Jerusalem isn't mentioned by name in the book of Revelation.

(If I say something that is right, then God has inspired me. If I say something that is wrong, then it is my own mistake.)


The city of Jerusalem, mentioned hundreds of times throughout the Bible, could well be considered as the center stage of most of the Bible. Strangely however, when it comes to the Book of Revelation, the city of Jerusalem is not mentioned by name even a single time!

While the name “Jerusalem” appears thrice in the Book of Revelation, none of those are references to the earthly city of Jerusalem, that we know as the capital of modern Israel. Rather, they are all references to a heavenly city called the “new” Jerusalem. The earthly city of Jerusalem is unflatteringly alluded to via symbols and hints :
- as the place where Jesus was crucified.
- as symbolic “Egypt” and “Sodom”
- as Babylon, the city that had the blood of holy men. (Refer to Matthew 23:37)
- as the whore – representing a city – drunk with the blood of holy men.

(Refer to my other thread detailing how the whore of Babylon is Biblically identified as Jerusalem.)


By not mentioning the earthly city of Jerusalem by name, the author tip toes around the subject, while dropping plenty of hints for the unbiased reader to know exactly what city he was talking about. Thus, it can be inferred that the writer of Revelation either had a major axe to grind with Jerusalem OR he indeed had visions about Jerusalem the way it is portrayed in the Book of Revelation. Either way, it’s evident that in Revelation, the earthly city of Jerusalem is not aligned with the forces of good and is headed towards destruction.

The very idea of a “new” Jerusalem raises to mind the question on as to what becomes of the “Old” Jerusalem. The obvious answer is that the old Jerusalem is being replaced by the heavenly city. By putting the pieces together, we can gather that the old Jerusalem, is the destroyed city of Revelation 18, which in the previous chapter, was symbolized as the whore. The Bible shows us that the blood of holy men are on the hands of three entities- Jerusalem, the whore that symbolized a city and the city of Babylon. These three entities are one and the same, but referred to under different names.


Jerusalem’s crime of spilling the blood of holy men is something that needs to be emphasized as it holds the key to resolving a great portion of the mysteries found in the Book of Revelation. When Christians still choose to defend Jerusalem from the crimes of prophet killing - something that Jesus himself accused Jerusalem of - they do so to defend their own pro-Israel outlook on Jerusalem. It is because they have been led to believe that Israel is aligned to the forces of “good”, or that Israel will enjoy the special protection of Jesus when he returns. Unfortunately for Zionist Christians, they have a major surprise in store for them and it is better that we wait this one out and see the final outcome with our own eyes.

God knows best!

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
When Christians still choose to defend Jerusalem from the crimes of prophet killing - something that Jesus himself accused Jerusalem of - they do so to defend their own pro-Israel outlook on Jerusalem.

When people bring up that the Jewish prophets from 2,000 -4,000 years ago were killed in Jerusalem, they conveniently forget that the people alive today had nothing to do with it and that Jerusalem today doesn't need to be punished or looked down upon because of what people did thousands and thousands of years ago in that place. And to use your own words ... people who look down on Jerusalem because of what happened thousands of years ago do so to defend their own anti-Israel outlook on Jerusalem.

It is because they have been led to believe that Israel is aligned to the forces of “good”, or that Israel will enjoy the special protection of Jesus when he returns.

Those with an anti-Israel outlook have it because they have been led to believe that Israel is aligned to the forces of 'bad', or that Israel will be squashed when the imaginary 12th Imam comes with his sidekick Jesus.

Unfortunately for Zionist Christians, they have a major surprise in store for them and it is better that we wait this one out and see the final outcome with our own eyes.

Unfortunately for anti-Israel/Jewish Muslims (and others), they have a major surprise in store for them and it is better that we wait this one out and see the final outcome with our own eyes.

God knows best!

Yep. And people don't know much at all. They think they do. But they don't.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


Nice post!
Its very obvious that the city/country that now occupies the area is as ungodly as it can get.
The israel is preparing for the coming of their Messiah but only a fool would think that they are waiting for Jesus pbuh. More likely they would believe the Anti-Christ to be their messiah and its stupid to think that AC will rule over and get accepted by a righteous and godly israel more likely that a corrupt, greedy, fornicating group would follow the AC at least till Jesus pbuh returns and kills the AC.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n

The very idea of a “new” Jerusalem raises to mind the question on as to what becomes of the “Old” Jerusalem.

Zechariah 14:2

2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

The verse above is just one example of what happens to Jerusalem, but if you want all of the remaining details you should read all of Zechariah, chapters 12 through 14.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n

. . . Jerusalem, that we know as the capital of modern Israel.

Jerusalem is the capital of the country of Palestine.
The capital of the Jewish so-called state is Tel Aviv.

