Pilot admits chemtrails and says they are a "necessary evil"........

reply to post by OneManArmy

Who were "they" and can you provide documentary proof of their claims?

Can you explain in this case the contrail behaviour of the same aircraft on consecutive days? Sabena OO-SGA (A Boeing 747) one day leaving no trail at all,the next day a trail that was still there 6 hours later and the next day a trail that was gone after 5 minutes?

Aloysius the Gaul
reply to post by OneManArmy

 

I wonder how many of those "views" are people looking at the video and saying "what an idiot!"?

And of course sensationalist scaremongering gets a lot of views - the MSM has known that for decades - conspiracy hoaxes are just the latest iteration.

However as the saying goes - if 50 million people believe a wrong thing it remains a wrong thing.

The existence or otherwise of chemtrails is not determined by vote.

edit on 17-11-2013 by Aloysius the Gaul because: (no reason given)

Im saying that all these "believers" or "chemmies" or even so far as "hoaxers" as you call them are winning the infowar, you need to get your game up. You are losing the battle for truth quite decisively.
Does that mean you debunkers are inadequate? Or does it mean the "hoaxers" are more intelligent?
Or does it just mean that most people will believe something, even if it is a lie, if its presented in a certain way?

Thats all Im saying. After all your hard work on multiple forums debunking the chemtrail theory, much more needs to be done.
The majority believes what the MSN tells them, of course majority belief doesnt make something true. But scripted news is exactly the same animal as a conspiracy "hoax". They are lies for political or financial gain.
Unleashed on the unsuspecting public by liars, some are supposed to be the good guys, and some are certainly not.
They are both the exact same thing..... propaganda. It pervades our modern world like a disease that is destroying our humanity one little piece at a time.

Imagewerx
reply to post by OneManArmy

 

Who were "they" and can you provide documentary proof of their claims?

The Ministry of Defence turned large parts of the country into a giant laboratory to conduct a series of secret germ warfare tests on the public.
A government report just released provides for the first time a comprehensive official history of Britain's biological weapons trials between 1940 and 1979.

Many of these tests involved releasing potentially dangerous chemicals and micro-organisms over vast swaths of the population without the public being told.

Source - The Guardian

OneManArmy

Yes I remember seeing many contrails over my life, some more persistent than others(usually linked to altitude), but what I didnt used to see is contrails combining and spreading to haze up THE WHOLE SKY. They used to gradually fade from the end of the tail of the contrail towards the plane that left it. For a water droplet to form it needs a nucleus, in the form of particles, carbon in soot or dust is a good example. For contrails to spread across a vast area such as THE WHOLE SKY it would take a lot of particulates for all the tiny water droplets required to do so. It would also require particular conditions at the required altitude to form very small water droplets that simply hang in the atmosphere for very long periods of time. H2O needs a particle to cling to in the higher atmosphere before coalescing into a heaver water droplet. Water doesnt appear out of nowhere, it requires humidity. Last I heard planes didnt exhaust water droplets.

no - but they do exhaust water vapour -



plus there is a very small mount of particulates simply from the mechanical wear that is going on in the engine - aluminium, steel, rubber, bronze, etc.

and if the local humidity is extremely high then the humidity will spontaneously precipitate and then instantly freeze because it is -40C or colder!

and once the process starts of course the ice itself becomes nucleation sites for further humidity to precipitate- and that is how "it" covers the whole sky from a single trail - it is not the content of the trail that you are seeing, it is the formerly invisible water vapour that has precipitated out because the trail has given it something the nucleate on.

So what are they exhausting?

now you know

Do they always use the same fuel?

Yes they do - for civilian airliners it is almost exclusively Jet A1. A few civil airliners have used

Can they use specific fuel with "additives" at different set times?(Like I can with my car)

Yes they can - but the additives have to be approved by both the engine manufacturer and the civil aviation authorities.

the list of approved additives is included in the specification for Jet A1, and you can find that online easily enough - eg here - the name of the specification is Def Std 91-91, Revision 7

These questions need to be asked.

Indeed - if you don't know then they are perfectly reasonable, and I hope my answers help.

