The Trouble With The USA And WW3

It is sentiments like yours and others around the world that make me question the sanity of our President in going against the wishes of 99.9% of the American people.

Here is what I wrote Obama today:

PLEASE do NOT attack Syria. It is clear from Russia's and Iran's response that it WILL trigger a major war. Is the killing of millions really worth "saving face"?
Our troops are war weary, we already can't fund another war and how can you even consider letting our troops be mercenaries for some middle eastern country? Now it looks like you are even afraid to hear from congress as it is being considered to drop the vote on the issue. It is quite clear from the calls and messages from the American people that 99.9% of the American people OPPOSE getting involved in a 3 year old civil war. I question the sanity of considering going ahead with this in the face of Russia and Iran threatening to get involved and the ENTIRE world saying don't do it!

reply to post by Wirral Bagpuss


Your premise is wrong!

It has never stopped the UK from going to war when ever
it pleases (Apart from this time)..
and it wasn't for the want of trying either.

Blah blah blah...America is the devil..The CIANSAFBI killed every caveman and dinosaur everywhere. As if every country on the planet doesn't have evil, horrible, corrupt people , companies or elements of its Govt. Nope in ATS world it's only here.

Probably a good reason why the mainland US, in it's current configuration, has never and most likely never will be successfully invaded from another country. Basic military tactics and geography essentially eliminate that as a threat as much as people like you wish it would happen.

I am not saying that the American Govt couldnt create some domestic scenario, not saying a nuclearbiochem attack couldnt happen but their is as much a chance of a ground force successfully invading and occupying the mainland as their is of me winning a billion dollars.

All that being said, I see 100% no reason for us to be embroiled in yet another scenario in Syria. You could make a case, no matter how thin, for the more recent wars but this one I still haven't found a good reason yet.

Originally posted by peck420
For whatever it is worth, Americans posting pictures or counts of their dead soldiers, does nothing but prove the OP's point, and that is rather disgusting.

There is no American alive that has had to abandon their US house to run for their lives from an invading army. None have had to wonder if their family down the street will be lucky enough to survive, or if there will be food at the grocery store (or even a grocery store) tomorrow.

None have felt the blast of air horns followed by the ground shaking from their bedrooms.

None have looked out side, after cowering in their basement, in fear, for hours on end, to find their neighbourhood gone.

There is a very, very big difference between sending soldiers to a war and having a war fought on your land.

If none of you can see that, then the OP is 100% correct about American arrogance.

I still wouldn't wish that upon you though, I wouldn't wish it upon anybody.

edit on 6-9-2013 by peck420 because: (no reason given)

Yes we so arrogant we pretty much saved the world twice on the soil of other countries so they did not have to live the way you describe. If we have not sufficiently she'd enough blood for you, we'll that's just to damn bad. Maybe if you stopped cowering in your basement and came out and fight for your freedom things might be different for you. Maybe not, it might be time to find a new country where you can find what you're looking for. I know I would.

It is what you guys don't seem to get, we had our civil war, we had our war for independence, we been there done that and we been shedding our blood in godforsaken chit hole countries all over the world trying to help people have freedom ever since. If we had not you would be speaking Germany, Japanese, or Italian right now my arrogant friend.

Getting pretty tired of all this BS about america.

The Bot

Originally posted by Wirral Bagpuss
Lets face it the USA has never been attacked in war on the mainland. Many Americans wont know where Syria is located on the map. And many have never even visited places outside their own boarders. So frankly Obama rattling his saber and threatening ww3 is doubling sickening. Americans don't know what war is. They have never experienced it first hand. Europe and many parts of the world have.

I don't wish war on anyone but maybe the USA needs a taste of what it is like to be bombed in order to wipe out the arrogance that is all to evident in their political system today? I don't mean like 9/11. And frankly the way Obama is behaving now, that might happen sooner rather than later. If a country has known war and suffered through war then it might not be willing so much to go to war as often as the USA have done in the last twenty years or so.

