employed is something you feel is an option for you I am sure there are folk on here who could offer some advice (myself included) as I know how little help there was out there for me when I went self employed. I was very lucky to have my DH able to bring in an income while I got things up and running, and fortunatley what I do didn't require any money to start with.

Just a little reading for those that don't believe things are seriously as bad as they are. Notice the mention once again of a food bank opening.

Poorest City In Britain

How can people ever hope for change when no-one is able or willing to rebel? When those that used to can't and when all of us poor folk live in fear fortnightly that our money will be stopped and we will starve? Where is the good or right in that?

For some it is beyond our control whether we work or not and to be victimised for being ill is just plain wrong. Why should I have to scrimp and scrape just to exist? Why should my daughter wear only second hand clothes? Why should I have to dread Christmas and birthdays when once I used to love them and enjoy giving?

Is it any wonder people turn to drugs alcohol prostitution etc just to get by? We aren't talking of people doing these things for luxuries, there are women I know who occasionally do prostitute themselves just for food or to pay the extortionate gas/electricity bills.

Wrong and should be happening in this enlightened progressive 21st century

Sorry I'm a bit mad now....long conversation with the Benefits Agency who as it happens seem to have no clue from month to month what rules are in force or not!

reply to post by phyllida


Don`t get me started on chicken lol Couple of years back it was 2 quid for 2 chicken breasts, now at same supermarket you have to buy 3 for £8.40?????? I don`t think theres a chicken shortage or embargo at the moment.

reply to post by fenian8


and let me guess, Raising chickens is outlawed??