I have been lied to and cheated and taken for a complete idiot by the very people you debunkers are asking me to trust.

I don't know who that is, but on the places I frequent clear and concise questions such as you have asked are not a problem to answer.

The whole difference could simply be down to the make up of the fuel and its chemical makeup due to "environmental" regulation, it could be a lot more sinister, especially if the UN is involved. Thats my fear.

the make up of the fuel can be easily checked against the standard I linked to above - anyone at all can go to a fuel supplier and buy Jet A1 - they might want you to buy a minimum quantity I guess so I'd budget for a 44 gal/210l drum for example - and then get it tested against that standard.

Eg these guys will sell you Jet A1 in Scandinavia and I am sure others will do so in other parts of the world.

reply to post by OneManArmy

This has nothing to do with so called modern "chemtrails".Zinc cadmium sulphide was used because it wasn't the same colour as "normal" clouds,and the other chemicals were all released at ground level.Either from trucks driving along public roads or ships moored off the coast.None of these were from commercial airliners (or military transports) flying 7 or 8 miles above our heads.
You still haven't given an answer to my question about the same plane on different days giving varying persistence contrails?

reply to post by OneManArmy

The chemtrail conspiracy is very coordinated to the point it could be a grand psyop to guide opinion pre GE.

Very well coordinated you say, because the chemtrail believers haven't been able to agree on what exactly is being sprayed.

If you were that organized then why can't we get photos of the planes and the facility where the so called chemicals are loaded?

Being well organised means you would be able to answer the questions asked to you.

Aloysius the Gaul


Indeed - if you don't know then they are perfectly reasonable, and I hope my answers help.

Yes they do, thanks. Im assuming NxO stands for both nitrous oxide and nitrous dioxide.

I don't know who that is, but on the places I frequent clear and concise questions such as you have asked are not a problem to answer.

Im lied to an a weekly basis by the media and TPTB, those that are supposed to be protecting me from "terrorists", from disease, and from ignorance, are fueling all three, and attacking me by taking away my personal freedoms of thought and expression.
Those are the people I cannot trust.

Imagewerx
reply to post by OneManArmy

 

This has nothing to do with so called modern "chemtrails".Zinc cadmium sulphide was used because it wasn't the same colour as "normal" clouds,and the other chemicals were all released at ground level.Either from trucks driving along public roads or ships moored off the coast.None of these were from commercial airliners (or military transports) flying 7 or 8 miles above our heads.
You still haven't given an answer to my question about the same plane on different days giving varying persistence contrails?

I havent given you an answer about the same plane and its contrails on different days because I dont know, nor have I claimed to know. I have claimed that Im here to find out.

You should read more of the article because they didnt simply release Zinc cadmium sulfide, they also released e-coli.

While the Government has insisted the chemical is safe, cadmium is recognised as a cause of lung cancer and during the Second World War was considered by the Allies as a chemical weapon.

n another chapter, 'Large Area Coverage Trials', the MoD describes how between 1961 and 1968 more than a million people along the south coast of England, from Torquay to the New Forest, were exposed to bacteria including e.coli and bacillus globigii , which mimics anthrax. These releases came from a military ship, the Icewhale, anchored off the Dorset coast, which sprayed the micro-organisms in a five to 10-mile radius.

The report also reveals details of the DICE trials in south Dorset between 1971 and 1975. These involved US and UK military scientists spraying into the air massive quantities of serratia marcescens bacteria, with an anthrax simulant and phenol.

Similar bacteria were released in 'The Sabotage Trials' between 1952 and 1964. These were tests to determine the vulnerability of large government buildings and public transport to attack. In 1956 bacteria were released on the London Underground at lunchtime along the Northern Line between Colliers Wood and Tooting Broadway. The results show that the organism dispersed about 10 miles. Similar tests were conducted in tunnels running under government buildings in Whitehall.

Experiments conducted between 1964 and 1973 involved attaching germs to the threads of spiders' webs in boxes to test how the germs would survive in different environments. These tests were carried out in a dozen locations across the country, including London's West End, Southampton and Swindon. The report also gives details of more than a dozen smaller field trials between 1968 and 1977.