You do understand that after two worlds wars in which hundreds of millions died in the course in less than 10 years of fighting that the US decided is was better to fight a bunch small conflicts early and some place else instead of letting things go to the point we under direct threat in a global war. You take every war the US had any part in since WW2 and those killed can are not even a drop in the bucker compared to either of those wars. So yes these wars are in the US best interests. The ironic part is because of fear of US inveration and complete military supremecy that the amount of wars and the amount of people killed in war is at it smallest in known history, So suprise you live in the most peaceful time in human history so you can stop all the hyperbole.

Originally posted by dlbott

Originally posted by peck420
For whatever it is worth, Americans posting pictures or counts of their dead soldiers, does nothing but prove the OP's point, and that is rather disgusting.

There is no American alive that has had to abandon their US house to run for their lives from an invading army. None have had to wonder if their family down the street will be lucky enough to survive, or if there will be food at the grocery store (or even a grocery store) tomorrow.

None have felt the blast of air horns followed by the ground shaking from their bedrooms.

None have looked out side, after cowering in their basement, in fear, for hours on end, to find their neighbourhood gone.

There is a very, very big difference between sending soldiers to a war and having a war fought on your land.

If none of you can see that, then the OP is 100% correct about American arrogance.

I still wouldn't wish that upon you though, I wouldn't wish it upon anybody.

edit on 6-9-2013 by peck420 because: (no reason given)

If we had not you would be speaking Germany, Japanese, or Italian right now.

No, we wouldn't.
If Hitler hadn't turned against The Soviet Union then maybe we would be.

reply to post by SLAYER69

You mention WW-II, Korea and Vietnam but leave out Afghanistan and Iraq. Checks the year *2013, Latest round of Crap started back in 2002...

No s*** Sherlock.

WWII left 58 million people dead alone. Comparatively speaking, Iraq and Afghanistan were picnics. Sorry about your little wars. The US is on the brink... If the US keeps it up, they will find out about bigger ones.

Thats what I am talking about.

ETA: America was responsible for making those wars in The Middle East too.

Originally posted by intrptr
If the US keeps it up, they will find out about bigger ones.

What "bigger ones", if I may ask?





The ones perpetrated on ATS?

reply to post by dlbott

Yes we so arrogant we pretty much saved the world twice on the soil of other countries so they did not have to live the way you describe.

You obviously have no idea just how that one statement confirms your arrogance in the eyes of most non-Americans.
It is also a massive insult to the millions of non-US forces who fought against The Axis.

And on top of that it's also incorrect.

I assure you, I respect and admire those US military personnel who served in WWII and appreciate their efforts to help defeat a common enemy but please don't try and spin it as some sort of altruistic gesture to 'help' anyone.
The fact is that until Pearl Harbour and then Germany's subsequent declaration of war on the USA the US was more than happy sitting on the fence and supplying both sides and making a shed load of money doing so. Until these two events public opinion was overwhelmingly against any US involvement in WWII - but matters were taken out of their hands.

If we have not sufficiently she'd enough blood for you, we'll that's just to damn bad.

Enough bloods been spilt full stop, regardless of nationality.

Maybe if you stopped cowering in your basement and came out and fight for your freedom things might be different for you.

Are you seriously trying to imply that the UK is somehow scared to fight?

It is what you guys don't seem to get, we had our civil war, we had our war for independence,....

Yip, exactly the same as almost every nation on earth, in this as in most things the US is not unique - and it's hardly something to be proud of, in fact it's a pretty damning indictment of mankind as a whole.

.....we been there done that and we been shedding our blood in godforsaken chit hole countries all over the world trying to help people have freedom ever since.

Ditto - and enough is enough.
And something you seem to be unwilling to understand; as much as 'we' in 'the west', (and I deliberately say 'we' because the USA is by no means unique in valuing the principles of 'freedom' and 'democracy'), feel strongly about 'freedom' many people in other parts of the world for one reason or another don't want the 'freedom' we seem to continually want to impose upon them, often by force.