. . . it’s evident that in Revelation, the earthly city of Jerusalem is not aligned with the forces of good and is headed towards destruction.

I think so.
I don't go along with the idea that futurists promote, that Revelation was written in 90 AD or thereabouts.
I think that it would have been written earlier, when John would have actually been alive, and before the fall of Jerusalem in 70 AD, that brought with it the destruction of Herod's temple.

reply to post by jmdewey60

Israelis and Palestinians both claim Jerusalem as their capital, as Israel maintains its primary governmental institutions there and the State of Palestine ultimately foresees it as its seat of power; however, neither claim is widely recognized internationally.

en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by logical7

The israel is preparing for the coming of their Messiah but only a fool would think that they are waiting for Jesus pbuh.

The zionist regime merely calling itself Israel has currently its Messiah, in the person of Netanyahu, and we will see how that works out for them.
The Jews have this document that they revere over the Torah itself, called the book of Esther, which teaches that if you are righteous, you basically already have the power of God and you can do anything you want to those you consider unrighteous, meaning anyone not themselves.

reply to post by Deetermined

. . . both claim . . .

In the hypothetical "Greater Israel" they expect to have after destroying Syria.

reply to post by FlyersFan


The problem here is that I am basing my argument on the Bible...which has prophecies talking about future events. The idea that Jerusalem is on the path to destruction is a Biblical matter.

I'm looking for discussions with Bible references... debates regarding theology... not personal opinion.

reply to post by sk0rpi0n

Ah .. okay ... just Revelation. I don't buy it being from God.
Carry on with your 'Jerusalem is bad' campaign. Have fun.

Side note ... debates about theology ARE personal opinion.

reply to post by jmdewey60

Jerusalem is the capital of the country of Palestine.
The capital of the Jewish so-called state is Tel Aviv.

Either way, Jerusalem happens to be within modern Israel.
Palestine, to most of the world is just one big slum within the borders of "Israel".

I think that it would have been written earlier, when John would have actually been alive, and before the fall of Jerusalem in 70 AD, that brought with it the destruction of Herod's temple.

Revelations speaks of future events - the establishment of the beasts rule, and after his defeat - the final victory of good over evil.

Even if Jerusalem fell in 70 AD, we know that it is not a fulfillment of the text, because a lot of other events outlined in Revelations haven't taken place.

reply to post by jmdewey60


In my personal opinion, since the book of Zechariah is pretty clear about an upcoming battle revolving around Jerusalem, I expect all of these prophecies to take place around the time that Israel or Palestine, either one, start negotiating which one gets to claim it as their "official" capitol or even if they try to split it up as both of their capitols.

reply to post by FlyersFan

Ah .. okay ... just Revelation. I don't buy it being from God.

Then don't expect me to first convince you that it is.

Carry on with your 'Jerusalem is bad' campaign.

Your Bible tells me that Jerusalem was guilty of killing prophets.
I hope you realize that. You are a real Bible following Christian aren't you?

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
Your Bible tells me that Jerusalem was guilty of killing prophets.
I hope you realize that. You are a real Bible following Christian aren't you?

Jerusalem thousands of years ago killed prophets.
That has nothing to do with the people who live there today.
I don't hold that against them. They had nothing to do with it.

I don't hold what Hitler did against the Germans who are alive today.
They aren't the same people and they reject that kind of behavior
I don't hold what the Japanese did at Pearl Harbor against the Japanese who are alive today.
They aren't the same people and they reject that kind of behavior.

Thinking that Jerusalem is somehow eternally 'bad' because of the behavior of ignorant peasants who lived there thousands of years ago is really, really DUMB. The people there now are not those who did the killing and they reject that kind of behavior.

Thinking that Jerusalem is eternally bad and damned because of things that happened there thousands of years ago is a prime example of why people think religions/religious people are backwards and that they have no place in civilized society.

Maybe I should go around looking down my nose at everyone from Australia because a good deal of them have murderers and thieves in their family histories ... Australia was a prison colony. (that would be stupid, wouldn't it?)

Maybe I should go around looking down my nose at everyone from England because a good deal of them have murderers and religious prosecutors in their family histories .... (both Catholic and Protestant). (that would be stupid, wouldn't it?)

To say that Jerusalem is eternally bad because of events from thousands of years ago is :shk:

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

Ah .. okay ... just Revelation. I don't buy it being from God.

Then don't expect me to first convince you that it is.

- I never expected you to try.
- You couldn't convince me anyways.

reply to post by FlyersFan


I'm talking about Biblical prophecy here.
The Bible is telling me that a certain city will be punished in the future because it called prophets.
The Bible also tells me that Jesus accused Jerusalem of killing prophets.