You should read the whole article.

tsurfer2000h


If you were that organized then why can't we get photos of the planes and the facility where the so called chemicals are loaded?

If "Im that organised"?

I have said many many times, Im on the wall. Im making my observation based on my short experience researching this subject. Im not on any side of this debate except for taking the role of devils advocate for the chemtrail cause. It doesnt mean Im a "chemmie", a "hoaxer", a "fool", it means Im learning, what to avoid in this debate and what not to. That is what Im doing.

Im not belittling the "debunkers" Im just making an observation as an observer and researcher of this whole subject.
Im sorry if that statistical fact put you on the defensive, but hey "theres lies, damned lies and then there are statistics".

reply to post by OneManArmy

Im lied to an a weekly basis by the media and TPTB, those that are supposed to be protecting me from "terrorists", from disease, and from ignorance, are fueling all three, and attacking me by taking away my personal freedoms of thought and expression.
Those are the people I cannot trust.

And how does any of this relate to so called chemtrails, and just because you don't trust anybody, that goes to validate chemtrails are being sprayed.

What personal freedoms and thoughts and expression are being taken away, because for some reason I seem to have them and everything is fine...

So...

reply to post by OneManArmy

I did read the whole article,and again it has nothing to do with the modern idea of chemtrails.I have no doubt that the information contained in it is true with respect to them conducting experiments involving unsuspecting members of the public.If this information is correct and their experiments can be proven to have caused birth defects,then of course they should be held fully accountable for their actions.

My point about the same aircraft with the same engines burning the same fuel on consecutive days.One day it would leave a normal contrail behind it,the next day it would leave what some 20 years later would be known as a chemtrail.The next day it might not leave any kind of trace behind it.The same aircraft verified by it's radio callsign (they used the registration a lot beck in those days,now they always use the flight number) and on a clear day being able to see the markings on it visible as the airline it claimed to be.Why would a commercial airline be "spraying" one day,then the same aircraft be not "spraying" the next day? Why would the Spitfires,Hurricanes and Messerschmits some 70 years ago also have been busy spraying away when all they wanted to do was save their homes and families lives or to make way for their leaders new world order?

reply to post by OneManArmy

Im saying that all these "believers" or "chemmies" or even so far as "hoaxers" as you call them are winning the infowar, you need to get your game up. You are losing the battle for truth quite decisively.
Does that mean you debunkers are inadequate? Or does it mean the "hoaxers" are more intelligent?
Or does it just mean that most people will believe something, even if it is a lie, if its presented in a certain way?

How does one win an infowar with debunked info?

Losing the battle for the truth...



Most chemtrail believers do believe anything that is told to them especially if it is from youtube.

tsurfer2000h


What personal freedoms and thoughts and expression are being taken away, because for some reason I seem to have them and everything is fine...

So...

OK where do I begin?

13 Yr old child loses freedom to play with toy guns

I lost the freedom to express myself online as the whole NSA scandal as presented by Edward Snowden showed.

My emails are scanned by google to "market" to me.
Source

I cannot fly commercially without being xray scanned.
Source

Im not allowed to think that homosexuality is wrong, not that I care, but Im not "allowed" to be against it.
Im not allowed to cause offence, even though Im offended by the MSN and government on an almost daily basis.

My freedom of thought and expression only goes so far as to not cause offence. And some people get offended by trivialities. Some people get offended when they come to the reaslisation that the wool has been pulled so far over there eyes that they couldnt see the "big picture". Offence is an easy thing to cause. Im sure you are offended that people "fall for the chemtrail lies", should that deny them the right to find out for themselves?
NO!!!

Freedom of thought and expression is a cornerstone of "civilisation" and "culture", as our freedoms are stifled, so is our culture(creativity and art). Im sorry you cannot see it, hopefully one day, not too far away, it will become blindingly apparent. As it already is to me.

tsurfer2000h
reply to post by OneManArmy

 

Im saying that all these "believers" or "chemmies" or even so far as "hoaxers" as you call them are winning the infowar, you need to get your game up. You are losing the battle for truth quite decisively.
Does that mean you debunkers are inadequate? Or does it mean the "hoaxers" are more intelligent?
Or does it just mean that most people will believe something, even if it is a lie, if its presented in a certain way?