If we had not you would be speaking Germany, Japanese, or Italian right now my arrogant friend.

Do you honestly believe that nonsense?

Getting pretty tired of all this BS about america.

And don't you think that we in the UK and other parts of the world aren't sick of the BS being spouted about us?

I don't agree with a lot of the anti-US hysteria and propaganda that goes on here at ATS and in the 'real world', I certainly don't want to see the US being bombed and innocent civilians dying and I firmly believe that everyday Americans are just the same as everyday people the world over with the same cares and concerns - but this whole 'America is the greatest nation', the veneration and idolisation of The Constitution and associated bollocks really makes me want to vomit - sorry if I've offended but it's true.

reply to post by Wirral Bagpuss


That's not entirely true, WWII was fought in small part on Alaskan soil, we still have a couple of the combat veterans alive today. We may not have been technically a state then, but we were a territory, and native people fought alongside US troops. Without the know how of the native garrison many more of our troops would have died. As it stood the Japanese were about as well equipped for such a remote location as the US troops, and lost.

As an American, I don't think we need to be bombing anyone, I surely don't want them bombing us. Just because our government doesn't listen to us doesn't mean we deserve harm.

Oh, and don't forget Pearl Harbor either.

Ok, I caught myself, these are not mainland battles, but I still can't believe you said we deserve to be bombed.....

Originally posted by sonnny1

Originally posted by intrptr
If the US keeps it up, they will find out about bigger ones.

What "bigger ones", if I may ask?

Heres a post from a concurrent thread:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

To answer your question the war where all the kids in the class rise up and beat down the bully.

Originally posted by intrptr


To answer your question the war where all the kids in the class rise up and beat down the bully.

I know your hoping and praying for that.






You really dont care about peace, or innocent victims in the end.. As long as your brand of justice prevails.

Sad. And No better then the "bully" you hate.

My grandfather fought in Guadalcanal and caught Dengue fever, and fought off sickness and PTSD for the rest of his life. He would come up with fevers of unknown origin, for many years after. As a child I sat and listened to him talk about his war time, and he would cry sometimes about the men he watched die. He never got over it.... and took the pain of war with him to his grave.

My grandmother talked about the terror she felt after Pearl Harbor, and how she worried every night the Japanese would come back and bomb them all.

My Uncle fought in Vietnam, and when he came back he was an alcoholic the rest of his life who was depressed and sick all of the time. he watched his friend get blown up before his eyes.

My cousin fought in Fallujah.

Now, I don't know what war is like on our soil, since I have not lived it... but I guarantee my family does. I hope and pray that war never breaks out on U.S. soil. Americans are not weaklings or cowards. If something happens, we will fight, and many of us will survive.

Just as I do not agree with what my president is doing, there are people in Iran, and other countries who do not agree with their leaders either, and do not want war.

All of the blood thirsty leaders who want war and destruction should all meet up in some arena and hash it out there, and do all the fighting. Bet there wouldn't be so many conflicts then.

Originally posted by sonnny1

Originally posted by intrptr


To answer your question the war where all the kids in the class rise up and beat down the bully.

I know your hoping and praying for that.

You really dont care about peace, or innocent victims in the end.. As long as your brand of justice prevails.

Sad. And No better then the "bully" you hate.

Thank you kindly not to put me in the same lot as tyrannical governments. I haven't killed anybody.

And the bully gets what they deserve. I don't know if you live in America. Don't you know the US government is a bully? Picking on little countries with the most advanced military in the world?

Sadder, if you don't see that...

Originally posted by intrptr


Thank you kindly not to put me in the same lot as tyrannical governments. I haven't killed anybody.

But you WANT Justice. A brand of Justice that has no boundaries. A brand of Justice that gives the "bully" his just rewards. A justice that would blanket the innocent too. You become what you hate.

That all comes with a price brother. You dont have to be a murderer to stand guard in front of a Concentration Camp and not be complicit.

And Yes. America has blood on its hands. But if America is going to be held for crimes on Humanity, Humanity also has to be held accountable for letting it happen. Other Countries also. EVERYONE.

All I can hope for is Peace, and an end to this ridiculous bloodshed.

Originally posted by peck420
I would reply individually, but why waste my time, since not one of you read past the first line.

If you think anything in current America compares to what a warn torn country is like, you are dumber then your stereotypes...and that is not sad, it is beyond sad, it is brutal.

Call me when any of you have had to go to a freshly bombed location and rebuild...then you will see what true suffering is.

Call me when you watch innocents choose to kill themselves when they see what is left of their families and homes, and they decide that rebuilding is not worth it.

You think war is ugly? War is nothing compared to what is left. The desolation, the desperation, the hopelessness.

Experience: Kosovo, Afghanistan, Iraq, Lebanon, etc....construction.

Listen, I'm an American and I can move past my ego and pride to recognize that what you say is truth. It's certainly not sunshine and rainbows everywhere in America but your point is taken. As the only "Super Power" of the 20th century we did the ass kicking. I remember growing up with such a false sense of security (USA USA) and even today it's easy to take things for granted. As you have seen above, many people respond here laughing at the thought of invasion which makes me wonder how the Germans felt before they got theirs handed to them.

As they say Pride goes before the fall. Does that mean our time is up? As an American i can't stand what my country does in my name but I promise you, you invade my country and threaten my family? Pack a tent, a lunch and a flashlight cause you're going to be here a long while.

To the OP, your thread is hands down the worst and most despicable I've seen to date. If you don't already, I'd suggest submitting an application to government, you share the same mentality.

the problem the usa has is that the world knows its plan!

Originally posted by sonnny1

And Yes. America has blood on its hands. But if America is going to held for crimes on Humanity, Humanity also has to be held accountable for letting it happen. Other Countries also. EVERYONE.

All I can hope for is Peace, and an end to this ridiculous bloodshed.

Amen brother

Originally posted by MrSpad

You do understand that after two worlds wars in which hundreds of millions died in the course in less than 10 years of fighting that the US decided is was better to fight a bunch small conflicts early and some place else instead of letting things go to the point we under direct threat in a global war.

And that has thus far been the great tragedy that is mankind. To attack, murder and maim in the name of self-defense for future crimes they were likely to commit. If not, well no matter, problems gone either way.

Humankind has shown to be a tragedy of obscene proportions dating back to the beginning of written word. To a degree I'm Almost convinced that there is no other possibility that this really is a prison planet. Dum, dum, dummmmm.

Originally posted by woodwardjnr
Americans have plenty of experience of War, that's why their public are dead set against any intervention in Syria. Unfortunately Obomber, got his red pen and started drawing lines, then claimed it was the world that drew the red line and not him, forcing his own hand.

I also don't believe this is going to be ww3 any more than any other regional war we have witnessed in recent decades. It's in no ones interest to start lobbing nuclear weapons around. The USA know that, Russia know that and so do China.

I think people are getting way too paranoid about WW3.

I think the original poster is correct,youve never been bombed except for a few civil war cannons in a couple of citys in the 1860s,youve never rationed anything and youve not had war planes dropping bombs on new york.
As for people getting paranoid about WW3,it only took some archduke getting killed to start ww1 and kill millions.We can out nuke you mentallity is madness.Once a world war begins whos to say it wont end up with nukes flying? Hitler in WW2 fought to the end.The end in WW3 is no USA /Europe/Russia/China and anywhere else wont be worth surving in due to radiation and fallout.
If you want to have a UN you should abide by its ruling.Perhaps you could scrap Vetos and go majority,but the us wont go for that because it would mean they couldnt veto everything about Israel.Pot and kettle.Hypocracy is King.Torture and guantanimo bay,secret trials...........Preach what you practice perhaps.
The American people are your normal folks,the corrupt media and politician,war machine and arms companys.nsa and the cia call the shots............sorry i felt like a rant XX