What do you have to say about this? No wait, you said you don't even believe the text of The Book of Revelation.So it doesn't matter.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
The Bible is telling me that a certain city will be punished in the future because it called prophets.
The Bible also tells me that Jesus accused Jerusalem of killing prophets.

Thousands of years ago, Jerusalem killed some prophets. For a loving God to punish a city thousands of years later because of the actions that took place there thousands of years earlier .. that makes no sense. It's an absurd thing to do. It's not a very 'Godly' thing to do. To call Jerusalem eternally bad because of the actions of a few from thousands of years ago .... that's a nutty thing for God to supposedly do.

If the innocent people of Jerusalem of today are going to be punished for the crimes of a few people who lived there thousands of years ago ... then every country on the planet had better watch out. Through thousands of years, probably every city in the world has had people who have killed 'holy people'. Good holy Christians mass murdered at the hands of Muslim invaders .... Good Catholics in England mass murdered by Protestants ... Good Protestants mass murdered by Catholics throughout Europe ... Heck, why not squash the city that St. John of the Cross was held prisoner in and tortured in hundreds of years ago. A very holy man ... a visionary ... a saint .... so I guess God should squash that town because of the actions of a few people hundreds of years ago.

Can't you see how that doesn't make any sense?
And why would you want to worship a whackadoo god that would do that kind of thing?

What do you have to say about this? No wait, you said you don't even believe the text of The Book of Revelation.So it doesn't matter.

Nope. I don't buy that Revelation is from God. I can discuss what's in it because I know what's in it. But as far as being from God?? Naaaaaah.

reply to post by logical7

More likely they would believe the Anti-Christ to be their messiah and its stupid to think that AC will rule over and get accepted by a righteous and godly israel more likely that a corrupt, greedy, fornicating group would follow the AC at least till Jesus pbuh returns and kills the AC.

Many of the Israelites converted to Christianity and Islam.
Those who rejected both Jesus and Mohammad are the ones who remained Jews. They will be the ones welcoming the AC as their leader when he arrives, because they rejected the messiah... that too when he appeared exclusively to them. Jewish Israel OPENLY hates Jesus more than any other religious figure. How do you suppose it would end for them? How could the Christians who claim to love Jesus support the very people who insult Jesus?

reply to post by FlyersFan

Thinking that Jerusalem is somehow
eternally 'bad' because of the behavior
of ignorant peasants who lived there
thousands of years ago is really, really
DUMB. The people there now are not
those who did the killing and they reject that kind of behavior.
Thinking that Jerusalem is eternally
bad and damned because of things
that happened there thousands of
years ago is a prime example of why
people think religions/religious
people are backwards and that they have no place in civilized society.

I don't think that the present Jerusalem/israel is bad because of the sins of their ancestors.(you seem to be a person who would deny original sin and all theology based on it by the same arguement)
Its more because the people now continue to walk in the wrong footsteps of their forefathers. Still denying Jesus pbuh as Messiah, not obeying God's commandments, not upholding Mosaic law or twisting it to fit their greed, taking interest etc etc.

For you, prostitution, fornication, racism, homosexuality etc may not be so wrong or sinful anymore but i guess God does not judge the same way.
Do you think God's blessings would decend on Tel Aviv when they run prostitution openly and bring girls from russia, ukraine etc to work there?
If UN legalizes it. Do you think God would agree with UN
even israeli citizens are not exempt from the injustices done on them by their government.
I do not believe that all israelis or all jews are bad but if someone says that the entity in power which runs israel is Godly or righteous then i would just laugh till my sides hurt

Originally posted by logical7
Its more because the people now continue to walk in the wrong footsteps of their forefathers. Still denying Jesus pbuh as Messiah, not obeying God's commandments, not upholding Mosaic law or twisting it to fit their greed, taking interest etc etc.

Jerusalem isn't 'walking in the footsteps of their forefathers' murdering prophets. And as far as not following God's commands ... geeeeze ... no one can agree what God's commands are (or if there are any). As far as 2 billion christians are concerned .. Muslims aren't following God's commands. As far as 1 billion Muslims are concerned, all non-muslims are not following Gods commands. It's ridiculous.

Jerusalem isn't any better or any worse than any other civilized city on the planet.

And yes, your buddy Skorpion said that God was punishing Jerusalem because, thousands of years ago, a few people in that city killed a few prophets. See his quote here ....

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
The Bible is telling me that a certain city will be punished in the future because it called prophets.
The Bible also tells me that Jesus accused Jerusalem of killing prophets.

It's things like this that prove that God didn't write Revelation.
It's not what a loving and just God would do.
Either that or God did write Revelation ... and he's a real SOB.
It's one or the other ...