How does one win an infowar with debunked info?

Losing the battle for the truth...

Its blindingly apparent in the likes vs dislikes of these chemtrail videos.
Even if you have done the most thorough decisive debunking, the people out there on the interwebs aint getting your message.
The battle for perceived truth(through propaganda) is the very definition of "infowar/psyop".

On a phone I have even more trouble posting links and quotes so please be understanding.

Insight into the truth behind chemtrails!

Without a doubt
Chemtrails And Terror
In The Age Of Nuclear War
By Amy Worthington
Idaho Observer
6-3-4

2. Dumping tons of particulate matter from aircraft has geo-engineered our planetary atmosphere into a highly charged, electrically-conductive plasma useful for military projects.8 The air we breathe is laden with asbestos-sized synthetic fibers and toxic metals, including barium salts, aluminum, and reportedly, radioactive thorium.9 These materials act as electrolytes to enhance conductivity of military radar and radio waves.10 Poisonous on par with arsenic and a proven suppressant of the human immune system,11 atmospheric barium weakens human muscles, including those of the heart.12 Inhaled aluminum goes directly to the brain and medical specialists confirm that it causes oxidative stress within brain tissue, leading to formation of Alzheimer's like neurofibrillary tangles.13 Radioactive thorium is known to cause leukemia and other cancers.

www.rense.com..." target="_blank" class="postlink">Chemtrails real purpose

Hasn't Pine Gap USA base in the middle of Australia been referred to as a communication listening spy base to ears drop on the world?

The mass spraying around here does fit especially when elections and talk of war is happening, not sure why that is.

My link to
Chemtrails And Terror
In The Age Of Nuclear War
By Amy Worthington
Idaho Observer
6-3-4. Is having trouble I see,

Chemtrails purpose


Part of what is happening in the atmosphere above us involves the Pentagon,s secret space weapons program, designed for strategic, operational and tactical levels of war. NASA missions will soon be transferred to Pentagon control.1 The Air Force Space Command declares that, in order to monitor and shape world events, it must fight intense, decisive wars with great precision from space.2 Air Force Secretary James G. Roche has stated: "Space capabilities are integrated with, and affect every link in the kill chain.

Easy to see why the debunkers try so hard

reply to post by OneManArmy

I lost the freedom to express myself online as the whole NSA scandal as presented by Edward Snowden showed.

No you didn't and here is why...

The 1st Amendment which allows you freedom of speech.

reply to post by fireyaguns

Chemtrails purpose

If you think that your going to find the truth on Rense you are sadly mistaken, as he is also a big pusher in the chemtrail hoax.

tsurfer2000h
reply to post by OneManArmy

 

I lost the freedom to express myself online as the whole NSA scandal as presented by Edward Snowden showed.

No you didn't and here is why...

The 1st Amendment which allows you freedom of speech.

LOL, you really believe that?

The constitution and bill of rights and habeas corpus and posse comitatus have been decimated.
You dont honestly think they are still relevant to modern america?

We are having words removed from modern parlance(newspeak).

Do you read much of the stuff on this site or do you regard it all to be the ramblings of madmen?

reply to post by tsurfer2000h


Yep you're spot on. That's why you don't like this I'd say

The truth

In their quest to remain top dog in the kill chain, the purveyors of perpetual war have deliberately dimmed earth,s life-giving sunlight5 and reduced atmospheric visibility6 with lung-clogging particulates and polymers. This ecological terrorism has severely compromised public health, according to thousands of testimonials. Years of mass appeals to legislators, media and military officials for information, and for cessation of catastrophic atmospheric degradation, have fallen on deaf bureaucratic ears. Public awareness of what befalls us remains as murky as our skies because those "in the know" are muzzled by national secrecy laws and Americans have no authority to challenge matters of national security. Left to gather clues, we know this much so far: